Honda dealers who install hondata how does this work?

Harlaquin

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I mean they sell you a new honda / civic/ accord/ type r. Then put Hondata on for you. So does that mean your warranty is immediately up on the engine/drive train? I mean if you pull out the dealer with 50 miles on the odometer and then the engine screws up you go back do they go oh well you were tuned? Seems a conflict of interests to me. And if they do still warranty it then why would anyone else who put hondada on then be denied a warranty claim on the engine?

IM not asking about any other warranty item or laws or whatever. We all know if you blow an engine with a modified ecu gonna say oh well. But how does that work if its the dealer who put it on?

IM asking because I know dealers who do and I also seen honda pro jason in a video mention dealers were gonna start installing it.

I also know if dealers know your car is flashed they flag your vin in the system so other dealers know. IM just confused on this.
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tinyman392

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I mean they sell you a new honda / civic/ accord/ type r. Then put Hondata on for you. So does that mean your warranty is immediately up on the engine/drive train? I mean if you pull out the dealer with 50 miles on the odometer and then the engine screws up you go back do they go oh well you were tuned? Seems a conflict of interests to me. And if they do still warranty it then why would anyone else who put hondada on then be denied a warranty claim on the engine?

IM not asking about any other warranty item or laws or whatever. We all know if you blow an engine with a modified ecu gonna say oh well. But how does that work if its the dealer who put it on?

IM asking because I know dealers who do and I also seen honda pro jason in a video mention dealers were gonna start installing it.

I also know if dealers know your car is flashed they flag your vin in the system so other dealers know. IM just confused on this.
Your warranty doesn't change. They have prove that the modification caused the warranty issue in order to decline the fix. So if the engine screws up, if they can prove the Hondata did it, then they can deny your warranty claim, otherwise they would have to fix it. Some dealerships are scummier than others so they'll deny any warranty claim they can get away with.
 
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Harlaquin

Harlaquin

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Your warranty doesn't change. They have prove that the modification caused the warranty issue in order to decline the fix. So if the engine screws up, if they can prove the Hondata did it, then they can deny your warranty claim, otherwise they would have to fix it. Some dealerships are scummier than others so they'll deny any warranty claim they can get away with.
Not to argue but i knew this would be the answer. And that is correct. But in the real world we know its not how it plays out. Many many and many posts here and else where with getting honda to fix stuff is like blood from a turnip. So if tunes and flashes are documented from a dealer by a dealer... I mean hondas out is right there. They deny crap left and right with no proff at all. Matter of fact honda, not dealers, has made the news here in my area for refusing to fix clear coats coming off cars. Blames tree sap and bird poop.
 

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I really wish Honda would take the same approach that other car manufacturers do. I believe Audi / VW, BMW, Ford and Porsche are mostly OK with tunes / performance upgrades with parts from reputable companies - such as Dinan, APR ... etc. I mean - if I install a Spoon exhaust Honda shouldn't blink an eye! Hell - the Spoon subframe brace is made in the same factory that Honda uses for OEM braces.

Honda and Hondata should be able to work together to provide performance aftermarket parts for the consumer. BMW and Dinan do this with no problems ...

It's a really upsetting that a dealership can void a powertrain warranty if they believe an exhaust or intake caused an engine failure. B/c they will fault any and all engine upgrades. No doubt about it! Even though these aftermarket parts are made with the same tolerance / testing as a OEM part.

This is me ranting ... mostly b/c I would LOVEEEE the get a Hondata on my Type R - but am NOT b/c I can't jeopardize my warranty!
 

tinyman392

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Prove? Your most likely screwed if your engine blew up...heck they give me a hard time with just an inch of a paint job much less an entire engine
If your engine blew up, certain tunes on the engine can cause that, so they can deny your claim for that.

