Manual transmission rare?

Manual

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I only pay attention to the EX-T sedan manuals, but it looks like they are slowing down production on those. Not rocket science, but using cars.com and autotrader.com as a guide, the inventory has been in the low 100's for several months and has now dipped well below for the first time that I've seen. This morning was at 82. The other factor is the email updates with new EX-T sedan manual inventory has gone nearly dead the last 2 weeks. Each email used to be like 5-8 new cars. Now when an email update arrives, it's 2 cars at most. Usually 1. And the email updates are few and far between now. This could be due to many reasons. But I've been watching for several months and it's been relatively the same until the last 2 or 3 weeks.

When do 2018's start coming out?
I don't follow this (production) stuff much at all, .. but I'm wondering if it's just that hard to get the manual transmissions because they are in such high demand world wide, and the American MT market isn't strong enough to justify the logistics. (the manual transmissions ship from India, I believe)

I haven't read anything, but can't help but wonder if there's a LOT of euro diesel drivers (mt) who will now make the switch to the 1.5 6mt.

Also, I sure hope Honda US doesn't decide to stop selling the manual sedans here in order to push the sales over to a more profitable Si.



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RetroJR

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I don't follow this (production) stuff much at all, .. but I'm wondering if it's just that hard to get the manual transmissions because they are in such high demand world wide, and the American MT market isn't strong enough to justify the logistics. (the manual transmissions ship from India, I believe)

I haven't read anything, but can't help but wonder if there's a LOT of euro diesel drivers (mt) who will now make the switch to the 1.5 6mt.

Also, I sure hope Honda US doesn't decide to stop selling the manual sedans here in order to push the sales over to a more profitable Si.

It really does make you wonder what the real story is. Dealers have tried to tell me it is because of declining demand for manuals here. Maybe to some extent , that is true, but clearly Honda is not striking the right balance since there are not nearly enough to go around.

Maybe the Si will change that. I guess time will tell.

I was lucky enough to intercept a manual in transit to a dealer using cars.com after my initial order was canceled due to aforementioned "Dealer Allocation" issues.
I am so glad I did. :drive:
 

360glitch

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Every dealer I talked to said the same thing that you guys have heard, they try to avoid the standard transmissions because they "don't move". Obviously not the case for the hatchback though. I was able to score a pretty good deal on this "undesirable" car. When Honda delivered it my salesperson said the other salespeople were all over it because they knew there was a demand. Maybe Honda will take note for 2018 production.
 

1.5CivicEX-T

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When Honda delivered it my salesperson said the other salespeople were all over it because they knew there was a demand. Maybe Honda will take note for 2018 production.
That is part of their job, and they have it down to a science so we'll see if they adjust production for the 2018 model. While every dealer isn't on cars.com or autotrader.com, it is a gauge of what's out there. And hatchback wise w/manual, under 100 right now. So even if those websites list half of what's available nationwide, that's 200 manual hatchbacks. For the entire country. That is very few to say the least.

I remember going to a NC dealer on my way up to DC in later 2015. They had a Civic coupe manual I kept my eye on. When I arrived it had sold a few days earlier. Talked to the salesperson and he said "we just gave it away" it was on the lot so damn long. Over a year I believe. He said the dealer would never order another manual again as they just sit. That was before the 1.5 turbo engine came out.........

I believe the manual is slightly in more demand solely because of this engine and will adjust production accordingly over time. The dealers in my area are milking the low manual inventory and charging more for the manual than the CVT. By $500-$800 or more from all of my email quotes. While the car itself is actually $800 less than the CVT. The dealers have to enjoy that additional profit. But it could quickly go away if too many are out there and they once again just sit. Then it's a buyers market.





 
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Shankmeyster

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It's always a buyers market if you have a few different honda stores in your area. Here we have 10+ around town it seems. So if one doesn't give me what I want I just go to the next.
 

Froz3nTundra

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I just got my 6MT Sport Hatchback, I had orders at a couple of dealers, one of them was able to trade allocation to get it. Took about 10 weeks total from order to receipt. The cars are coming across in batches, the day I picked mine up I checked cars.com and there were 6 new Aegean Blue 6MT Sports on the east coast same day mine came.

I was told 1% of the US cars are coming in as manuals, I paid MSRP out the door for mine, not great but could have been worse.
 

jdmk20akid

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I work in sales at a Honda dealership in Columbia, SC. I've been working there for a little over 4 years now so I've come accustom to Honda's production habits. I can honestly say that Honda previously had a build rate of like 1.5%-2.5% for the manual transmission equipped civics in the 9th gen. It wasn't much at all, very weird to come across one.

I think Honda knows that most of the manual transmission buyers out there are reserved for the Si buyers, and CTR buyers. BUT I wouldn't be surprised if Honda ramps up the production just a tad on manual transmission (in my opinion the Sport Hatchback would see most of the production increase) for the 2018 model year. Only because these manuals are selling relatively quick and yes, they are more profitable because of their demand. You can't blame dealerships for sticking to there guns and staying near or at MSRP for a low supply and high demand configuration. People seem to forget that dealerships are a retail store.

