2019 Type-R track review

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I will say I wish the car had more rotation to counter it's tendency to understeer.

I'll be instructing with TrackDaze & NASA @ VIR next week and I am going to experiment with more pressure in the rears to reduce traction.

This car is so well balanced, you'd really have to do something ham-fisted to induce a spin.

It just needs more grip and specifically more front grip.

If I keep this car, I would probably put a set of wider Forgeline 18" rims on it for track duty & run r-comps or slicks.

The Contis simply are not up to the task of running advanced run-group paces.
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I will say I wish the car had more rotation to counter it's tendency to understeer.
What you can try for almost free is 1. doing the front camber "mod" (pulling out the factory pins) 2. getting an alignment 3. and while you're at it, setting rear toe to 0. Just be sensible on cold tires afterwards ;)
 
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The pin removal mod made no appreciable difference (that I could tell) at VIR.

I may try the other options soon.

Are there well-know (i.e. tested) track alignment specs for the Type-R like there are for the Z06?
 

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Thanks for these posts. Its hard to find actual track experience for many cars, and as we know few work out the box on track.

I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on.

I understand any car will need pads and brake fluid to really work on track.

What has me concerned are the overheat issues, some have them others not, are the 19's mostly cured of this, curious would 100 octane help?. Ill be running on 50-85 degree days. Don't mind changing the grill but would leave the car mostly stock, it needs to be reliable and work on road too. Ie is it a playful car on track, you can lean on all day without overheat forcing you to hold back/slow down.

Then theres the front tire issue, does swapping front to back etc during the day get one to 4 days? I figure I would do 3-6 days on track in this car per year, ususaly running 25-35 mins 4-5x per day. Or is there a better tire for trackdays, seems like maybe the 19 rim from the previous Gen r has the correct ofsets.
What oil and transmission oil are you all using, how frequently are you changing.

For road use, 2-4 days per week, a round trip of 150 miles 100 highway and 50 miles epic back roads. How do these cars work on highway, and do they work in winter, ie sometimes some snow, or what tires for winter.

Im looking for a stock car that works, hassle free experience(besides tires pads and fluids) that I can ocasionaly track when the mood strikes and the other cars are down etc. Run mostly The glen and LRP with some Monticello thrown in.
Have thought of a mustang or older vette, but those are not as useable, nor work in winter. Don't care about 0-60 but in gear acceleration is important as is a tight handling car for back roads.

Im also 55 and so past the need to haul kids around, but a back seat is nice.
Love the look of the thing in darker colors, its puposefull and special.

So will it work on track, and be comfortable enough on highway, ie not boinging about.

Also are ypu guys just using the seatbelts on track, or is there a simple harness setup.

An outside alternative woudl be a used Gt350, but that is probably less of a road car but maybe so much fun its a cant miss. But as nothing short of aGt3 on slicks is as fast as the exige really ultimate laptime is not the objective here, its about fun and use..
 

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Thanks for these posts. Its hard to find actual track experience for many cars, and as we know few work out the box on track.

I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on.

I understand any car will need pads and brake fluid to really work on track.

What has me concerned are the overheat issues, some have them others not, are the 19's mostly cured of this, curious would 100 octane help?. Ill be running on 50-85 degree days. Don't mind changing the grill but would leave the car mostly stock, it needs to be reliable and work on road too. Ie is it a playful car on track, you can lean on all day without overheat forcing you to hold back/slow down.

Then theres the front tire issue, does swapping front to back etc during the day get one to 4 days? I figure I would do 3-6 days on track in this car per year, ususaly running 25-35 mins 4-5x per day. Or is there a better tire for trackdays, seems like maybe the 19 rim from the previous Gen r has the correct ofsets.
What oil and transmission oil are you all using, how frequently are you changing.

For road use, 2-4 days per week, a round trip of 150 miles 100 highway and 50 miles epic back roads. How do these cars work on highway, and do they work in winter, ie sometimes some snow, or what tires for winter.

