zroger73
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- Apr 15, 2017
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- 2019 MX-5 Miata GT-S, 2021 Ridgeline RTL-E
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I'll skip my background because I covered that in another thread, but for the purpose of this thread it is important for me to disclose that I've never driven an Si before or any other car in a similar category. I've also followed the Si and this forum closely since the reveal and read every review moments after they were published - both professional and non-professional.
Yesterday, I picked up a red 2017 sedan I purchased that I had never seen nor driven. Having seen lots of pictures, the appearance of the car was almost exactly as I expected. I hadn't owned a car with a manual transmission in 22 years, so I was a little nervous when I drove the salesman to the gas station to fill it full of Valero premium gasoline. My fears were completely unfounded - it was like riding a bicycle.
Clutch
The clutch is very forgiving and easy to drive. I took off smoothly and confidently as if I had been driving a manual every day for the last 22 years. I've heard reports about the clutch being too light, but I didn't think that at all. The engagement point was vague, but that helps with smooth driving.
Shifter
The very first thing I noticed was how tiny the shift knob was - it just struck me as being much smaller than my expectations. It feels just fine, though. Gear selection required a little more effort than I expected and the gears seem closely spaced requiring extra attention at first. The weight felt fine. The shifter is a little reluctant to go into 6th from 5th unless it is carefully guided and pulled with confidence - I'm not sure if it's me or if there might be a problem here. It is by no means a problem, but I question reviews that state that shifting is "effortless". Compared to what? Overall, shift action is direct and it quickly became easy to find the right gear.
UPDATE 6/8/17: After a day or two of adapting my hand to the shifter, I no longer have a problem shifting into 6th. Shifting has loosened up a bit and no longer seems too tight. It now glides into the appropriate gear without any conscious effort.
Audio System
The audio system sounds very good overall, but I was expecting more bass based on what I remember of the same system in my brother's 2016 Touring and certainly less than that in my 2017 Ridgeline RTL-E.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Adjusting the sound settings help. The system sounds good enough to reveal big differences in the sound quality of various sources. Good quality sources over USB and Bluetooth sound very good. Unfortunately, the subwoofer rattle seems to have carried over from the non-Si Civic.
Exhaust
I had to listen carefully to detect any sporty sound to the exhaust. There is a muted drone at low cruising speeds, but I could definitely hear the exhaust when accelerating past concrete buildings or road barriers that reflected the sound back to the car. I would imagine the exhaust sounds a lot better outside the car than it does inside.
UPDATE 6/3/17: When I hopped in the car this morning, I was no longer listening for the exhaust sound and it managed to find me this time. I was set out to run an errand and was focused on where I was going when all of the sudden I heard a little growl which caught me by surprise. Turns out the exhaust does make a little noise. I guess i was listening too hard for it initially.
Ride
Based on some reviews such as the one from Consumer Reports, I was expecting the ride to be bordering on bone-jarring and uncomfortable. While you definitely feel and hear the road, it's not uncomfortable by any means - you're just more connected to it than other cars that try to isolate the road as much as possible. In fact, I'd would say it's damn near comfortable - especially on Texas roads. The Arkansas roads were a little "busier". I'm happy to report I still have all my teeth after the 250-mile drive home and suffered no bruises or fractures.
UPDATE 6/8/17: The Si's level of comfort is perfectly acceptable as a daily driver. My 2017 Ridgeline RTL-E hasn't moved since I brought the Si home.
Steering
The steering feels perfectly neutral and weighted. The car goes where it is pointed without any drama and makes quick lane changes fun instead of an exercise in unpredictability. It was heavy enough to prevent unwanted movement and fast enough for quick maneuvers, yet light enough to remain comfortable at low speeds.
SPORT Mode
SPORT mode seems to have very little effect on daily driving. I did notice the increased throttle sensitivity, and firmer steering, but the ride didn't seem to change much...until you make abrupt changes in direction in which case the car remains noticeably flatter.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Just driving down the road, I have to really concentrate to detect any difference between normal and SPORT. The ride gets slightly stiffer. The steering gets noticeably firmer, but doesn't give any more road feel or feedback - it just seems to get firmer for the sake of getting firmer. The throttle response doesn't seem much different. Honda may as well have used non-adjustable dampers and left the rest of the SPORT mode changes on all the time.
