How in the heck is this car totaled??? I am getting scammed

[chicubfn]

Don't forget to ask for diminished value on repairable vehicles that aren't your fault.

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[Julie1012]

Don't forget to ask for diminished value on repairable vehicles that aren't your fault.

Yeah, that may be difficult in my case. The girl that hit us didn't have insurance. We'll have to take them to small claims court.

 

[josby]

The $6K he got for his Mustang trade-in should've made GAP insurance unnecessary though.

 

[Bamaaviator]

So having now been able to speak with the insurance company, car repair place, and GAP people, it seems like the end result of this fender bender is this..

According to the numbers they have pulled....

I still owe 29.7k on the car
Apparently I did buy the GAP and Extended warranties and some other unnecessary items and brought the complete total of the car to $34k

Insurance is going to cover $25k for the total minus a $500 deductible. The dealership is going to cancel all the unused portions of the extended warranties, etc and bring the total down to $26k. GAP will pay the remaining $1k. I lose the entire equity I had when I traded in my other car, I get no car and no money back from the insurance company.

I have no idea how I can recover from this by having no car and no way to get to work anymore. I am a complete trainwreck right now.

 

[chicubfn]

So having now been able to speak with the insurance company, car repair place, and GAP people, it seems like the end result of this fender bender is this..

According to the numbers they have pulled....

I still owe 29.7k on the car
Apparently I did buy the GAP and Extended warranties and some other unnecessary items and brought the complete total of the car to $34k

Insurance is going to cover $25k for the total minus a $500 deductible. The dealership is going to cancel all the unused portions of the extended warranties, etc and bring the total down to $26k. GAP will pay the remaining $1k. I lose the entire equity I had when I traded in my other car, I get no car and no money back from the insurance company.

I have no idea how I can recover from this by having no car and no way to get to work anymore. I am a complete trainwreck right now.

Sorry man, good luck. Car accidents are not fun.

 

[inv4zn]

So having now been able to speak with the insurance company, car repair place, and GAP people, it seems like the end result of this fender bender is this..

According to the numbers they have pulled....

I still owe 29.7k on the car
Apparently I did buy the GAP and Extended warranties and some other unnecessary items and brought the complete total of the car to $34k

Insurance is going to cover $25k for the total minus a $500 deductible. The dealership is going to cancel all the unused portions of the extended warranties, etc and bring the total down to $26k. GAP will pay the remaining $1k. I lose the entire equity I had when I traded in my other car, I get no car and no money back from the insurance company.

I have no idea how I can recover from this by having no car and no way to get to work anymore. I am a complete trainwreck right now.

While I understand your frustration, you actually came out quite well.

Let's make this clear, you NEVER HAD ANY EQUITY. You had it when you had your mustang but as soon as you traded it in any equity you had went deeply into the negatives, to the sum of -$29,700. You were upside down to begin with, and should be very grateful dealer snuck in GAP without you even knowing what it is.

You need to get a new car, preferably one that doesn't start with you being $30k in debt this time.

I know this isn't what you want to hear, and get that you're upset, but all things considered you're quite lucky.

 

[Bamaaviator]

I did have equity. They gave me $14k trade in and I only owed $9k. I was never upside down on a trade in. Turns out the final numbers I had included finance charges for the lifetime of the loan. Once all the extra warranties and stuff are out, it brings my pay off to only $26.5k, which is much better than they had stated.

 

[inv4zn]

I did have equity. They gave me $14k trade in and I only owed $9k. I was never upside down on a trade in. Turns out the final numbers I had included finance charges for the lifetime of the loan. Once all the extra warranties and stuff are out, it brings my pay off to only $26.5k, which is much better than they had stated.

...no, you didn't. You would have had equity if you kept your Mustang, but as soon as you bought the Civic, you had none.
You keep coming up with new numbers that don't add up, but whatever, lets go with your latest batch.

They gave you $14K on a Mustang you owed $9K on. That means $5K was applied towards the purchase of your car.

The total bill for your Civic at time of sale, according to you, was $34K. The $5K brings the total amount you financed to $29K.
Your insurance values your car at $25K.

$25K - $29K = NEGATIVE $4K. At the time of the accident, you were upside down. The only reason you emerged rightside up is because the dealer cancelled the warranties that you had bought (unknowingly or not) and that they snuck in GAP.

Again, I reiterate, all things considered, if you didn't have GAP, you would have no car, no money, and would still owe the bank money for a car that was written off. You got out lucky (enough.)

 

[gav007]

It's not fun to be in an accident so I am sorry to hear about your car. I've seen similar accidents to yours as my father slipped in rain with my Honda Accord and ended up with similar damages, while one of my coworkers hit a Truck with his VW Jetta. My Honda Accord was written off since my mechanic advised me that it wasn't worth fixing. On the other hand, my coworker decided to fix his Jetta and it cost 7K, but his car will never be the same. It's better that the car is written off, so you don't end up with numerous repairs later down the road.