Im looking for a stock car that works, hassle free experience(besides tires pads and fluids) that I can ocasionaly track when the mood strikes and the other cars are down etc. Run mostly The glen and LRP with some Monticello thrown in.
Have thought of a mustang or older vette, but those are not as useable, nor work in winter. Don't care about 0-60 but in gear acceleration is important as is a tight handling car for back roads.

Im also 55 and so past the need to haul kids around, but a back seat is nice.
Love the look of the thing in darker colors, its puposefull and special.

So will it work on track, and be comfortable enough on highway, ie not boinging about.

Also are ypu guys just using the seatbelts on track, or is there a simple harness setup.

An outside alternative woudl be a used Gt350, but that is probably less of a road car but maybe so much fun its a cant miss. But as nothing short of aGt3 on slicks is as fast as the exige really ultimate laptime is not the objective here, its about fun and use..
Stock pads and fluid are fine for shorter sessions. You will get a lot of pad transfer if you push though. You can pull factory guide pins for a bit more camber, but the front tires will get shredded if you try to trail brake into tight corners - you have to run a lot of PSI to at least reduce sidewall rollover (no way to eliminate it) and that makes the car understeer in lower speed stuff. I would recommend light/smaller 18" wheels with track appropriate tires (888R or RE-71 or something similar).

Overheating is a problem for all model years. Grille change plus running heater on max and keeping sessions short (20-30 mins) helps, as does running water wetter. In sub 80F temps, you should have a better chance of avoiding limp mode due to heat, but it's always a potential.

If you want something that will work out of the box on track, get a Porsche. The CTR is advertised as a track ready car, but really can only handle short stints when totally stock.
 


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You write: "I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on."

  • I'd say that the R ticks all the boxes except for use in snow.
  • It does not "have to have" pads and fluid but after a few track days you might as well upgrade a little and flush
  • The stock seat belts and seats are great but there is a seat belt based "plug-in" harness that is a nice addition
  • IMO as stated numerous times you can run this car at 7/10th to 9/10th all day long and have nothing but fun and no issues. If you want to drive it like your track day car at 10/10ths it ain't gonna work.
  • And ditch the stock wheels and tires for a nice 18" and some Michelin Pilot's.
I'm a few years older than you are and have plenty of track time in a track car too.
You'll have a blast in the R if you play within its limits.
Don't jump down the cooling issue rabbit hole... water wetter and forget it.
Nothing is worth throwing $10,000 at with the hope of a fix for a problem that might not exist.
Drive it and enjoy it for what it is.

Just IMO.
 
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Thanks for these posts. Its hard to find actual track experience for many cars, and as we know few work out the box on track.

I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on.

I understand any car will need pads and brake fluid to really work on track.

[DH] For novices and lower intermediates, the stock pads will likely be fine. As always, it is recommended to at least replace the fluid with high-temp racing fluid.

What has me concerned are the overheat issues, some have them others not, are the 19's mostly cured of this, curious would 100 octane help?. Ill be running on 50-85 degree days. Don't mind changing the grill but would leave the car mostly stock, it needs to be reliable and work on road too. Ie is it a playful car on track, you can lean on all day without overheat forcing you to hold back/slow down.

[DH] Higher octane make no difference on a stock tune. I ran several sessions on a tank of Sunoco 100 just for shits and giggles. No perceptible difference in power, driveability, or temps. I instructed at 10 events since March at VIR. Once I got the initial bugs sorted (i.e. never go out on track with less than a half tank), the car has been bulletproof. I got one over-temp message on a scorching upper-90's day, but it did not go into limp mode. Lot's of ther cars had issues with heat that day so I don't think it was specific to the Type-R. The car does run hot though. Another time it seems to be getting really hot, I just blasted the heat on full for the remainder of the session and the engine temps dropped..

Then theres the front tire issue, does swapping front to back etc during the day get one to 4 days? I figure I would do 3-6 days on track in this car per year, ususaly running 25-35 mins 4-5x per day. Or is there a better tire for trackdays, seems like maybe the 19 rim from the previous Gen r has the correct ofsets.
What oil and transmission oil are you all using, how frequently are you changing.

