IAT correlation

Chandler92

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I just put on a Mishimoto full Intercooler set up on my si over the weekend and it's doing its job well. I have a maperformance intake. Inlet blanket and turbo blanket. I see intake temps get up to 120 while going threw the gears it drops to 113. Highest I ever seen was 152.
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I just put on a Mishimoto full Intercooler set up on my si over the weekend and it's doing its job well. I have a maperformance intake. Inlet blanket and turbo blanket. I see intake temps get up to 120 while going threw the gears it drops to 113. Highest I ever seen was 152.
You referring to IAT1 temps? I see that your current afternoon temps are low 80s somewhere, so that must be it. Your IAT2s are probably 94ish? Especially if you’re pushing?
 

Chandler92

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You referring to IAT1 temps? I see that your current afternoon temps are low 80s somewhere, so that must be it. Your IAT2s are probably 94ish? Especially if you’re pushing?
About 89 iat2. On the way home tonight though it was 75. Iat1 was 130 iat2 was 96
 

Chandler92

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You referring to IAT1 temps? I see that your current afternoon temps are low 80s somewhere, so that must be it. Your IAT2s are probably 94ish? Especially if you’re pushing?
Makes me a tad bit nervous that the intercooler is over working itself with this intake getting so hot.
 

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Roger that...Now add more to that IAT1 after the compressor, then be thankful that your IAT2 is a whole ton better than that.
Don’t know the boost level you’re running, but a slight dial down, custom tune, or Upgraded turbo (w/o shooting for big #’s) would all do better at lowering the heat. Food for thought?...
 


Myx

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20190520_142257.jpg


Please forgive the ghetto-ness as there have been a lot of removing and adding different pieces moving towards the end goal.
20190520_143124.jpg


This is the view basically from the filter itself looking forward to the front of the car. Circled in red is the air path straight from the grill.

20190520_142353.jpg


This is the same airflow path looking through the grill opening toward the filter (same opening circled in red in previous photo)
Top left of pic is some foam, this is sealed along the edge of the guide plate that takes the air above the radiator against the middle of the grill. You cant make out the plate but it is thin gauge aluminum that is directly attached to the core support under the stock cooling plate and is one solid piece bent over the radiator/condensor and goes all the way forward to the edge of the grill opening. Everything that is metal is insulated and cool to the touch at all times now.
20190520_142600.jpg


The cut opening in the airbox lid is almost completely contoured to the hood. (I am entertaining doing away with the lid completely and ultimately just sealing the hood to the lower part of the box when the hood is closed (via something like the moroso carb pan seals for old hot rod cowl induction)

Notice the foam in between the core support and lower box (this is right above the radiator hose)

20190520_142536.jpg

When I close my hood it seals the box directly to the grill basically.

This setup has been daily driven through high and low temps rain etc. for about the last 6 weeks while Im gathering data before I rip it all out and start over with better materials and finalized/ simplified product in mind.
I never commented but I love what you did to prevent heat from entering the intake. Really good work man.
 

Chandler92

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First lets clarify the parameters IAT1 as shown on HONDATA equipped cars is referring to after intercooler temps that the engine is ingesting in the cylinder. IAT2 is the temperature at the mass airflow sensor pre turbo. KTUNED cars I am not positive but I believe from my readings that the above statement is opposite (someone else can verify this for us I am sure)

The "temperature delta" across the system is whats important. The short version of explaining this is colder air in = colder air out. Period. The intake starts colder it will end colder than it would given the exact same scenario with hotter starting temperature.

Would obsessing about this be beneficial to 99% of the owners? Not really. But I am currently obsessing about it myself anyway.

Seeing the lower temps is more placebo than anything else as it just eases my mind when Im preparing to lay in to the car.

If either number exceeds 120+ while stopped I never give it much boost if any until they plummet back down to closer to ambient when I start moving.

Fun facts:

1) The radiator fan blows hot air directly onto the maf sensor. this is part of the dramatic temp spikes people see when stopped. I have my sensor insulated to help with this.

2) The cooling fans rarely need to be on unless stopped, which dramatizes this effect.

3) It is not uncommon to see 140+ at the maf sensor when stock and vehicle not moving

4) On average a 20-30 degree difference between IAT at the maf sensor (iat2 with hondata) and outside temperature is fairly normal and close to what the stock box does

5) I have mine to 9 degrees different on 80 degree days... down to 6 degree difference when its below 60....these numbers are while car is in motion. Using a modified mishimoto short ram setup.

