Thoughts and reviews on CVT vs Manual

meow

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Don't know if this has been covered before but here it goes.

A little bit about my background. First car was an Acura RSX-S 6 speed and afterwards I owned a Nissan Altima SE-R 6 speed then a BMW E46 6 speed to a GMC Sierra and now this Civic Hatchback Sport CVT. I used to sell cars and surprisingly was one of the very few salesmen who knew how to drive a standard. I've driven a good amount of cars. I've also driven the 10th gen SI and hatchback sport manual.

Thoughts on CVT:
There's a lot of flack for the CVT transmissions but for daily driving, overtaking on the freeway, and overall drive ability, I am honestly impressed with the CVT. Yes, I miss a 3rd pedal which I will talk more about it in a bit but overall the paddle shifters, S mode, and the capabilities at stock are not too bad for an economy car.

Thoughts on SI:
The shifting is very fluid, confident, and impressive to me for a 24k car. The clutch is somewhat soft but I didn't mind it. For spirited driving I find this car to be one of the better manual cars Honda has produced (aside from my bias for the RSX-S and the S2000). I will say that if you HAVE to have a manual, please choose the SI. It is world's apart from the Hatchback Sport manual.

Thoughts on Sport 6 Speed:
Not bad, but to me it wasn't impressive. I felt the throws to be too long coupled with the soft clutch I didn't feel engaged driving it. When I was initially in the market for a hatchback sport (I love the body style) I wanted to initially get a manual. However, the only one available locally was either red or white and I needed the blue. A part of me was thinking I should've just compromised on the color and gotten a manual; but I also needed to know my wife could confidently drive this car every now and then. After driving the sport 6 speed, I do not have any regrets whatsoever. It always feels great to row your own gears; but to me, not in this vehicle. Especially after driving the SI.

Keep in mind this is my opinion. You're more than welcome to post yours. I don't think there's a manual car in the market I haven't driven. So to say the sport 6 speed was unimpressive comes from the fact that I've driven a lot of cars. If the hatchback sport manual was exactly like the SI, I would've been sore about my CVT. However, the CVT tranny in my opinion is nothing short of impressive.
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I don't think there's a manual car in the market I haven't driven. So to say the sport 6 speed was unimpressive comes from the fact that I've driven a lot of cars. If the hatchback sport manual was exactly like the SI, I would've been sore about my CVT. However, the CVT tranny in my opinion is nothing short of impressive.
This paragraph is all I needed to hear. The Cvt wins over the sport manual and arguably the Si if you consider how fast it shifts. I can totally "overtake" or pass a car in front of me on a one-lane road without all the theatrics and grand pubah of a stick shift. And I got the CVT hatch. book it, Zoom Zoom 2.0! Take that Si owners who got a woody for the sticky.
 
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This paragraph is all I needed to hear. The Cvt wins over the sport manual and arguably the Si if you consider how fast it shifts. I can totally pass a car in front of me without all the theatrics and manual labor of a stick shift. And I got the CVT hatch. book it, Zoom Zoom 2.0! Take that Si owners.
I've raced an SI and beat him. Granted he's only been driving manual for 3 months but I was a car lengths ahead from a dig to 50mph. I do miss rowing my gears. But I wouldn't miss it if I owned the sport in manual. You need to drive an SI. It's pretty nice. I just don't prefer the sedan (I have children) and the coupe is gorgeous but I won't buy a coupe.
 

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I've raced an SI and beat him. Granted he's only been driving manual for 3 months but I was a car lengths ahead from a dig to 50mph. I do miss rowing my gears. But I wouldn't miss it if I owned the sport in manual. You need to drive an SI. It's pretty nice. I just don't prefer the sedan (I have children) and the coupe is gorgeous but I won't buy a coupe.
So you got a Sport Hatch in CVT? I thought the Sports all came in manual and you had to get a Sport Touring to get Sport with CVT?
 


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Don't know if this has been covered before but here it goes.