 

[Bamaaviator]

...no, you didn't. You would have had equity if you kept your Mustang, but as soon as you bought the Civic, you had none.
You keep coming up with new numbers that don't add up, but whatever, lets go with your latest batch.

They gave you $14K on a Mustang you owed $9K on. That means $5K was applied towards the purchase of your car.

The total bill for your Civic at time of sale, according to you, was $34K. The $5K brings the total amount you financed to $29K.
Your insurance values your car at $25K.

$25K - $29K = NEGATIVE $4K. At the time of the accident, you were upside down. The only reason you emerged rightside up is because the dealer cancelled the warranties that you had bought (unknowingly or not) and that they snuck in GAP.

Again, I reiterate, all things considered, if you didn't have GAP, you would have no car, no money, and would still owe the bank money for a car that was written off. You got out lucky (enough.)

I wont argue with you about numbers that don't add up. They are changing almost on an hourly basis here depending on who you talk to at what time of the day and depending on what side of their head they are holding their cell phone..

Having said that, GAP is not going to do much for me at all as now the difference between the pay off and the GAP is about 1000 dollars, and the GAP cost 800 or so.

My biggest part of frustration in this whole episode is the fact that I had to wait 39 days of getting zero information and having no transportation for half of that time, to finally going down to pick up my car because I was told it would be ready today, and yet its still sitting there in pieces after 40 days. At any point during the process had the insurance company or service shop kept me informed, it wouldn't be so bad. Noticing my windshield being busted got my blood boiling and looking at the electrical connecters that appear to be cut razor thin and precise and they are now saying is responsible for yet another $5000 or so in repairs has my BS meter going off the charts. There is no way remotely imaginable that 3 separate electrical connectors located at 3 separate places on the car were so cleanly severed and resulted in the need to completely strip the car to the frame and rewire it. The cuts in the connectors look so clean that no one can convince me that there were no shenanigans going on to continue to raise the repair bill.....just they raised it so high that the insurance has decided just to total it, which after talking to the insurance guy I believe would be the best thing moving forward at this point.

 

[inv4zn]

I wont argue with you about numbers that don't add up. They are changing almost on an hourly basis here depending on who you talk to at what time of the day and depending on what side of their head they are holding their cell phone..

Having said that, GAP is not going to do much for me at all as now the difference between the pay off and the GAP is about 1000 dollars, and the GAP cost 800 or so.

My biggest part of frustration in this whole episode is the fact that I had to wait 39 days of getting zero information and having no transportation for half of that time, to finally going down to pick up my car because I was told it would be ready today, and yet its still sitting there in pieces after 40 days. At any point during the process had the insurance company or service shop kept me informed, it wouldn't be so bad. Noticing my windshield being busted got my blood boiling and looking at the electrical connecters that appear to be cut razor thin and precise and they are now saying is responsible for yet another $5000 or so in repairs has my BS meter going off the charts. There is no way remotely imaginable that 3 separate electrical connectors located at 3 separate places on the car were so cleanly severed and resulted in the need to completely strip the car to the frame and rewire it. The cuts in the connectors look so clean that no one can convince me that there were no shenanigans going on to continue to raise the repair bill.....just they raised it so high that the insurance has decided just to total it, which after talking to the insurance guy I believe would be the best thing moving forward at this point.

Hmm.

This is another topic entirely, and I do sympathize. The shop that the car was towed to, who was responsible for choosing that shop? Was it the closest one? Insurance specified?

Without knowing much details, it looks like the shop fucked up multiple times, and is raising the price so high so that your insurance just totals it, so they don't get caught for their own shitty work.

If you suspect this, raise hell with your insurance provider. Considering that your car is already severely damaged it's probably better in the long term that it got written off (as other members have said) but at least you can try to hold the shop accountable for what seems like some shady shit.

 

[jausch27]

Claims adjuster here for a major insurance company. To put it bluntly, your car is totaled. Sure, the preliminary estimate may be $14k-$15k, but once they tear it down there will be supplements. The appraiser can't see the extent of the damage underneath what can be seen. The appraiser most likely anticipates that there will be a pretty hefty supplement which would bring it over the total loss threshold. To be honest, I would not want to drive a vehicle that once had $15k worth of damage, totaled or not.

 

[Bamaaviator]

Long post incoming to all relevant information is presented so an answer can be better formulated.

Allow me to ask you this then since you are in the insurance field. Now, these numbers are as I have been told and may be off a few dollars here or there so there may be some sort of discrepancy since the numbers have continued to change repeatedly.