But I would say that I think that they are coming in waves as far as assembly. We will get one or two at a time that are on the same delivery truck, then won't have another truck of any manuals for the next 5 or 6 deliveries.

So from my personal experiences at my dealership (mid volume)..

- Yes, the manuals have a MUCH lower build rate than CVTs currently, and aren't very available (at least in the Southeast region)
- Yes, dealerships understand that they are higher demand, and low supply. Most are charging very close to MSRP if not just a few hundred dollars off. (Sport Hatchbacks being the most sought after)
- I think we could potentially see a SMALL increase in production rate for 2018 models, making them slightly more available, but I don't know that for sure. I think that Si sales could impact that some what as well, especially if Honda prices the Si too high and people continue to seek out the other lower trim levels in a manual.
 

spock_here

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Yeah, just not around, only one manual in the entire state here and it is lx version. I drove it day after it arrived and figured it would sell that week. Dealer contacted me yesterday and made their best offer, 500 below msrp after one week on lot. Still too much for me but a fair deal in the current imbalanced supply chain. At 20k+- you can pick up the lx accord manual as much more available and has the proven 2.4 with smooth shifting japanese transmission. Same problem though, the sport accord is a very nice buy for price point but you cannot find the 6mt anywhere--tons of cvts but no manuals. End of the era I guess.
 

1.5CivicEX-T

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Only because these manuals are selling relatively quick and yes, they are more profitable because of their demand. You can't blame dealerships for sticking to there guns and staying near or at MSRP for a low supply and high demand configuration. People seem to forget that dealerships are a retail store.
Can't blame them, just won't buy one with the "manual markup". From my email quotes, that's a $1300-$1600 or more swing (Profit) in favor of the dealer over the CVT for an EX-T. I just can't do that. I wouldn't try to beat them down in negotiations (doesn't really work with Honda's anyhoo) or anything like that, but won't ever pay that high a surcharge for a manual EX-T.

No doubt the EX-T manuals are selling though. The few that I was interested in around the DC area have sold rather quickly after hitting the lots. Sans a silver one, which is either way overpriced or has demo miles or something as it's been there for months. No other EX-T manuals stay more than a few weeks. It's easy to keep track with so few around.

So yes good for the dealers I guess for getting the price they want. Just keeps me from buying my first Honda with that markup. Hopefully 2018's do bring more manuals and maybe lower prices. Not asking for Ford or Hyundai like discounts here. Just equal discounts to the CVT's.
 

shire123

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Yeah, just not around, only one manual in the entire state here and it is lx version. I drove it day after it arrived and figured it would sell that week. Dealer contacted me yesterday and made their best offer, 500 below msrp after one week on lot. Still too much for me but a fair deal in the current imbalanced supply chain. At 20k+- you can pick up the lx accord manual as much more available and has the proven 2.4 with smooth shifting japanese transmission. Same problem though, the sport accord is a very nice buy for price point but you cannot find the 6mt anywhere--tons of cvts but no manuals. End of the era I guess.
Don't give up hope yet. For 2017 Honda actually increased the number of MT Civics. IN 2016 only the LX had MT. This year they added the EXT. And then there is the Si coming out shortly. With the rest of the world using more MT's than automatics/CVT's it's just he US that is lagging behind.
 

1.5CivicEX-T

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Don't give up hope yet. For 2017 Honda actually increased the number of MT Civics. IN 2016 only the LX had MT. This year they added the EXT. And then there is the Si coming out shortly. With the rest of the world using more MT's than automatics/CVT's it's just he US that is lagging behind.
Wouldn't a 2018 Civic Touring with manual be nice..............
 

1.5CivicEX-T

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You can get them in England right now. That would have been my dream car.
I'm new to the Honda world. Does the fact this combo is available in England give us any hope it may come to the US? Or do they get the neat stuff while we miss out? (The case for a lot of other manufacturers)
 

shire123

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I'm new to the Honda world. Does the fact this combo is available in England give us any hope it may come to the US? Or do they get the neat stuff while we miss out? (The case for a lot of other manufacturers)
Nope. MT cars in many trims have always been available in Europe. It's the US were the availability has been decreasing. And I guess that will continue. If you don't build them, people don't buy them. And if you build them in very small quantities so that they are hard to find then people get frustrated and go with something else. It's sort of a vicious cycle for the US market. Plus I believe it's more profitable for the company to build CVT's. They cost more up front and somewhere down the road they are going to need to be replaced. Replacement isn't an issue if you keep your car for 5-8 years. But for those of us who keep our cars for a long time it's an issue. I don't want my cars to die because of a transmission failure.
 

BarracksSi

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Wouldn't a 2018 Civic Touring with manual be nice..............
It would, but then again, half of the tricks the Touring can pull off (mainly the driver assist systems) can't be done with a manual, either. But yeah, it would be nice to have all the other stuff -- leather, LEDs, nicer trim, etc -- with a manual.
 

                           

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