A little bit about my background. First car was an Acura RSX-S 6 speed and afterwards I owned a Nissan Altima SE-R 6 speed then a BMW E46 6 speed to a GMC Sierra and now this Civic Hatchback Sport CVT. I used to sell cars and surprisingly was one of the very few salesmen who knew how to drive a standard. I've driven a good amount of cars. I've also driven the 10th gen SI and hatchback sport manual.

Thoughts on CVT:
There's a lot of flack for the CVT transmissions but for daily driving, overtaking on the freeway, and overall drive ability, I am honestly impressed with the CVT. Yes, I miss a 3rd pedal which I will talk more about it in a bit but overall the paddle shifters, S mode, and the capabilities at stock are not too bad for an economy car.

Thoughts on SI:
The shifting is very fluid, confident, and impressive to me for a 24k car. The clutch is somewhat soft but I didn't mind it. For spirited driving I find this car to be one of the better manual cars Honda has produced (aside from my bias for the RSX-S and the S2000). I will say that if you HAVE to have a manual, please choose the SI. It is world's apart from the Hatchback Sport manual.

Thoughts on Sport 6 Speed:
Not bad, but to me it wasn't impressive. I felt the throws to be too long coupled with the soft clutch I didn't feel engaged driving it. When I was initially in the market for a hatchback sport (I love the body style) I wanted to initially get a manual. However, the only one available locally was either red or white and I needed the blue. A part of me was thinking I should've just compromised on the color and gotten a manual; but I also needed to know my wife could confidently drive this car every now and then. After driving the sport 6 speed, I do not have any regrets whatsoever. It always feels great to row your own gears; but to me, not in this vehicle. Especially after driving the SI.

Keep in mind this is my opinion. You're more than welcome to post yours. I don't think there's a manual car in the market I haven't driven. So to say the sport 6 speed was unimpressive comes from the fact that I've driven a lot of cars. If the hatchback sport manual was exactly like the SI, I would've been sore about my CVT. However, the CVT tranny in my opinion is nothing short of impressive.
I agree with your points and have a similar background. I've owned 5 Z cars... all have been manuals. I've had an RSX type-S as well. There was something more visceral with revving out that K20 to ~8000 RPM... the 5500 Vtec crossover. I know my 10th is a faster, better handling car... but man was that car fun.

CVTs have gotten so much better than the first examples I remember... now over 20 years ago (Subaru Justy). They should... for all intents and purposes be better than any manual. For performance: they can maintain power at the engines peak horsepower... never interrupting power for a shift, and allowing a turbo to maintain peak boost. For economy: they have generally wider ratios and can gear up very high at high speeds.

They can be built strong. Chain driven examples have positive engagement. Nissan puts the near 300 hp VQ up to one. They also have one of their smaller SUVs be able to pull 5000lb with one.

Had Honda built theirs up stronger, and provided the LSD in that drivetrain... I have no doubt the Si would simply be out matched. As it stands in their stock trims, I wouldn't be shocked if a less powerful non-Si CVT Civic could walk a stock Si at under 100 MPH.

I do like shifting my own gears. Always have. Always will. As CVTs continue to get better and encroach on the performance that we still cling to that manuals provide... I don't see my love and preference for them changing.
 
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So you got a Sport Hatch in CVT? I thought the Sports all came in manual and you had to get a Sport Touring to get Sport with CVT?
Sport Hatch (not touring) come in CVT as well.
 

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As it stands in their stock trims, I wouldn't be shocked if a less powerful non-Si CVT Civic could walk a stock Si at under 100 MPH.
As CVTs continue to get better and encroach on the performance that we still cling to that manuals provide...
Hah! anoter kill shot delivered by Hatch Cvt on the mighty Si! Take that stick stiffies!
 

