Knock Count / Knock Control

kshawn

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Knock control movement is what to watch for. If your going up all the time. Look into why. I'd rarely go up to .52 even after 3-4 back to back pulls.
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Knock control movement is what to watch for. If your going up all the time. Look into why. I'd rarely go up to .52 even after 3-4 back to back pulls.
I'll have to log it more. Honestly I noticed it starts to fluctuate more now that it's getting colder here and is more stable when its around 80 or so outside.
 

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I'll have to log it more. Honestly I noticed it starts to fluctuate more now that it's getting colder here and is more stable when its around 80 or so outside.
What fuel are you using?
 

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Something has to be wrong in all this "ignore knock count" advise with the rod exit cars we have been seeing in the past year....
I posted this a few months ago on the Facebook groups, but...

"If this were a forum and I a moderator, I would make this a "sticky", but maybe someone will do it for me here.

"Knock Count" = This parameter is a reflection of the ECU's misfire monitor. It is NOT an accurate reflection of anything other than misfire events. When will you see these normally? Startup, rapid throttle closures, rapid throttle inputs, rapid release of the clutch pedal, and sometimes at idle (especially if you have a lighter flywheel/clutch combo, and/or plugs that have been gapped down to prevent spark blowout at high load). A completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts. In my experience with these engines, you will see more activity on cylinder four compared to others, as the crank position sensor is physically located closest to there on the block. This usually isn't a concern area unless you see a steep count in a very, very short time (like 50+ in a few seconds), which will likely trip a P0300-variant DTC code.

"Knock Control" = This parameter is the ECU's determination of fuel quality. Movement here indicates the knock sensor hears what it thinks is knock activity, and reports to the ECU to apply a steeper ignition retard to avoid continued knock activity. This value is dynamic, and WILL move from time to time. On Civic Si models, there doesn't seem to be a forced rise at play at WOT like the non-Si 1.5T ECU's (which naturally rise above 5,200-5,400rpm regardless of sensor input). Movement that goes up and up and up and never comes down is more concerning than movement alone. Knock control can typically be manipulated down by driving the car in a higher gear at lower engine speeds and targeting atmospheric pressure on the MAP sensor reading."
 


Syntek

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I posted this a few months ago on the Facebook groups, but...

"If this were a forum and I a moderator, I would make this a "sticky", but maybe someone will do it for me here.

"Knock Count" = This parameter is a reflection of the ECU's misfire monitor. It is NOT an accurate reflection of anything other than misfire events. When will you see these normally? Startup, rapid throttle closures, rapid throttle inputs, rapid release of the clutch pedal, and sometimes at idle (especially if you have a lighter flywheel/clutch combo, and/or plugs that have been gapped down to prevent spark blowout at high load). A completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts. In my experience with these engines, you will see more activity on cylinder four compared to others, as the crank position sensor is physically located closest to there on the block. This usually isn't a concern area unless you see a steep count in a very, very short time (like 50+ in a few seconds), which will likely trip a P0300-variant DTC code.

"Knock Control" = This parameter is the ECU's determination of fuel quality. Movement here indicates the knock sensor hears what it thinks is knock activity, and reports to the ECU to apply a steeper ignition retard to avoid continued knock activity. This value is dynamic, and WILL move from time to time. On Civic Si models, there doesn't seem to be a forced rise at play at WOT like the non-Si 1.5T ECU's (which naturally rise above 5,200-5,400rpm regardless of sensor input). Movement that goes up and up and up and never comes down is more concerning than movement alone. Knock control can typically be manipulated down by driving the car in a higher gear at lower engine speeds and targeting atmospheric pressure on the MAP sensor reading."

So in my situation, why would there be movement on knock control and not knock count itself? I've seen it spike from .54 to .63-64 just driving normally even though there's no registered knock count on any cylinder.

Other times I'll be hooning the shit out of it and KC will absolutely not budge from .54 and occasionally record 1-3 knocks per cylinder (which is normal behavior to me) My concern is ignition retarding and loss of power when there's no real issue presented I suppose.
 