Rev Hang and Turbo Lag
I didn't notice any rev hang whatsoever during normal driving. The car was very easy to drive smoothly. The engine is smooth and quiet (as far as 4-cylinders go - I'm used 6-cylinder engines). Power delivery seems predictable and impressive in normal driving. The only turbo lag I noticed was while cruising in a high gear at a low RPM and trying to suddenly accelerate without downshifting - it takes a second or two for the turbo to spool up and increase power. However, if you're driving in a sporty manner instead of cruising on the interstate, you'll probably be in a lower gear at a higher RPM and the turbo will be better prepared.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Rev hang is a non-issue in normal driving. It's present in more aggressive driving, but hasn't been a problem. I can't help but wonder if a person wasn't specifically looking for rev hang if they'd even notice it. Turbo lag doesn't seem to be as much of an issue as not having any significant torque until above 2,000 RPM. Off the line, you've only got Honda Fit levels of torque until after 2,000 RPM at which time the turbo spools up and you quickly run out of first gear and it's time for second. The saving grace here is that once you get rolling, it's easy to keep the engine above 2,000 RPM and within its power band.
Tires
The all-seasons do well under normal driving, but you should probably get better ones if you intend to do any type of spirited driving on the road or anywhere else. It's easy to find their limits of traction during moderate to heavy cornering and acceleration.
Brakes
Just fine for normal driving. They begin to clamp down with very little pedal travel and feel very secure.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Since day one, there is an occasional, loud, high-pitched ringing that sounds like it is coming from the brakes. It usually happens at low speeds in reverse, but once did it while driving at 45 MPH down the road. It rained the first several days I had the car. It's been happening less frequently, if at all, since the weather dried up.
Spare Tire
The spare tire pan is simply too shallow for even a compact spare. I'm not sure where the optional spare tire goes, but you're going to lose trunk space. I picked up the car after-hours and the parts department was closed, but the sales guys claimed their parts guy couldn't find a spare tire kit in the system.
UPDATE 6/8/17: The optional spare tire kit is thicker than the depth of the spare tire pan. Canadian Si models and US models with the optional spare tire kit (not yet available) include spacers that go on each side of trunk so that the trunk floor remains level at the expense of losing almost 2 cubic feet of trunk space.
Driving Position
At first, I felt like I was sitting in a bathtub or as if I were a five year-old having to stand up in the seat to see over the dash. I'm just under 6 feet tall and skinny. Also, my knee kept hitting the back of the steering wheel every time I released the clutch. It took several tries to get the seating and steering positions correct, but I'm finally comfortable.
Fuel Economy
Mixed driving with a bias towards highway use has yielded just under 40 MPG over my first 400 miles. That's subject to go down after the break-in period is over and I start driving more aggressively (if I do). Fuel economy was not a primary concern when I bought this car, but it has turned out to be a pleasant surprise.
I'll have better information once the break-in period is over. I spent the 250-mile drive home varying between an average speed of 60-80 with occasional stops and shifting through small towns or road changes. I didn't exceed 3/4 throttle or about 4,500 RPM.
So, my initial drive left me very satisfied, even impressed. I have no doubt there are better/faster cars out there, but as someone who has never driven any Si before, I can't imagine having a more well-rounded, multi-purpose, entertaining car for less money. Is it perfect? Of course, not. Is it the best in every category? Of course, not. But, at $25K this car is an absolute bargain. Even if it's not as hardcore as the previous Si, the real-world value in the 2017 seems unbeatable. I feel like I'm repeating other reviewers when I say that, but it's true.
Just buy it.
Oh, and for what it's worth, the trip computer showed 41.4 MPG at the conclusion of my 238-mile drive home at speeds of 80 MPH for long stretches including an hour-long drive through a torrential downpour. Try THAT with your ST, GTI, or WRX.
UPDATE 6/3/17:
At 300 miles today, I've been getting a little more liberal with the car. The all-season tires definitely limit traction. I was able to find their limits of traction sooner than expected during moderate acceleration and cornering, but that'll probably only be of interest or concern to enthusiasts who are deeper into the hobby than I am.
The more miles I put on it, the more comfortable I get and the more enjoyable it is. The long, mostly-highway drive on the way back home from the dealer last night was a tedious and frustrating chore. I was eager to do some shifting and cornering, but I was on straight highways. By the time I got closer to home near some back roads, a massive rain storm moved in. The all-season tires and the car handled confidently even on roads with standing water.
I had the windows tinted this morning - 35% ceramic on the front sides (darkest legal in Texas) and 15% ceramic on the back sides and rear. You can completely black out the back side and rear if you want, but I wanted as little contrast as possible between the front and rear without risking not dark enough and still being able to see at night.
UPDATE 6/8/17: After almost a week and just under 500 miles so far, I've found very little to complain about and plenty to praise. I'm continuing to enjoy this car more each day.
UPDATE 7/30/17: I've now had the Si for two months and have accumulated just over 2,000 miles. I've settled into an average of 34 MPG in a mixture of highway and city driving - including some spirited acceleration. A buzz/rattle in the roof just above the driver's window has developed, but the rest of the car remains impressively solid and quiet. There's really nothing else of significance to report. No news is good news! I continue to remain very pleased with my purchase.