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I agree with your points and have a similar background. I've owned 5 Z cars... all have been manuals. I've had an RSX type-S as well. There was something more visceral with revving out that K20 to ~8000 RPM... the 5500 Vtec crossover. I know my 10th is a faster, better handling car... but man was that car fun.
I have a B18-swapped EJ6. I wont lie. I love those high-revving late-90's Honda engines and I don't think I'll ever get rid of this car.
 
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I agree with your points and have a similar background. I've owned 5 Z cars... all have been manuals. I've had an RSX type-S as well. There was something more visceral with revving out that K20 to ~8000 RPM... the 5500 Vtec crossover. I know my 10th is a faster, better handling car... but man was that car fun.

CVTs have gotten so much better than the first examples I remember... now over 20 years ago (Subaru Justy). They should... for all intents and purposes be better than any manual. For performance: they can maintain power at the engines peak horsepower... never interrupting power for a shift, and allowing a turbo to maintain peak boost. For economy: they have generally wider ratios and can gear up very high at high speeds.

They can be built strong. Chain driven examples have positive engagement. Nissan puts the near 300 hp VQ up to one. They also have one of their smaller SUVs be able to pull 5000lb with one.

Had Honda built theirs up stronger, and provided the LSD in that drivetrain... I have no doubt the Si would simply be out matched. As it stands in their stock trims, I wouldn't be shocked if a less powerful non-Si CVT Civic could walk a stock Si at under 100 MPH.

I do like shifting my own gears. Always have. Always will. As CVTs continue to get better and encroach on the performance that we still cling to that manuals provide... I don't see my love and preference for them changing.
Completely agree with you and I feel we're on the same boat. If I was extremely adamant about a manual, I would've chose an SI off the bat. But I was actually adamant about a blue sport hatchback (LOL). Good thing I have a friend that let's me drive his coupe SI. It's a great car to me.
 


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Sport Hatch (not touring) come in CVT as well.
Good to know, did *not* know that. And you got the 180 hp engine I believe. I know the sport and up don't or can't come with Honda Sensing Safety. I wonder why cause who wouldn't want Front Collision Avoidance/Mitigation. That stuff comes on and reminds me all the time when someone in front of me slows down really fast and I turn my attention for a second, it alerts me. It feels like the car is alive in those instances.
 

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I have a B18-swapped EJ6. I wont lie. I love those high-revving late-90's Honda engines and I don't think I'll ever get rid of this car.
Keep it forever. A screaming high revving N/A... whether it's got 200 hp or barely 100 hp is a joy in itself. My family outgrew the RSX and it had spent it's life on salted roads in NY State and was moving back south... eh... excuses excuses... I probably should have held on to it. It was one hell of a machine.
 

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Completely agree with you and I feel we're on the same boat. If I was extremely adamant about a manual, I would've chose an SI off the bat. But I was actually adamant about a blue sport hatchback (LOL). Good thing I have a friend that let's me drive his coupe SI. It's a great car to me.
A manual is getting more and more to be a completely emotional and less logical decision. There are definitely power limitations for the CVT when tuning is involved... but in it's stock form, these in no way are a factor.

I still find cars an emotional purchase. Cars I don't love to drive don't last long. I have heard... several times my wife remark 'I love driving this car' and I feel the same way. Even if Honda slapped a super tough, chain driven variant w/a LSD in the Civics... maybe as an option on the Si... whatever... I would have bought a manual. I don't go to tracks. I don't street race. I just drive the car hard and enjoy being part of the process more than just 2 pedals and a steering wheel. To each their own.
 

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A manual is getting more and more to be a completely emotional and less logical decision.
I agree and as a rationalist I guess that dichotomy annoys me to a certain degree. I just like driving a stick even if it makes no sense whatsoever.
 

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I agree and as a rationalist I guess that dichotomy annoys me to a certain degree. I just like driving a stick even if it makes no sense whatsoever.
But shouldn't you be about being rational? For example, how do you deal with disagreements at the workplace or domestic? Do things that make no sense? Of-course you don't. How is it any different here?
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