People were wrong about the 2020 Supra...

[jred721]

OP, please stop embarassing yourself. No car company on the planet can compete with Toyota quality and here you are trying to defend a BMW Supra? You lose. You can have your opinions, fine.

Question - hows toyota resale value?

Question - hows BMW resale value?

Now why is that? Dont even try with this garbage. This supra is a bad joke.

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You're living in a fantasy world if you think that Toyota really could have spent all that money on a completely new inline 6 engine when they have been out of practice for over 20 years, and then spent even more money on developing a whole new platform, all for one sports car that won't sell nearly as well in a market that is dominated by crossovers. The fact that we even got a Supra is a big enough deal, and the BMW engine isn't a sore point at all. The bread and butter of BMW is their inline 6 engines, so there was no better manufacturer to supply the Supra's drivetrain. Use your common sense and you'll see that the Supra is actually a great car, and Toyota made the best decision they could given the circumstances. The biggest flaw honestly is not the BMW guts, but the lack of a manual transmission. The price would have been jacked up way above $50K if they developed their own stuff, so i'm happy with the way it is.

Resale wise, obviously Toyotas hold their value better but I could care less about that because I buy all my German cars used/CPO so majority of the depreciation is already hit, and I can enjoy the car. In the Supra's case, it's just a matter of time to see how the supply and demand is for the car, that will determine how it holds it's value.

If you're one of those people who would give their left nut for a MK4 Supra and consistently look at the new Supra in comparison to the old (you seem like one of those), then sure, the car is a "flop". If you look at the car from unbiased eyes though and just evaluate it on it's qualities rather than comparing it to the old generation, you'll see it's actually an amazing car and great value for money at $50,000. I find it hilarious that people like you are quick to dismiss a car that handles great, has great acceleration, sounds amazing, looks good, and overall is a great driver's car just because it doesn't live up to the hype of the old one in their eyes. You're one of those people who would rather buy a car for it's badge rather than how it actually drives looks like. Like I said above, I hope more people look at the Supra like you do so the depreciation is even bigger and I can snag what's actually an amazing car, for a steal .

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[jred721]

even if i did get it, i don't think i would keep them that long to the point where you can't get parts for it. It's not a collectors car or anything. Drive the shit out of it, enjoy it, and move on to the next one.

either way, there is no MT option so although i like the car, i'm not buying it lol. Definitely going to drive one to see how it feels though.


yeah, it sounds like a ......... BMW
BMWs do sound impressive (aside from the S55). It also sounds much better than a CTR ever will. The pops and crackles of the exhaust adds to the fun too.

Exactly what i'm saying. If I bought this car it wouldn't be because of the badge, it would be because it's a hell of a good car for the money and i'd drive the hell out of it. Also agree on the need for a manual, that was the biggest mistake IMO.

 

[boosted180sx]

Well yeah, but it takes a lot more than proper exhaust note to make a Supra.

What does it need for it to be a supra in your eyes then?

stop getting so hung up on the name they used and look at the actual car they made. You get a lot of car for 50k.
The RB26 and 2JZ is my 2 favorite motors and this is the closest thing to them. The B58 is basically a modern day 2JZ and is arguably the best sounding BMW motor. I loved it when i drove the M240i.

The downside (a pretty big one) is like someone mentioned here, the timing chain being in the back, and vanos accessibility when it needs service done. Anything to do with those would basically require an engine removal.

Of course the car isn't perfect. there are a lot of things i dislike about the car. Not a fan of the short wheel base, the bmw aspects of the interior like the idrive and the chime they have. They also could've used the wing similiar to what the ft-1 had. But for 50k? It's a lot of car. I would buy this over an M2 if it was offered in 6MT.

 

[Shankmeyster]

It's just a rebadged Z4. No big deal.

 

[gtman]

I'm sure it's a great performance car but even if I had the $$$, it wouldn't be on my list. That incredibly bad visibility is a huge no-no for me.

 

[scoobysnack]

You're living in a fantasy world if you think that Toyota really could have spent all that money on a completely new inline 6 engine when they have been out of practice for over 20 years, and then spent even more money on developing a whole new platform, all for one sports car that won't sell nearly as well in a market that is dominated by crossovers. The fact that we even got a Supra is a big enough deal, and the BMW engine isn't a sore point at all. The bread and butter of BMW is their inline 6 engines, so there was no better manufacturer to supply the Supra's drivetrain. Use your common sense and you'll see that the Supra is actually a great car, and Toyota made the best decision they could given the circumstances. The biggest flaw honestly is not the BMW guts, but the lack of a manual transmission. The price would have been jacked up way above $50K if they developed their own stuff, so i'm happy with the way it is.

Toyota is one of the largest and most successful car companies on the planet. I dont think creating a new engine of any type would be a challenge for them.

