Fuel/Oil Dilution Issue Overblown ?

civicdabest-foo

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I meet all 3 of those risk factors and check my oil level about every week and have never smelt gas odors from the oil.

I live in western Canada where it's well below freezing for months, drive under 2k rpm, and commonly make short trips, although most of my driving is highway. My MM is at 15% now and I just pulled the dipstick, it looks like oil that needs to be changed and it did not smell profusely of gas. I ride a 2 stroke dirt bike and am very familiar with the smell of gas.
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dougb

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Just traded my 17 Civic touring. In 36,000
miles I had the oil analyzed 3 times and each time my oil was either just below 5
percent or over 5 percent . There doesn't seem to be any acknowledgement by Honda that there is a problem with the Civic. Fixes have been for the CR-V. The 2.0 turbo in the Accord is not direct injection so hopefully there won't be any problem with oil dilution. The service manager at Honda said there wasn't a problem even after I showed him the lab results with over 5 percent dilution. Very disappointed with Honda. I looked at the Camry but they are having a hesitation problem with their new 8 speed transmission. Again Toyota won't admit that there is a problem.
 

Design

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Dilution alone isn't a problem.

Now if your wear metals are creeping up, or viscosity sees a huge drop, that's something to be concerned over. But Honda's MM logic doesn't appear to allow that to happen.

If you haven't already, you should share your UOAs with the larger community. :cool:
 

IDriveACivic

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Just traded my 17 Civic touring. In 36,000
miles I had the oil analyzed 3 times and each time my oil was either just below 5
percent or over 5 percent . There doesn't seem to be any acknowledgement by Honda that there is a problem with the Civic. Fixes have been for the CR-V. The 2.0 turbo in the Accord is not direct injection so hopefully there won't be any problem with oil dilution. The service manager at Honda said there wasn't a problem even after I showed him the lab results with over 5 percent dilution. Very disappointed with Honda. I looked at the Camry but they are having a hesitation problem with their new 8 speed transmission. Again Toyota won't admit that there is a problem.
For which car did you trade in the Civic?
 


Hondaman_MI

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Was dilution affecting your performance? I hope it works out. The new Accords are good looking cars. Some have complained about the hood fluttering on the Accords. The Accord and Insight use aluminium hoods apparently. I looked into the new Camry too, but don't want to deal with transmission problems. Some said on the Camry forum, even after it was reprogrammed they still had issues with it.
 
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Gruber

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The 2.0 turbo in the Accord is not direct injection so hopefully there won't be any problem with oil dilution.
Really? Accord 2.0T is not DI? That's wild, weird stuff! I did not know that.
In any case, I hope you got rid of your "problem".

"The 2018 Accord 2.0T's VTEC Turbo® direct-injected DOHC inline-4 engine develops 252 peak horsepower (SAE net) and 273 lb.-ft. of torque (SAE net). The Accord 2.0T is available in Sport, EX-L, EX-L Navi and Touring trims, and in its most efficient guise (EX-L and EX-L Navi) earns EPA fuel economy ratings of up to 23/34/27 mpg (city/highway/combined)."
 
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Aurelleah

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What do you mean by "should be"? Because you wish it and you will throw a fit if it's otherwise?

It has never been fine to drive most of the time a mile or two before letting the car to cool down
Naturally aspirated cars dont need to idle before shutdown. That's a turbo-specific thing, to allow the turbo to cool more slowly to avoid thermally shocking it, which could over time cause damage like cracking in the turbine.
 

Aurelleah

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Dilution alone isn't a problem.

Now if your wear metals are creeping up, or viscosity sees a huge drop, that's something to be concerned over. But Honda's MM logic doesn't appear to allow that to happen.

If you haven't already, you should share your UOAs with the larger community. :cool:
I dont suspect the maintenance minder system has sensors in place that detect oil viscosity, wear metals, etc. I dont know if it even factors in driving style, im at 40% at 5600km's and Ive driven it hard a lot after breakin. Like, once a week go for a spirited-drive-to-vtec type evening,
 


VooDoo1

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This is BS engineering. A car should not have any issues, weather it’s driven 6 minutes or 60min, in cold or hot weather. You shouldn’t need to take out a checklist before every run. Sometimes we need to drive only a mile down the road, and that should be perfectly fine.
Avoid short distance drives...my ass!
I agree completely. My daily commute is just under 1 mile, in warmer California climate, and I have no oil dilution problem. I do enjoy the longer spirited runs on the weekends. Just keep it maintained per the maintenance minder, all will be fine. Honda has some of the best engineers in the business.
 

gtman

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I agree completely. My daily commute is just under 1 mile, in warmer California climate, and I have no oil dilution problem. I do enjoy the longer spirited runs on the weekends. Just keep it maintained per the maintenance minder, all will be fine. Honda has some of the best engineers in the business.
You definitely bring up a valid point but long before all this talk of oil dilution and DI engines, the rule of thumb was short drives were worse for the engine than long drives. On a short one mile drive, the oil never really reaches normal operating temps. Of course, you being in a warm climate helps.
 

Gruber

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Naturally aspirated cars dont need to idle before shutdown. That's a turbo-specific thing, to allow the turbo to cool more slowly to avoid thermally shocking it, which could over time cause damage like cracking in the turbine.
I'm afraid you misunderstood what I said, or I didn't say it clearly enough.

By: "It has never been fine to drive most of the time a mile or two before letting the car cool down" I simply mean driving short trips.
I added "before letting the car cool down" because some people think that a lot of errand running from store to store also counts as short trips. It doesn't, as long as the engine remains hot for a longer time.

I didn't mean any "idling before shutdown." I don't ever do it with my civicx , but it shouldn't cause oil dilution anyway, so it's not relevant to this discussion.
Still, this practice is NOT to "allow the turbo to cool more slowly. " It's the opposite, to cool the turbo faster. In some cars, if you turn the car off while the turbo is very hot, the cooling circulation stops, and the turbo and its surroundings remain hot for a longer time, possibly frying the stationary oil in the bearings or whatever else sits close to the turbo.
 

Design

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I dont suspect the maintenance minder system has sensors in place that detect oil viscosity, wear metals, etc. I dont know if it even factors in driving style, im at 40% at 5600km's and Ive driven it hard a lot after breakin. Like, once a week go for a spirited-drive-to-vtec type evening,
The MM factors drive cycles based on start/stop/mileage (and a host of other factors). We have some members being forced to swap their oil as early as every 3-3.5K.
https://www.civicx.com/threads/maintenance-minder-is-at-50-with-only-1-682-miles.29141/

To be clear, dilution does not indicate there's a problem. All TCDI powertrains are subject to some form of it. What matters is viscosity and wear rate - both of which can be accurately measured through oil sampling.
 
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Hondaman_MI

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Page 113: "Turbocharger* Precautions The engine uses an exhaust-driven turbocharger to generate extra power. The turbocharger is a precision device that can spin at over 100,000 rpm and reach temperatures over 1,292F (700C). It is lubricated and cooled by engine oil. Be sure to follow these precautions to help prevent turbocharger damage. • Always change the engine oil according to the Maintenance Minder. • Always allow the engine to warm before revving it or accelerating in a spirited way."

Cooling the turbo down isn't mention in the manual. This is my first turbo car. It seems like if you take it easy on acceleration a few miles before parking, it would help cool down the turbo. Is the Civic a water cooled turbo or does it have another method to cool down?
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