6) What is more important is to make sure there is not a huge difference between iat1+iat2, then we are doing our job.
If post intercooler numbers go up dramatically compared to pre intercooler than the system is working too hard to provide the commanded boost pressure. This can be helped with relieving pre turbo restrictions (race maf or any kind of intake)....relieving after turbo restrictions (intercooler/piping)....or lowering boost command until the above items are installed or a more efficient turbo is ran.
So what would you consider working to hard then. Today it was 87 out. My intake temp read 140 while moving. After Intercooler was 97. While shifting though the intake would get down to 120. I have the maperformance intake. Almost want to go back to stock cause of this.
 
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Myx

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I've been doing a bunch of reading but cant find anything showing that lowering IAT1 has a direct correlation to IAT2. Considering the air is being compressed through a super hot spinning wheel, is there any info showing that colder air pre turbo actually makes a difference? Or are the gains found via new intake brought on by the design itself and improved airflow. If someone has the data showing lower IAT2 due to the intake itself please post it :).
The short answer to this is YES. I apologize as I should've posted this a while ago. I even have links to this info in my own intake thread. Here they are. Read up and enjoy....

The Effect of Intake Air Temperatures on Turbocharged Vehicles
And This Link
Compressor Efficiency and More
 
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So what would you consider working to hard then. Today it was 87 out. My intake temp read 140 while moving. After Intercooler was 97. While shifting though the intake would get down to 120. I have the maperformance intake. Almost want to go back to stock cause of this.
A 10 degree variance from outside temp is pretty good from your after intercooler measurement. I don't believe we can get much lower than 6 degree variance once everything is up to temperature/ heat soaked no matter what we do.

I would enjoy your intake.

Im not a "typical" ricer but the benefits of the sounds that intake is probably making for you far outweigh how much of a difference you or the car would ever notice.

The increase in available air is worth it to keep it on as well. Even though iat may be a smidge higher to start your turbo will work less to supply the air to the intercooler.

Trade offs everywhere!
 

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I never commented but I love what you did to prevent heat from entering the intake. Really good work man.
Thank you sir! My brain won't let ideas go until i try them....
 
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Hollywoo0220

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If you wish to run hard frequently (track, play, etc.) you can use an E85 blend (no more than E30), have an upgraded IC and keep boost @18psi for Si’s or about 16 on a Non-Si - there, you would have consistent power and cooling effect regardless of what the ambient temp is.
While others boost out from heat, you will continue to run strong.
Granted this isn’t the 1600ft ideal, but it is a solid option for consistency when at play.
 

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Brilliant set up! I am thinking of doing something simular with my prl sri race maf set up but been struggling on ideas to case the filter, what have you used if you dont mind me asking ? Have you got any links to the materials please :D
 

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20190520_142257.jpg


Please forgive the ghetto-ness as there have been a lot of removing and adding different pieces moving towards the end goal.
20190520_143124.jpg


This is the view basically from the filter itself looking forward to the front of the car. Circled in red is the air path straight from the grill.

20190520_142353.jpg


This is the same airflow path looking through the grill opening toward the filter (same opening circled in red in previous photo)
Top left of pic is some foam, this is sealed along the edge of the guide plate that takes the air above the radiator against the middle of the grill. You cant make out the plate but it is thin gauge aluminum that is directly attached to the core support under the stock cooling plate and is one solid piece bent over the radiator/condensor and goes all the way forward to the edge of the grill opening. Everything that is metal is insulated and cool to the touch at all times now.
20190520_142600.jpg


The cut opening in the airbox lid is almost completely contoured to the hood. (I am entertaining doing away with the lid completely and ultimately just sealing the hood to the lower part of the box when the hood is closed (via something like the moroso carb pan seals for old hot rod cowl induction)

Notice the foam in between the core support and lower box (this is right above the radiator hose)

20190520_142536.jpg

When I close my hood it seals the box directly to the grill basically.

This setup has been daily driven through high and low temps rain etc. for about the last 6 weeks while Im gathering data before I rip it all out and start over with better materials and finalized/ simplified product in mind.
What box did you use to make this?
 

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Mishimoto lower and the lid was made from a Rubbermaid office trash can lol. It all worked extremely well for its intended purpose. The thought process was to emulate how the R and the base 2.0 is setup. Not really sure why Honda skimped on the si inlet.
 

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Brilliant set up! I am thinking of doing something simular with my prl sri race maf set up but been struggling on ideas to case the filter, what have you used if you dont mind me asking ? Have you got any links to the materials please :D
Home depot is all i can tell you...i should have made a parts list when i was doing this.
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