Clutch and flywheel replacement

[etd]

I'm sorry to post on this forum here but I'm not sure where the best place to turn to is.

So the service department at the dealership is going to charge me $3100 for a new clutch and flywheel on my 2018 Civic Si because they're saying it's driver error. The car has less than 20k miles on it, and I have an extremely hard time believing that's the sole cause. I really, really don't think I drive a manual that badly, I don't ride the clutch and I didn't learn to drive a manual on this car, and no one drives the car other than me. I accelerate faster than most people, probably, but I don't know how much that would affect things. Everything is stock. I had an old manual Civic that I got well above 100k before I had to get the clutch replaced, which is another reason I don't think it's my fault, but, I don't know what to do other than to tell the guy working on the car to document everything and be very open-minded or whatever.

Could I be completely wrong here? I'm trying to be open to that possibility but I just can't believe a car I've owned for less than a year and a half would have this problem.

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[repeet]

I'm a jackrabbit too, but I've got over 60,000 miles on my Si without any clutch slippage. Unless you regularly "dump" your clutch, I'm guessing that you deserve a warranty repair.

If you can't get any dealers around you to fix it under warranty, I'd be looking at an after market flywheel and clutch solution. As a matter of fact, if you wore out the stock clutch and flywheel in under 20,000 miles, you probably need a tougher clutch.

 

[DRuby]

I agree with your position.

If the clutch/flywheel was misused, there should be some evidence in the housing. Burned clutch material, glazed clutch or flywheel surfaces, perhaps flywheel overheating discoloring (just guessing here), gouged flywheel surfaces or just some indications of distressed materials.

If so, would a weak clutch pressure spring be the cause?

Also to back up, what caused this issue in the first place? Slipping or something else. If you can use the car, maybe start bucking this issue up the Honda management chain before agreeing to the $3k bill.

 

[Mcclaughry95]

Tell them to prove it. And look at the clutch and fly. In stock form it's nearly impossible to destroy the clutch. Delay valve is in place so the only way to fail is riding the clutch.

 

[jakabony]

1. Ask them to prove it.
2. Get Honda corporate involved.
3. If they somehow do deny it as a warranty claim, go with an aftermarket clutch/flywheel solution. You will be in the $1600-1700 range out the door for a better clutch/flywheel and a much better driving experience.
4. Get it installed by a reputable mechanic who has done one before. That $1600-1700 price will not be from a dealer.

 

[caspar21]

by your description the only way i can see it being your fault is if you get hard on the power before the clutch is fully released or if you rest your foot on the clutch pedal while driving, smoking the thrust bearing.

other than that.. fight it.

 

[FlexOnTheseKids]

I'm sorry to post on this forum here but I'm not sure where the best place to turn to is.

So the service department at the dealership is going to charge me $3100 for a new clutch and flywheel on my 2018 Civic Si because they're saying it's driver error. The car has less than 20k miles on it, and I have an extremely hard time believing that's the sole cause. I really, really don't think I drive a manual that badly, I don't ride the clutch and I didn't learn to drive a manual on this car, and no one drives the car other than me. I accelerate faster than most people, probably, but I don't know how much that would affect things. Everything is stock. I had an old manual Civic that I got well above 100k before I had to get the clutch replaced, which is another reason I don't think it's my fault, but, I don't know what to do other than to tell the guy working on the car to document everything and be very open-minded or whatever.

Could I be completely wrong here? I'm trying to be open to that possibility but I just can't believe a car I've owned for less than a year and a half would have this problem.

Could you update us on what happen afterwards?

 

[amirza786]

I am not saying this applies to you, but there was a guy previously on this forum (I am sure everyone remembers) who complained about his clutch and flywheel going bad and the dealer blaming it on him and charging him. He claimed he "babied" his car and never abused it, and also that his car was completely stock. He fought with the dealer and they finally reluctantly covered his clutch and flywheel under warranty. Everyone was dumping on the dealership, calling them crooks and whatnot. Well it turned out that some eagle eye member dug into some older posts by this member, and it turned out that not only was he tuned, had done some major modifications like a new turbo, and had bragged about all the pulls he does. And not only that, he had posted about a money shift he did into second gear at 80 mph. Let's just say that his post became the biggest dump on a person I have ever seen, so bad the thread was locked by a moderator, and he was kicked off the forum.