Yesterday, I picked up a red 2017 sedan I purchased that I had never seen nor driven. Having seen lots of pictures, the appearance of the car was almost exactly as I expected. I hadn't owned a car with a manual transmission in 22 years, so I was a little nervous when I drove the salesman to the gas station to fill it full of Valero premium gasoline. My fears were completely unfounded - it was like riding a bicycle.
Clutch
The clutch is very forgiving and easy to drive. I took off smoothly and confidently as if I had been driving a manual every day for the last 22 years. I've heard reports about the clutch being too light, but I didn't think that at all. The engagement point was vague, but that helps with smooth driving.
Shifter
The very first thing I noticed was how tiny the shift knob was - it just struck me as being much smaller than my expectations. It feels just fine, though. Gear selection required a little more effort than I expected and the gears seem closely spaced requiring extra attention at first. The weight felt fine. The shifter is a little reluctant to go into 6th from 5th unless it is carefully guided and pulled with confidence - I'm not sure if it's me or if there might be a problem here. It is by no means a problem, but I question reviews that state that shifting is "effortless". Compared to what? Overall, shift action is direct and it quickly became easy to find the right gear.
UPDATE 6/8/17: After a day or two of adapting my hand to the shifter, I no longer have a problem shifting into 6th. Shifting has loosened up a bit and no longer seems too tight. It now glides into the appropriate gear without any conscious effort.
Audio System
The audio system sounds very good overall, but I was expecting more bass based on what I remember of the same system in my brother's 2016 Touring and certainly less than that in my 2017 Ridgeline RTL-E.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Adjusting the sound settings help. The system sounds good enough to reveal big differences in the sound quality of various sources. Good quality sources over USB and Bluetooth sound very good. Unfortunately, the subwoofer rattle seems to have carried over from the non-Si Civic.
Exhaust
I had to listen carefully to detect any sporty sound to the exhaust. There is a muted drone at low cruising speeds, but I could definitely hear the exhaust when accelerating past concrete buildings or road barriers that reflected the sound back to the car. I would imagine the exhaust sounds a lot better outside the car than it does inside.
UPDATE 6/3/17: When I hopped in the car this morning, I was no longer listening for the exhaust sound and it managed to find me this time. I was set out to run an errand and was focused on where I was going when all of the sudden I heard a little growl which caught me by surprise. Turns out the exhaust does make a little noise. I guess i was listening too hard for it initially.
Ride
Based on some reviews such as the one from Consumer Reports, I was expecting the ride to be bordering on bone-jarring and uncomfortable. While you definitely feel and hear the road, it's not uncomfortable by any means - you're just more connected to it than other cars that try to isolate the road as much as possible. In fact, I'd would say it's damn near comfortable - especially on Texas roads. The Arkansas roads were a little "busier". I'm happy to report I still have all my teeth after the 250-mile drive home and suffered no bruises or fractures.
UPDATE 6/8/17: The Si's level of comfort is perfectly acceptable as a daily driver. My 2017 Ridgeline RTL-E hasn't moved since I brought the Si home.
Steering
The steering feels perfectly neutral and weighted. The car goes where it is pointed without any drama and makes quick lane changes fun instead of an exercise in unpredictability. It was heavy enough to prevent unwanted movement and fast enough for quick maneuvers, yet light enough to remain comfortable at low speeds.
SPORT Mode
SPORT mode seems to have very little effect on daily driving. I did notice the increased throttle sensitivity, and firmer steering, but the ride didn't seem to change much...until you make abrupt changes in direction in which case the car remains noticeably flatter.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Just driving down the road, I have to really concentrate to detect any difference between normal and SPORT. The ride gets slightly stiffer. The steering gets noticeably firmer, but doesn't give any more road feel or feedback - it just seems to get firmer for the sake of getting firmer. The throttle response doesn't seem much different. Honda may as well have used non-adjustable dampers and left the rest of the SPORT mode changes on all the time.
Rev Hang and Turbo Lag
I didn't notice any rev hang whatsoever during normal driving. The car was very easy to drive smoothly. The engine is smooth and quiet (as far as 4-cylinders go - I'm used 6-cylinder engines). Power delivery seems predictable and impressive in normal driving. The only turbo lag I noticed was while cruising in a high gear at a low RPM and trying to suddenly accelerate without downshifting - it takes a second or two for the turbo to spool up and increase power. However, if you're driving in a sporty manner instead of cruising on the interstate, you'll probably be in a lower gear at a higher RPM and the turbo will be better prepared.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Rev hang is a non-issue in normal driving. It's present in more aggressive driving, but hasn't been a problem. I can't help but wonder if a person wasn't specifically looking for rev hang if they'd even notice it. Turbo lag doesn't seem to be as much of an issue as not having any significant torque until above 2,000 RPM. Off the line, you've only got Honda Fit levels of torque until after 2,000 RPM at which time the turbo spools up and you quickly run out of first gear and it's time for second. The saving grace here is that once you get rolling, it's easy to keep the engine above 2,000 RPM and within its power band.
