Tuning for Rookies

[El2ok]

What's going on everyone, so I recently purchased a 2020 Honda Civic Si Sedan. I've had it for almost a month now. I have installed thr PRL Cold Air Intake (Street Series) and a K Tuner 1.5 flash kit. I am currently running the starter: factory settings and Sport mode at 21 psi map. I am also running tunerview on the head unit. Since I'm new to the whole flashing scene, I figured I'd ask the Civic CX community for some pointers. I want to understand the basic fundamentals when it comes to tuning. First thing I was a little worried about was knock control & count. Last night after installing my intake and k tuner flash. I noticed my knock control was at .70 and count was also nearly hitting 75. I live in southern califorinia and running 91 octane unfortunately ‍. I plan to maybe do some future mods such as upgrading the clutch, intercooler and maybe down pipe (but keeping stock exhaust) I'm not a fan of loud exhausts. It's a daily driver so any input would greatly be appreciated! Thank you all in advance!

 

[El2ok]

What is normal/safe knock control percentage and count? I've heard .50 is where knock control is best at.. any opinions would greatly be appreciated!

 

[FC1Dawn]

The most ideal knock control value is 0.49, however, there can be several factors that prohibit us from running at 0.49 consistently. The type of fuel is one of these factors. I am also in California and using 91 octane. When I was running the dual 19.5/21.5 tune, I was getting around a knock count value of mid 0.6's in spirited driving and mid 0.5's in regular driving. I am currently on a TSP Stage 1 tune and after 2 or 3 pulls, I will hit the high 0.7's. Normal driving gets me around the mid 0.5's.

After you installed the intake and KTuner, did you do go wide open throttle?

@KTuner has provided answers regarding knock control count. If I recall correctly, knock control count does not matter too much in this generation, however, if you see a large value count in a short amount of time, that may indicate a problem.

 

[El2ok]

The most ideal knock control value is 0.49, however, there can be several factors that prohibit us from running at 0.49 consistently. The type of fuel is one of these factors. I am also in California and using 91 octane. When I was running the dual 19.5/21.5 tune, I was getting around a knock count value of mid 0.6's in spirited driving and mid 0.5's in regular driving. I am currently on a TSP Stage 1 tune and after 2 or 3 pulls, I will hit the high 0.7's. Normal driving gets me around the mid 0.5's.

After you installed the intake and KTuner, did you do go wide open throttle?

@KTuner has provided answers regarding knock control count. If I recall correctly, knock control count does not matter too much in this generation, however, if you see a large value count in a short amount of time, that may indicate a problem.

Thanks for all the input FC1Dawn, truly appreciate it! As of a matter of fact I was pushing WOT when i first did the tune and cold air intake install... lol. I took the car for a few test runs last night on the same tunes and I noticed that i was able to average knock control about .60 - .65. Then when cruising around I was able to get low .50 -.55. And my total knock count was no higher than 20ish compared to 70 which is when i first was going WOT. I will just make sure to keep an eye on it and not to consistently go WOT even though I know it may be hard at first.. lol. This small adjustment of just the base maps have made a big difference in my opinion and the cold air intake helping with that turbo sound makes it very difficult not to push this bad boy.. haha. I started recording a few data logs last night but i'm just not sure how to read them. I was thinking of doing some research on Youtube to see if I can find any training tutorials on how to understand the data logs.

Quick question if you don't mind me asking. How long have you been running a tune in your car? How are you liking the TSP stage 1 tune? Is it a big difference compared to the Ktuner base maps? I was contemplating on getting the TSP stage one, but with my car being only a few weeks old and only with 1,200 miles on it i wanted to take it slow with just the base maps and understand the cars stats before i jump into the next stage. Also i've read that the stock clutch on this car is not the best.. so I also wanted to wait on doing any more upgrades to the car until I get clutch master setup. Do you use tunerview on your head unit? It took me a while to get it to sync with the k tuner but now its working pretty solid.

One more last question, do you happen to know if they are any tune maps for fuel efficiency? I was wanting to run a tune with low boost but i personally don't wanna touch any of the settings from the base map just yet because i don't know what im doing yet.. lol . So far i've just left a factory stock map as one of my settings when im wanting to save on gas.

Thanks again for all your input brotha! Glad I found this forum to help me with my journey of being a Honda 10th gen owner! Happy new year by the way ! lol

 

[El2ok]

Here's a screenshot of a stock run I did last night. From what I understand with a new car (1,200 miles) I want to say this is good readings? but not sure a new car should have miss fires? Anyone who understands this data would greatly be appreciated for their guidance.