Again I am not saying that is the case here, clutches and flywheels can be defective, but 9 out of 10 times I have seen where people have "issues" with their cars, it has been a self inflicted wound

 

[Dan9908]

I bought a new/leftover Si in January. My throwout bearing took a crap on me around 3700 miles. I recorded it when I first heard it and it became much worse. It wasn’t quick as I don’t drive the car every day, but- my dealer replaced the clutch components and the bearing- with 0 issue or finger pointing

I’m very experienced with a manual transmission. This is my 6-7th car, with 0 replacements

 

[consensual_induction]

I learned stick at 16, and youd know if it was your fault.

-Did you smell roasted squirrel carcasses for like...every outing for weeks? if not you didnt fry your clutch.
-Sometimes the rev hang (which wtf is up with this car and rev hang btw) requires you to do..everything...more slowly/wait more, but i think youd feel the car jerking if you let the clutch out while rpm was still falling, and since you know how to drive stick, im assuming you weren't feeling an earthquake every grocery run?
-you can prove it wasn't you by the following method:

some nice ones
-ask to see the pattern of damage to the c/f combo. Ask politely if they have never ever seen a clutch with that pattern before from a customer they knew drove well (or a family member friend etc).
-if they dont have the clutch after the install, with fake remorse, say you cannot accept blame if they cannot provide evidence. If they argue this point, ask for the manager.
-Say your last car had 100k miles on it, your current car is the same type of car (i know i know just say it ), and they need reasonable basis to believe that u caused the failure. they can btw.
- ANNOY THE HELL OUT OF THEM (politely) by refusing to leave and refusing to pay by just asking to talk to different managers, mechanics, look at other peoples clutches, show other cases of parts with damage from user error, ask if you can dig through the trash for your old clutch, say your card got declined, say you trust them but just wana double check with HR or corporate and dawdle on ur phone and dont leave till they threaten to call the cops

some douchey ones
-ask if the clutch is 'glazed' or aka an organic clutch (has a layer or two that is safe to fry basically). regardless of their answer, user error on a clutch- glazed or not, wouldnt rear up at 20k miles. This eliminates "you just learned stick"
-ask them to look at ecu logs. It stores a LOT of stuff. They can see that you werent WOT 24/7 (or if you were) (and if youre tuned) but wont volunteer to do that since they want to charge 3k
- ask them what kind of user error makes a clutch go at 20k, besides launching, which the ecu logs and type of damage will show wasnt the case
-ask them to test drive your car after install. if they even ride the clutch for a millisecond, ask them why they are committing user error and insist that it was them moving the car around the lot/previous test drivers that caused it.

 

[amirza786]

I learned stick at 16, and youd know if it was your fault.

-Did you smell roasted squirrel carcasses for like...every outing for weeks? if not you didnt fry your clutch.
-Sometimes the rev hang (which wtf is up with this car and rev hang btw) requires you to do..everything...more slowly/wait more, but i think youd feel the car jerking if you let the clutch out while rpm was still falling, and since you know how to drive stick, im assuming you weren't feeling an earthquake every grocery run?
-you can prove it wasn't you by the following method:

some nice ones
-ask to see the pattern of damage to the c/f combo. Ask politely if they have never ever seen a clutch with that pattern before from a customer they knew drove well (or a family member friend etc).
-if they dont have the clutch after the install, with fake remorse, say you cannot accept blame if they cannot provide evidence. If they argue this point, ask for the manager.
-Say your last car had 100k miles on it, your current car is the same type of car (i know i know just say it ), and they need reasonable basis to believe that u caused the failure. they can btw.
- ANNOY THE HELL OUT OF THEM (politely) by refusing to leave and refusing to pay by just asking to talk to different managers, mechanics, look at other peoples clutches, show other cases of parts with damage from user error, ask if you can dig through the trash for your old clutch, say your card got declined, say you trust them but just wana double check with HR or corporate and dawdle on ur phone and dont leave till they threaten to call the cops