Tires
The all-seasons do well under normal driving, but you should probably get better ones if you intend to do any type of spirited driving on the road or anywhere else. It's easy to find their limits of traction during moderate to heavy cornering and acceleration.
Brakes
Just fine for normal driving. They begin to clamp down with very little pedal travel and feel very secure.
UPDATE 6/8/17: Since day one, there is an occasional, loud, high-pitched ringing that sounds like it is coming from the brakes. It usually happens at low speeds in reverse, but once did it while driving at 45 MPH down the road. It rained the first several days I had the car. It's been happening less frequently, if at all, since the weather dried up.
Spare Tire
The spare tire pan is simply too shallow for even a compact spare. I'm not sure where the optional spare tire goes, but you're going to lose trunk space. I picked up the car after-hours and the parts department was closed, but the sales guys claimed their parts guy couldn't find a spare tire kit in the system.
UPDATE 6/8/17: The optional spare tire kit is thicker than the depth of the spare tire pan. Canadian Si models and US models with the optional spare tire kit (not yet available) include spacers that go on each side of trunk so that the trunk floor remains level at the expense of losing almost 2 cubic feet of trunk space.
Driving Position
At first, I felt like I was sitting in a bathtub or as if I were a five year-old having to stand up in the seat to see over the dash. I'm just under 6 feet tall and skinny. Also, my knee kept hitting the back of the steering wheel every time I released the clutch. It took several tries to get the seating and steering positions correct, but I'm finally comfortable.
Fuel Economy
Mixed driving with a bias towards highway use has yielded just under 40 MPG over my first 400 miles. That's subject to go down after the break-in period is over and I start driving more aggressively (if I do). Fuel economy was not a primary concern when I bought this car, but it has turned out to be a pleasant surprise.
I'll have better information once the break-in period is over. I spent the 250-mile drive home varying between an average speed of 60-80 with occasional stops and shifting through small towns or road changes. I didn't exceed 3/4 throttle or about 4,500 RPM.
So, my initial drive left me very satisfied, even impressed. I have no doubt there are better/faster cars out there, but as someone who has never driven any Si before, I can't imagine having a more well-rounded, multi-purpose, entertaining car for less money. Is it perfect? Of course, not. Is it the best in every category? Of course, not. But, at $25K this car is an absolute bargain. Even if it's not as hardcore as the previous Si, the real-world value in the 2017 seems unbeatable. I feel like I'm repeating other reviewers when I say that, but it's true.
Just buy it.
Oh, and for what it's worth, the trip computer showed 41.4 MPG at the conclusion of my 238-mile drive home at speeds of 80 MPH for long stretches including an hour-long drive through a torrential downpour. Try THAT with your ST, GTI, or WRX.
UPDATE 6/3/17:
At 300 miles today, I've been getting a little more liberal with the car. The all-season tires definitely limit traction. I was able to find their limits of traction sooner than expected during moderate acceleration and cornering, but that'll probably only be of interest or concern to enthusiasts who are deeper into the hobby than I am.
The more miles I put on it, the more comfortable I get and the more enjoyable it is. The long, mostly-highway drive on the way back home from the dealer last night was a tedious and frustrating chore. I was eager to do some shifting and cornering, but I was on straight highways. By the time I got closer to home near some back roads, a massive rain storm moved in. The all-season tires and the car handled confidently even on roads with standing water.
I had the windows tinted this morning - 35% ceramic on the front sides (darkest legal in Texas) and 15% ceramic on the back sides and rear. You can completely black out the back side and rear if you want, but I wanted as little contrast as possible between the front and rear without risking not dark enough and still being able to see at night.
UPDATE 6/8/17: After almost a week and just under 500 miles so far, I've found very little to complain about and plenty to praise. I'm continuing to enjoy this car more each day.
UPDATE 7/30/17: I've now had the Si for two months and have accumulated just over 2,000 miles. I've settled into an average of 34 MPG in a mixture of highway and city driving - including some spirited acceleration. A buzz/rattle in the roof just above the driver's window has developed, but the rest of the car remains impressively solid and quiet. There's really nothing else of significance to report. No news is good news! I continue to remain very pleased with my purchase.
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