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I
So in my situation, why would there be movement on knock control and not knock count itself? I've seen it spike from .54 to .63-64 just driving normally even though there's no registered knock count on any cylinder.

Other times I'll be hooning the shit out of it and KC will absolutely not budge from .54 and occasionally record 1-3 knocks per cylinder (which is normal behavior to me) My concern is ignition retarding and loss of power when there's no real issue presented I suppose.
You're in CA, yes? It's just a result of some knock activity that the ECU is hearing as a result of your fuel quality. (The knock control movement, that is.)

Again, regarding "knock count", don't pay much attention to it unless you're accumulating 50-100+ counts in a few second span (in which case, you're bound to get a DTC code for misfire condition, which would indicate something like an injector problem, plugs, coils, head gasket damage, etc).
 

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Also, to elaborate, the values you're speaking about are nowhere near what anyone would consider "concerning" in the least.

The difference in ignition retard from 0.49 to 0.65 is literally 1.5deg.
 

Syntek

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Also, to elaborate, the values you're speaking about are nowhere near what anyone would consider "concerning" in the least.

The difference in ignition retard from 0.49 to 0.65 is literally 1.5deg.
Gotcha. Thanks for the information. I've just always found it a bit odd that knock control would fluctuate more on normal day to day driving but seems steady and stable when it's being pushed aggressively but if it's normal behavior with CA gas then cool.

And yeah, the most I've seen in "actual" knock count was probably 12-15 per cylinder after beating on it on a 40 min or so drive. I'm not worried abou it. It's significantly lower than my old 2016 EXT recorded.

Might be going TSP Stage 2 sooner than later since the gas station I typically visit is now carrying e85 :headbang:
 
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I posted this a few months ago on the Facebook groups, but...

"If this were a forum and I a moderator, I would make this a "sticky", but maybe someone will do it for me here.

"Knock Count" = This parameter is a reflection of the ECU's misfire monitor. It is NOT an accurate reflection of anything other than misfire events. When will you see these normally? Startup, rapid throttle closures, rapid throttle inputs, rapid release of the clutch pedal, and sometimes at idle (especially if you have a lighter flywheel/clutch combo, and/or plugs that have been gapped down to prevent spark blowout at high load). A completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts. In my experience with these engines, you will see more activity on cylinder four compared to others, as the crank position sensor is physically located closest to there on the block. This usually isn't a concern area unless you see a steep count in a very, very short time (like 50+ in a few seconds), which will likely trip a P0300-variant DTC code.

"Knock Control" = This parameter is the ECU's determination of fuel quality. Movement here indicates the knock sensor hears what it thinks is knock activity, and reports to the ECU to apply a steeper ignition retard to avoid continued knock activity. This value is dynamic, and WILL move from time to time. On Civic Si models, there doesn't seem to be a forced rise at play at WOT like the non-Si 1.5T ECU's (which naturally rise above 5,200-5,400rpm regardless of sensor input). Movement that goes up and up and up and never comes down is more concerning than movement alone. Knock control can typically be manipulated down by driving the car in a higher gear at lower engine speeds and targeting atmospheric pressure on the MAP sensor reading."
In need of some advice. So recently I've been experiencing high k.control. as high as 1.09 and even during regular driving it stays around .7 not .49 like it used to. I had an emissions code come on due to what I believe my catless downpipe burning up my o2 sensor. And my car felt like it was breaking up a bit under boost. So I put the stock downpipe and exhaust on with a new sensor anf also put brand new oem plugs in the car and my k.control went back to normal. Now 2 weeks later my k.control is right back to .7 -1.09. I realize that its protecting my engine but it also sucks to not have the power I should have. Not sure if their is an issue with the car or if it's an issue with the gas where I live. I always use 93 octane fuel but I live in Ohio where the gas is unregulated so idk if I'm actually getting the octane levels I pay for at the pump.
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