 

[FC1Dawn]

Seems like there is nothing out of the ordinary with that knock control, to me. I was getting similar values to you when I had my KTuner 19.5/21.5 tune in. Data logs are going to be your friend! I have also recorded several data logs, just for research. I keep an eye out for wideband (air fuel ratio) and knock control values. AFR's should be ideally around 14.5 - 15.5, so as close to stoichiometric air-fuel ratio as possible. Under decel, you will see upwards of 20+, which is normal. Under WOT, somewhere between 11 to 12 is good (although I could be wrong about this as it depends on the tune). You will see the value bounce around after you come to a stop but it should level back out to ~14.5.

I have been running KTuner V2 for maybe like 4 weeks? KTuner base maps for 1 week. TSP Stage 1 tune has only been on for 3 weeks. There is a huge difference between the KTuner base maps versus TSP Stage 1 tune. KTuner base maps wake up the car, but the TSP Stage 1 tune turns the Si into something else. A lot more top-end power that feels really smooth. There are a bunch more little things here and there that really make the TSP Stage 1 tune stand out. Highly recommend it! I haven't felt any clutch slip but I am fairly certain that it will happen in the future, our clutches aren't that strong. However, there are some people that have been running the TSP Stage 1 for quite some time with no clutch issues at all. I would also suggest not going with ClutchMasters, Spec and Action clutch at the moment due to numerous issues with them. ACT Clutch released their clutch and flywheel set-up which looks promising but I am waiting for more reviews to come out. There is also the option of the Type R clutch retro-fit.

I currently do not run tunerview in my head unit, I haven't gone around to do so yet.

I don't know any tune maps for fuel efficiency because I already get great gas mileage as it is. My MPG's have dipped maybe 1 or 2 in the city due to having too much fun with the TSP Stage 1. I wouldn't really worry about a fuel efficiency tune, just drive a little more conservative and your MPG will go up.

Happy New Year! We are all trying to help each other out in this forum, so don't be afraid to ask questions.

 

[El2ok]

Seems like there is nothing out of the ordinary with that knock control, to me. I was getting similar values to you when I had my KTuner 19.5/21.5 tune in. Data logs are going to be your friend! I have also recorded several data logs, just for research. I keep an eye out for wideband (air fuel ratio) and knock control values. AFR's should be ideally around 14.5 - 15.5, so as close to stoichiometric air-fuel ratio as possible. Under decel, you will see upwards of 20+, which is normal. Under WOT, somewhere between 11 to 12 is good (although I could be wrong about this as it depends on the tune). You will see the value bounce around after you come to a stop but it should level back out to ~14.5.

I have been running KTuner V2 for maybe like 4 weeks? KTuner base maps for 1 week. TSP Stage 1 tune has only been on for 3 weeks. There is a huge difference between the KTuner base maps versus TSP Stage 1 tune. KTuner base maps wake up the car, but the TSP Stage 1 tune turns the Si into something else. A lot more top-end power that feels really smooth. There are a bunch more little things here and there that really make the TSP Stage 1 tune stand out. Highly recommend it! I haven't felt any clutch slip but I am fairly certain that it will happen in the future, our clutches aren't that strong. However, there are some people that have been running the TSP Stage 1 for quite some time with no clutch issues at all. I would also suggest not going with ClutchMasters, Spec and Action clutch at the moment due to numerous issues with them. ACT Clutch released their clutch and flywheel set-up which looks promising but I am waiting for more reviews to come out. There is also the option of the Type R clutch retro-fit.

I currently do not run tunerview in my head unit, I haven't gone around to do so yet.

I don't know any tune maps for fuel efficiency because I already get great gas mileage as it is. My MPG's have dipped maybe 1 or 2 in the city due to having to much fun with the TSP Stage 1. I wouldn't really worry about a fuel efficiency tune, just drive a little more conservative and your MPG will go up.

Happy New Year! We are all trying to help each other out in this forum, so don't be afraid to ask questions.

Oh okay thank you very much for the help! I will make sure to keep an eye on the AFR and Knock control values. Are there any other specs i should keep an eye on other than AFR and Knock control values?

Nice! I might look into getting the TSP stage one in a month or two.. I can only imagine the difference! lol. As for the clutch, thanks for the heads up. I will also just wait some time to see which clutch works best for our setup. In the meantime ill just have to take it easy on the stock and only do pulls from time to time.. haha.