Are you the one that had the dealer claim tree sap or some crap? Take it to a different dealer. I recently had my seat cover replaced because the Alcantera was beginning to tear (which I wasn't expecting to be covered, but it was) as well as a master clutch cylinder because my clutch pedal was clicking when I depressed the pedal (I seemed to fix it temporarily but it's slowly coming back). Both of these were done no questions asked. The amount of push back you'll get depends from dealer to dealer. That said if you have a tune and your engine blows, then they can deny for that since certain tunes are known to cause engine issues.
 


tinyman392

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I really wish Honda would take the same approach that other car manufacturers do. I believe Audi / VW, BMW, Ford and Porsche are mostly OK with tunes / performance upgrades with parts from reputable companies - such as Dinan, APR ... etc. I mean - if I install a Spoon exhaust Honda shouldn't blink an eye! Hell - the Spoon subframe brace is made in the same factory that Honda uses for OEM braces.

Honda and Hondata should be able to work together to provide performance aftermarket parts for the consumer. BMW and Dinan do this with no problems ...

It's a really upsetting that a dealership can void a powertrain warranty if they believe an exhaust or intake caused an engine failure. B/c they will fault any and all engine upgrades. No doubt about it! Even though these aftermarket parts are made with the same tolerance / testing as a OEM part.

This is me ranting ... mostly b/c I would LOVEEEE the get a Hondata on my Type R - but am NOT b/c I can't jeopardize my warranty!
Here's a rundown on how Ford deals with modified cars: https://jalopnik.com/how-a-car-company-decides-if-its-going-to-warranty-your-1821736111
 

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My question would be, do they make you sign a disclosure? If they don't, they don't have a leg to stand on.
 

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@Harlaquin The correct answer to this question is...no your warranty is not void. The dealer that I take my car to is an authorized installer of the DEALER approved hondata units. They have pre cracked ecu's on hand and will swap your original out or you can pay the extra $250 core charge to keep your original unit as well as have the new one installed but YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO RETUNE THE ECU. Modification of the ecu beyond what the dealer has programmed in will absolutely void the warranty the dealer provides for the service. I considered doing this heavily but it means I will be stuck with the same tune until the warranty period is over so no matter what you add to the car beyond the ecu you will see no gains because you cannot retune after adding parts. This is not a factory approved program and is provided on a dealer by dealer basis according to which dealers are willing to take the risk of replacing an engine or clutch on their dime and to date according to the shop foreman at my dealership who I also went to tech school with no one has blown an engine running a dealer provided hondata unit because the tune is overly mild. He was not sure what the exact power numbers were but he was under the impression from several meetings he was involved in that it was a roughly 30hp gain over stock.
 

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@Harlaquin The correct answer to this question is...no your warranty is not void. The dealer that I take my car to is an authorized installer of the DEALER approved hondata units. They have pre cracked ecu's on hand and will swap your original out or you can pay the extra $250 core charge to keep your original unit as well as have the new one installed but YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO RETUNE THE ECU. Modification of the ecu beyond what the dealer has programmed in will absolutely void the warranty the dealer provides for the service. I considered doing this heavily but it means I will be stuck with the same tune until the warranty period is over so no matter what you add to the car beyond the ecu you will see no gains because you cannot retune after adding parts. This is not a factory approved program and is provided on a dealer by dealer basis according to which dealers are willing to take the risk of replacing an engine or clutch on their dime and to date according to the shop foreman at my dealership who I also went to tech school with no one has blown an engine running a dealer provided hondata unit because the tune is overly mild. He was not sure what the exact power numbers were but he was under the impression from several meetings he was involved in that it was a roughly 30hp gain over stock.
Yep, this. They will more than likely warranty the car as it was purchased, but it does not mean that you will be allowed to reflash the car after they do. The car will be warrantied as sold. If you change the tune or add parts, then you run the risk of voiding any warranties.
 

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Are there any options when Dealer installing such as the +R mode on startup or enabling traction control. If these aren’t part of the dealer flash, that’s a bit of a bummer but I wouldn’t be shocked. That’s probably the trade off for the simplicity, lower cost, and keeping warranty.

Actually (sorry: a bit off topic), for those who went a custom tune route, do you have the ability to tweak settings after the fact (+r mode on start, traction control). I don’t yet have experience with Hondata but past custom tunes on an STI were locked on the Cobb access port by the tuner. That would stink with all the neat features Hondata keeps releasing with new software updates. Thanks!
 