some douchey ones
-ask if the clutch is 'glazed' or aka an organic clutch (has a layer or two that is safe to fry basically). regardless of their answer, user error on a clutch- glazed or not, wouldnt rear up at 20k miles. This eliminates "you just learned stick"
-ask them to look at ecu logs. It stores a LOT of stuff. They can see that you werent WOT 24/7 (or if you were) (and if youre tuned) but wont volunteer to do that since they want to charge 3k
- ask them what kind of user error makes a clutch go at 20k, besides launching, which the ecu logs and type of damage will show wasnt the case
-ask them to test drive your car after install. if they even ride the clutch for a millisecond, ask them why they are committing user error and insist that it was them moving the car around the lot/previous test drivers that caused it.

Actually rev hang does not affect shifting one bit. It is more of a mental block which causes people to hesitate during shifts and can be easily overcome. I disabled rev hang thru Ktuner, and I hated it. The engine RPM's would drop too fast causing the car to jerk between shifts. I ended up re-enabling rev hang and am totally used to it. Only the sound is annoying, but now even that no longer bothers me

 

[consensual_induction]

Actually rev hang does not affect shifting one bit. It is more of a mental block which causes people to hesitate during shifts and can be easily overcome. I disabled rev hang thru Ktuner, and I hated it. The engine RPM's would drop too fast causing the car to jerk between shifts. I ended up re-enabling rev hang and am totally used to it. Only the sound is annoying, but now even that no longer bothers me

yes, i totally agree! i meant if you dont get used to it you can let clutch out super fast and the car does jerk a bit. Im guessing here tho.

Off topic, i was about to buy a ktuner, but am stunned to hear you preferred the stock rpm drop! you couldnt get used to the ktuner? or actually prefer slower drop? ive never had any other car ever hang like this one.

 

[amirza786]

yes, i totally agree! i meant if you dont get used to it you can let clutch out super fast and the car does jerk a bit. Im guessing here tho.

Off topic, i was about to buy a ktuner, but am stunned to hear you preferred the stock rpm drop! you couldnt get used to the ktuner? or actually prefer slower drop? ive never had any other car ever hang like this one.

I purchased the Ktuner thru Two Step Performance and installed their TSP Stage 1 tune which disables rev hang by default. After about 2 weeks of driving with rev hang disabled, I could not stand it because the rpm drop is rapid and would cause the car to jerk, especially in stop and go traffic, so I reflashed the stage 1 tune again but this time unchecked the "disable rev hang" box to re-enable rev hang and like it much better.

One of the benefits of rev hang is that when you let off the gas, a vacuum in the engine is not created so unburned oil and fuel are not sucked into the exhaust

 

[consensual_induction]

I purchased the Ktuner thru Two Step Performance and installed their TSP Stage 1 tune which disables rev hang by default. After about 2 weeks of driving with rev hang disabled, I could not stand it because the rpm drop is rapid and would cause the car to jerk, especially in stop and go traffic, so I reflashed the stage 1 tune again but this time unchecked the "disable rev hang" box to re-enable rev hang and like it much better.

One of the benefits of rev hang is that when you let off the gas, a vacuum in the engine is not created so unburned oil and fuel are not sucked into the exhaust

very informative, thank you for sharing.

 

[Neps18Si]

I am not saying this applies to you, but there was a guy previously on this forum (I am sure everyone remembers) who complained about his clutch and flywheel going bad and the dealer blaming it on him and charging him. He claimed he "babied" his car and never abused it, and also that his car was completely stock. He fought with the dealer and they finally reluctantly covered his clutch and flywheel under warranty. Everyone was dumping on the dealership, calling them crooks and whatnot. Well it turned out that some eagle eye member dug into some older posts by this member, and it turned out that not only was he tuned, had done some major modifications like a new turbo, and had bragged about all the pulls he does. And not only that, he had posted about a money shift he did into second gear at 80 mph. Let's just say that his post became the biggest dump on a person I have ever seen, so bad the thread was locked by a moderator, and he was kicked off the forum.

Again I am not saying that is the case here, clutches and flywheels can be defective, but 9 out of 10 times I have seen where people have "issues" with their cars, it has been a self inflicted wound

I was thinking the same thing lol.

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