Your gonna love the tunerview setup to monitor the tuner specs from your head unit. I had a lil difficult time at first having it sync with the k tuner Bluetooth signal.. but eventually got it to work out. If you ever get it set up and have any issues feel free to let me know and I will help with what issues i've came across.

Your right.. just gotta take it easy on the throttle when "attempting to save gas" lol .. but it just so damn hard now that i've felt the difference in the car. hahaha.


Sounds good brotha, thanks again for the help with my questions!

 

[FC1Dawn]

I have my actual KTuner V2 hooked up via ODB2 and it's stuffed in the little storage area in front of the shifter. I normally have it with the 9 value layout. I have Air Fuel Ratio, Knock Control Value, Boost Pressure, IAT1, IAT2, Engine Coolant Temp, Short Term Fuel Trims, Long Term Fuel Trims and Actual Ignition. It's good to see how all of it works. Short Term Fuel Trims and Long Term Fuel Trims should ideally be at 0% but you will see STFT float around +/-5%.

Enjoy it!

 

[Gotch]

On 91 octane kcontrol will bounce around.49 to the mid .60’s. TSP Stage 1 will be worse, up into the .70’s, .80’s on map 3. Nothing to be concerned with unless you start going into the 1.0’s. Just back off until it comes down.

TSP Stage 1 is way different than the KTuner basemaps. So much top end power vs having all the power hit and then fall off at 4500rpm on the KTuner basemaps.

 

[El2ok]

I have my actual KTuner V2 hooked up via ODB2 and it's stuffed in the little storage area in front of the shifter. I normally have it with the 9 value layout. I have Air Fuel Ratio, Knock Control Value, Boost Pressure, IAT1, IAT2, Engine Coolant Temp, Short Term Fuel Trims, Long Term Fuel Trims and Actual Ignition. It's good to see how all of it works. Short Term Fuel Trims and Long Term Fuel Trims should ideally be at 0% but you will see STFT float around +/-5%.

Enjoy it!

Nice you have the V2 series! I was on budget and had to go with the 1.5 series, haha. Oh okay, I'm gonna make a layout with tuneviewer to keep an eye on those specs, thanks!

 

[El2ok]

On 91 octane kcontrol will bounce around.49 to the mid .60’s. TSP Stage 1 will be worse, up into the .70’s, .80’s on map 3. Nothing to be concerned with unless you start going into the 1.0’s. Just back off until it comes down.

TSP Stage 1 is way different than the KTuner basemaps. So much top end power vs having all the power hit and then fall off at 4500rpm on the KTuner basemaps.

Thanks for the input on knock control. It's now been 3 days with my first tune in the car. The first day I was pushing. 70 then today I wasn't being too aggressive on the throttle and I was averaging mid .6's. I eventually wanna test out the TSP tune, but I figured since the car only has about 1,300 miles on it I was to ease my way into it. Lol. I agree with the k tuner maps it has great power at mid range rpms but then kind if falls off at higher rpms. For being my first tune though, I gotta say it has surprised me on the difference from stock! Lol. Just gotta take it easy on the throttle.. lol . I normally get about 300-350 miles on a full tank. But since I put the tune in and been driving with WOT at 23 psi. I averaged about 250 miles on a full tank.. smh... lol

 

[gtman]

Thanks for the input on knock control. It's now been 3 days with my first tune in the car. The first day I was pushing. 70 then today I wasn't being too aggressive on the throttle and I was averaging mid .6's. I eventually wanna test out the TSP tune, but I figured since the car only has about 1,300 miles on it I was to ease my way into it. Lol. I agree with the k tuner maps it has great power at mid range rpms but then kind if falls off at higher rpms. For being my first tune though, I gotta say it has surprised me on the difference from stock! Lol. Just gotta take it easy on the throttle.. lol . I normally get about 300-350 miles on a full tank. But since I put the tune in and been driving with WOT at 23 psi. I averaged about 250 miles on a full tank.. smh... lol

The beauty of the TSP tune is balance. Don't get me wrong, the KTuner base tunes are a huge improvement over stock. The midrange is awesome. And the throttle can almost feel "touchy" depending on your quick adjustments. But it feels like a slight let down at high rpm.

TSP smooths the low end but has a more linear feel all the way to the top of the rpm range. The deeper you go into the throttle and the higher the rpm, the faster it goes. It feels just right. After 4000, it's beast mode.

With Ktuner's setup, all the power seems to be under 5,000 rpm.

Sponsored