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Harlaquin

Harlaquin

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@Harlaquin The correct answer to this question is...no your warranty is not void. The dealer that I take my car to is an authorized installer of the DEALER approved hondata units. They have pre cracked ecu's on hand and will swap your original out or you can pay the extra $250 core charge to keep your original unit as well as have the new one installed but YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO RETUNE THE ECU. Modification of the ecu beyond what the dealer has programmed in will absolutely void the warranty the dealer provides for the service. I considered doing this heavily but it means I will be stuck with the same tune until the warranty period is over so no matter what you add to the car beyond the ecu you will see no gains because you cannot retune after adding parts. This is not a factory approved program and is provided on a dealer by dealer basis according to which dealers are willing to take the risk of replacing an engine or clutch on their dime and to date according to the shop foreman at my dealership who I also went to tech school with no one has blown an engine running a dealer provided hondata unit because the tune is overly mild. He was not sure what the exact power numbers were but he was under the impression from several meetings he was involved in that it was a roughly 30hp gain over stock.
ahh this would make sense then. they cover it because they control it. lame... I mean I have tunes for 3 different types of gas. I would be stuck with the same tune for one type of gas... not to mention the other variables.. ok this helps clear it up for me.
 
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Harlaquin

Harlaquin

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Are there any options when Dealer installing such as the +R mode on startup or enabling traction control. If these aren’t part of the dealer flash, that’s a bit of a bummer but I wouldn’t be shocked. That’s probably the trade off for the simplicity, lower cost, and keeping warranty.

Actually (sorry: a bit off topic), for those who went a custom tune route, do you have the ability to tweak settings after the fact (+r mode on start, traction control). I don’t yet have experience with Hondata but past custom tunes on an STI were locked on the Cobb access port by the tuner. That would stink with all the neat features Hondata keeps releasing with new software updates. Thanks!
if I had to guess they are installing the non race, emission compliance tunes.
 
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Harlaquin

Harlaquin

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I really wish Honda would take the same approach that other car manufacturers do. I believe Audi / VW, BMW, Ford and Porsche are mostly OK with tunes / performance upgrades with parts from reputable companies - such as Dinan, APR ... etc. I mean - if I install a Spoon exhaust Honda shouldn't blink an eye! Hell - the Spoon subframe brace is made in the same factory that Honda uses for OEM braces.

Honda and Hondata should be able to work together to provide performance aftermarket parts for the consumer. BMW and Dinan do this with no problems ...

It's a really upsetting that a dealership can void a powertrain warranty if they believe an exhaust or intake caused an engine failure. B/c they will fault any and all engine upgrades. No doubt about it! Even though these aftermarket parts are made with the same tolerance / testing as a OEM part.

This is me ranting ... mostly b/c I would LOVEEEE the get a Hondata on my Type R - but am NOT b/c I can't jeopardize my warranty!
Actually I had a long talk with the department at honda that handles warranty claims from dealers. They would not void a warranty over an exhaust specifically. The exhaust is warranted under a different warranty then the drive train. I actually had a dealer confirm this (one that didn't have its head up its back side) if you read the exhaust warranty due to it being a government mandated emissions item your car has to have an exhaust on it period. so if you are in the middle of nowhere and say you hit an armadillo that rips your exhaust off and there is no HONDA certified parts or dealer around the warranty on the exhaust allows for aftermarket parts. and guess what..honda has to warranty the aftermarket part. this is unique to the exhaust system only. So for that reason they cant deny a claim on powertrain over an exhaust because their exhaust warranty actually allows for aftermarket. In certain circumstances.

Should read all that fine print its awesome. Plus the dealer that did my warranty work on my brakes. knew I was tuned and all saw all my ods and even talked about them. still did the warranty work. They said they have to prove the mods caused the issue and to prove it is a big waste of time most times unless its obvious so they don't bother. IN my case paint was coming off the calipers. They said there is no why they could PROVE anything I did would cause that and trying to prove a exhaust or intake caused it would be silly.
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