As it stand now, I have been paying insurance for 22 years with no claims and what they are offering at this point leaves me coming away from this wreck with no car whatsoever, and as such, this is not acceptable in my mind.

According to Wells Fargo, I owe 29.7k as a payoff, and they are currently offering 25.5k settlement and let GAP take the rest. After all the dealer extended warranties are removed and all the other prorated stuff that I bought, that drops it another $3.2k to make the pay off 26.5k. They can remove GAP insurance for another 750 removed and make the pay off 25.7k.

As you can see, these totals are almost dead even. However, I had just paid 1k in redoing all the leather interior ( have receipt from dealer, it was less than 2 weeks old prior to wreck ), I had $320 done in tint ( have receipt ) , had custom door sills made in China ( $80, have receipt ), and also had custom interior lights added throughout the car ( $610, have receipt ). This brings up the value of what I had in the car that they didn't account for, bringing the total to $27.8k.

Now, they recommended this place, not me. My car has been down there now 42 days and only on day 39 did they declare it a total. My car was scheduled to be completed on Nov 18th, then Nov 24th, then Dec 2nd, then Dec 9th, and finally on the 9th they said screw it and totaled it out.

According to my insurance policy, I am authorized I rental car at $30 per day, up to 30 days. They only allowed me to have a rental car from Nov 11th to Dec 2nd which was only 20 days, and not 30 as per my policy. They got my car on Nov 4th, and it is now Dec 10. There is a more reputable dealer that has agreed to take the car, because they say there is no way there is that much damage done to my car, and I am authorized a second opinion. This would result in the insurance paying to have it towed and stored at a different yard while their investigation is ongoing as well. An ambulance was dispatched to my accident just in case, and I refused transport and sought, and have no intention at this time, of seeking any medical treatment. This choice saved the insurance company a bunch of money. Ambulance ride to Skyline would have been over $2000.

So...with all this info presented. What I want to do is settle with the insurance company for only $30k, not the $25.5k they are currently offering. Due to the fact they violated my policy with the length of rental car which has caused hardship, the fact I refused an ambulance and sought no medical treatment, the fact I have receipts for an additional 2k in added accessories for the car, is asking $30k too much?

I ask for that so I can cover all losses and have enough left to put a down payment on another car. The difference between what they have to add for my additional losses with all my accessories they haven't covered is only 2500. Since I am authorized a second opinion and have photo evidence that at a minimum they busted my windshield after they took possession, I can easily add another 2500 in tow fees, labor, and storage at the next shop.

I don't think I am asking too much. Do you? They can pay 30k and I get a new car and I will be completely satisfied, or they can pay 30k once another dealer is involved and the case still not be settled and continue to drain their money.

Thank you for any info since you are in the field.

Edit: Either way it goes, the insurance will have to pay $30k or so. One way results in me being satisfied with the result, the other way leads to no one being satisfied and it continuing to cost Geico more.

 

[Bamaaviator]

Claims adjuster here for a major insurance company. To put it bluntly, your car is totaled. Sure, the preliminary estimate may be $14k-$15k, but once they tear it down there will be supplements. The appraiser can't see the extent of the damage underneath what can be seen. The appraiser most likely anticipates that there will be a pretty hefty supplement which would bring it over the total loss threshold. To be honest, I would not want to drive a vehicle that once had $15k worth of damage, totaled or not.

I wouldn't particularly want to drive a car that they said had that much damage either, especially since it is apparent they caused some of the damage themselves. They are already on the 4th supplement. Initial was 4k, then another 3k, then another 6k, and something else just came up that I don't know the total of. This repair shop is bush league. We went down there and they said it was taking so long because they only had 1 mechanic for the 207 cars on the lot and he had called off for 3 days due to being sick anyways. With all this added nonsense that they keep finding in the 23rd hour now 4 weeks in a row, this has left me with no car at all and no way in the near future of being able to obtain another one either. This is not acceptable.

 

[lzaffuto]

Unless you declared the aftermarket equipment with your insurer they are not responsible for giving you anything for it, that is why there is an option to do that on your policy. At best, they may allow you to go pull it off when they total the car. You might have better luck negotiating over the body shop messing things up more or the medical stuff (although if you want a leg to stand on that you need to get to a doctor for an exam immediately). Who was found at fault and issued a ticket for this accident? If the other driver was at fault you have a much better negotiating position. If you were found at fault and it really wasn't your fault you need to go have your day in court. Most of the time rear-ending someone is decided to be at-fault regardless of circumstances at the scene of the accident, but if you can prove the guy pulled out in front of you when you had right-of-way and there was no way to avoid hitting him you might have a case, and at the minimum you will save thousands of dollars over the 5-7 years this would otherwise tarnish your driving record.

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