The main issue comes back to the basic fact that the new Toyota Supra is not a Toyota. Its a BMW. If you like the car, great. Then you'll like the Z4 even more since its up on power. Its not hard to point out the mistakes made on this supra. As I've said for months, it will be a flop. Theres no market for two types of automatic only BMW coupes. Theres hardly a market for one.

 

[scoobysnack]

It's just a rebadged Z4. No big deal.

Exactly. But the silly thing is that it is a big deal because supra lovers have been waiting for this for a decade. And then they were handed a reskinned Z4? WTF?

 

[TypeSiR]

Not much to look at (subjective, I know) but Matt and Sofyan had a lot of fun driving it. To me, the overall vehicle dynamics trumps the logo on the front grille or what engine is under the hood. Enjoy driving for the sake of driving. I think true Supra enthusiasts will be ecstatic of the new car.

 

[scoobysnack]

Not much to look at (subjective, I know) but Matt and Sofyan had a lot of fun driving it. To me, the overall vehicle dynamics trumps the logo on the front grille or what engine is under the hood. Enjoy driving for the sake of driving. I think true Supra enthusiasts will be ecstatic of the new car.

I dont think toyota or supra fans want a BMW. As folks pointed out in the below forum, Toyota likely saw that there was little money to be made with a new Supra. Folks arent buying sports cars at the moment. Having BMW build it was a way to pinch out a "supra" but have someone else shoulder most of the risk.

https://www.supramkv.com/threads/wh...a-talk-about-your-excitement-level.609/page-5

 

[jred721]

Toyota is one of the largest and most successful car companies on the planet. I dont think creating a new engine of any type would be a challenge for them.

The main issue comes back to the basic fact that the new Toyota Supra is not a Toyota. Its a BMW. If you like the car, great. Then you'll like the Z4 even more since its up on power. Its not hard to point out the mistakes made on this supra. As I've said for months, it will be a flop. Theres no market for two types of automatic only BMW coupes. Theres hardly a market for one.

Toyota may be a successful company, but it's still a business. You proved my point and contradicted your argument by saying "there's hardly a market for one". You're right, thats why they had to partner up with BMW because in a crossover dominated market, only a fool would go through the trouble of building an entirely new engine and platform for the sake of one car that wont sell in large numbers. The MK4 supra shared its 2JZ in turbo and non turbo form with countless other cars so it made sense. But anyway, agree to disagree I guess.

 

[jred721]

Side note: If I were in the market for a sports car at this price point, it'd be between this, a GT350, and a manual BMW M2. Right now i'd be leaning towards the GT350, but if they did a manual Supra it'd be a hard decision.

 

[scoobysnack]

Toyota may be a successful company, but it's still a business. You proved my point and contradicted your argument by saying "there's hardly a market for one". You're right, thats why they had to partner up with BMW because in a crossover dominated market, only a fool would go through the trouble of building an entirely new engine and platform for the sake of one car that wont sell in large numbers. The MK4 supra shared its 2JZ in turbo and non turbo form with countless other cars so it made sense. But anyway, agree to disagree I guess.

Well, toyota COULD make the supra on their own, they're just being perhaps overly pragmatic and I guess dont want to drop the $$ into a new halo car.

I guess there will be folks like me that feel its a shame to sell a BMW Supra and there will be those that say, "if its a great car then its a great car." And this does seem like a good car.

But Supra fans waited and got a Z4 instead... seems odd to me. Silly analogy but if we order pizza from Mountain Mikes it would bother us if we found out their pizza is now made by Papa Johns. If we wanted Papa Johns we would have called Papa Johns.

 

[boosted180sx]

I dont think toyota or supra fans want a BMW.

i agree with you on that point. For people waiting for the supra, this is a disappointment.

Which is why i don't look at this as a "supra" and just as another sports car. it sounds good, is fun, and decently priced. If you are a fan of the old supra, then yeah, this car isn't for you.
I still wish they used the 6 speed transmission off of the M240i or something though. Definitely going to go drive one once it hits the lot for sure. Wonder if they will let people test drive it lol.

 

[saz468]

I dont think toyota or supra fans want a BMW. As folks pointed out in the below forum, Toyota likely saw that there was little money to be made with a new Supra. Folks arent buying sports cars at the moment. Having BMW build it was a way to pinch out a "supra" but have someone else shoulder most of the risk.

https://www.supramkv.com/threads/wh...a-talk-about-your-excitement-level.609/page-5

Seams like the Toyota guys aren’t too thrilled about the Toyota/BMW Supra

 

[123sillyboy123]

Whats wrong with new supra using b54 engine.. as long as it is a great build.. then it is a great car.

I put a refundable $1000 deposit with toyota here.. i am #4 in the line Toronto here...
not really like how the car look but just like to keep my option open. I can always sell my spot to other potential buyer later in fall

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