VSA long push vs Pedal dance for FK8

[Dave B]

I know there has been some debate on whether the long push VSA truly disables all of the nannies vs the pedal dance that does. My own experience is that the short push doesn't do much and overheats the rear brakes whereas the long push doesn't do this at all so my assumption is that any use of long push in +R mode doesn't leave much yaw control by the rear brake.

I was happy enough with the long push VSA but recently went to a tight, relatively slow but busy track that was new to me with my 2020 Type R. The curbs were pretty high and the elevation changes were significant with the net effect that with the long push VSA in +R mode, the shock settings were too stiff. I would have preferred them softer. Not sure if Sport mode would have been soft enough and might potentially need comfort mode. I gather the FL5 allows you to set these individually.

What do you usually run with,, long push or pedal dance ? Please note that I cannot change shocks to allow for individual adjustment.

BTW, with the pedal dance, does the dash light flash for the whole time?

Also does the pedal dance work in Comfort mode and how much softer are the shocks in Sport mode vs +R mode?

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[MadMage]

Opinions vary, but I never use the pedal dance. It does more than just VSA and I'm told from folks I trust that it should only ever be used on the Dyno and for specific maintenance tasks. Never on the track.

VSA fully off (long press) will only engage when the car detects loss of control, i.e. a full spin.

Neither effects suspension. +R mode does impact suspension, but you can't run VSA Fully Off unless you are in +R.

Yes the FL5 has the ability to customize the modes, but not sure the limits of it.

 

[keller]

Not sure if Sport mode would have been soft enough and might potentially need comfort mode. I gather the FL5 allows you to set these individually.

The FL5 allows you to set a different setting for each subsystem (eg comfort suspension and +R steering wheel), but it's not what you seem to be after. This "individual mode" is somewhat useless at the track, as the "long press" fully off VSA mode still only exists in +R mode. That is, a FL5 can't adjust the suspension and turn off the assists! It's even worse for them, because their suspension is a lot stiffer so most tracks now require comfort or sport suspension. They need to use the pedal dance and that's what some owners have been doing.

The pedal dance is our only way to disable the assists while on any mode other than +R. It works in Comfort mode too. Note the pedal dance also disables the agile handing assist, which the long press does not.

BTW, with the pedal dance, does the dash light flash for the whole time?

I believe you can acknowledge and hide those messages just like any other message on the instrument gauge. Have you tried using the information button on the left side of the steering wheel?

 

[Dave B]

I'm told from folks I trust that it should only ever be used on the Dyno and for specific maintenance tasks. Never on the track.

I wonder why. It implies that it is still active even with the long push VSA

 

[MadMage]

I wonder why. It implies that it is still active even with the long push VSA

It is still active with Fully Off, but it's programmed not to engaged as often in the other modes.

But if you goal is to change suspension, then I think you need to go Hondata with a custom tune. You should be able to change the suspension modes with Hondata while maintaining +R mode and its throttle response and ability to go Fully Off.

But, I don't have a Hondata, so I could be wrong.

 

[Dave B]

On most tracks, I am happy with the shocks at the stiffer setting of +R mode. OTOH, at the track I mentioned, I think the car was too stiff over all the curbs etc.

Wonder if the pedal dance works in comfort mode.

 

[MadMage]

Wonder if the pedal dance works in comfort mode.

Yes it does.

 

[Dave B]

I have tracked a few rear drive cars with single adjustable shocks and was amazed at how soft I could get the rear and still feel the car was under control. Fronts never went much over 65% stiff. Now with this front driver, I would like to keep the front pretty soft but not the rear. Unfortunately in the time attack series I run, changing shocks will penalize me somewhat. Certainly I need to stiffen the rear compared to the front, so maybe a bigger rear sway bar will help with softer overall settings although enough to keep the rear under control.

 

[REDRAGN]

Finally used the pedal dance at GTA Rd Atl this year...I personally like it as it disables everything and allows for the previously mentioned suspension mode selection.

I'd say its a user preference thing, but I don't want any nannies at all when I'm racing...but, I can definitely see where some folks would like the security of them in the background!

 

[Dave B]

REDRAGN, What mode did you compete in?

I have read elsewhere that with long push VSA, the rear brakes may be activated in corners over 80 MPH. Not sure if this is true.

Ideally I would like to keep the front only moderately damped and the rear stiffer but with an FK8 we don't have that option unless changing to non OEM shocks.

 

[MadMage]

Well, minimal canyon driving and almost all my track driving is with VSA Fully Off. I go thorugh ~3 sets of front pads for every set of rears. Tells me my rears are not being used much. No idea how much, but not much.

 

[Dave B]

Yes it does.

How did you get it to work? When I try it, even when starting the pedal dance in comfort mode, the car reverts to Sport mode and tells me that mode change is "not available"

Near my house the local municipality has seen it fit to add a bunch of speed bumps on a suburban street and considering they are quite consistent, it is a great place to check out the shock settings in different modes. Seems that Sport mode is significantly softer than +R and would likely suit my purposes so next time at the track, I will have to try the pedal dance.

A bit off topic, what else changes in Sport vs +R other than the imported noise? Steering seemed to give a bit less feed back but not aware of other things happening.

 

[NapalmEnema]

Tried to talk a buddy of mine into a Type R but he's convinced it can't be reliably run at the track even with cooling mitigations lol.

 

[MadMage]

How did you get it to work? When I try it, even when starting the pedal dance in comfort mode, the car reverts to Sport mode and tells me that mode change is "not available"

Maybe it can't. I should have said I've heard others say it can. The only time my car has had the pedal dance done is on the dyno.

A bit off topic, what else changes in Sport vs +R other than the imported noise? Steering seemed to give a bit less feed back but not aware of other things happening.

Throttle response. And with a phillips screw driver and 10 minutes you can disconnect that imported noise. First 'mod' I did on my car.

Tried to talk a buddy of mine into a Type R but he's convinced it can't be reliably run at the track even with cooling mitigations lol.

That opinion seems to exist on these boards. So not surprising. I will re-iterate, my stock power '20 doesn't have overheating issues in Arizona. And no, I'm not the slowest FK8 on the track. Though I don't track in the summer.

 

[Dave B]

Well, if anything I am too aggressive with the throttle so maybe a more muted response in Sport mod won't hurt as long as it gets to the same WOT position.

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