[DH] Rotating helps. At the very least after each weekend/event. The main culprit is insufficient pressure. I have not tried 18" or 19" wheels, so I cannot offer any insight. I use Mobil1 0w-20 EP. Have not changed the transmission fluid.


For road use, 2-4 days per week, a round trip of 150 miles 100 highway and 50 miles epic back roads. How do these cars work on highway, and do they work in winter, ie sometimes some snow, or what tires for winter.

[DH] IMO this is an awesome road car. I use mine as a DD & we take it on occasional long road trips. 30+ MPG noodling around on the street too. :)


Im looking for a stock car that works, hassle free experience(besides tires pads and fluids) that I can ocasionaly track when the mood strikes and the other cars are down etc. Run mostly The glen and LRP with some Monticello thrown in.
Have thought of a mustang or older vette, but those are not as useable, nor work in winter. Don't care about 0-60 but in gear acceleration is important as is a tight handling car for back roads.

[DH] I don't think this car would work well in snow, but I have no experience as of yet. We have a 2018 CR-V FWD that is terrible in snow. In just a few inches, could not get out of our neighborhood. Had to use my RAM 1500 4WD.

Im also 55 and so past the need to haul kids around, but a back seat is nice.
Love the look of the thing in darker colors, its puposefull and special.

[DH] I'm almost 51. :) The sheer versatility of this car is really cool. My C7 Z06 is also versatile, but not as much as the Type-R.

So will it work on track, and be comfortable enough on highway, ie not boinging about.

Also are ypu guys just using the seatbelts on track, or is there a simple harness setup.

[DH] I have the OEM 3-point. In my Z06, I have a harness bar & 6-points. Sounds like there are harness setups you can use in conjunction with the OEM setup.

An outside alternative woudl be a used Gt350, but that is probably less of a road car but maybe so much fun its a cant miss. But as nothing short of aGt3 on slicks is as fast as the exige really ultimate laptime is not the objective here, its about fun and use..
 
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You write: "I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on."

  • I'd say that the R ticks all the boxes except for use in snow.
  • It does not "have to have" pads and fluid but after a few track days you might as well upgrade a little and flush
  • The stock seat belts and seats are great but there is a seat belt based "plug-in" harness that is a nice addition
  • IMO as stated numerous times you can run this car at 7/10th to 9/10th all day long and have nothing but fun and no issues. If you want to drive it like your track day car at 10/10ths it ain't gonna work.
  • And ditch the stock wheels and tires for a nice 18" and some Michelin Pilot's.
I'm a few years older than you are and have plenty of track time in a track car too.
You'll have a blast in the R if you play within its limits.
Don't jump down the cooling issue rabbit hole... water wetter and forget it.
Nothing is worth throwing $10,000 at with the hope of a fix for a problem that might not exist.
Drive it and enjoy it for what it is.

Just IMO.

Curious why you think this car cannot be driven 10/10ths without issue in stock trim? Sure, it isn't a gutted track car, but as an instructor and former racer myself, I beat the living snot out of this car all year long at VIR without major issues (other than tires and lots of brake pads/rotors).
 
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Stock pads and fluid are fine for shorter sessions. You will get a lot of pad transfer if you push though. You can pull factory guide pins for a bit more camber, but the front tires will get shredded if you try to trail brake into tight corners - you have to run a lot of PSI to at least reduce sidewall rollover (no way to eliminate it) and that makes the car understeer in lower speed stuff. I would recommend light/smaller 18" wheels with track appropriate tires (888R or RE-71 or something similar).

Overheating is a problem for all model years. Grille change plus running heater on max and keeping sessions short (20-30 mins) helps, as does running water wetter. In sub 80F temps, you should have a better chance of avoiding limp mode due to heat, but it's always a potential.

If you want something that will work out of the box on track, get a Porsche. The CTR is advertised as a track ready car, but really can only handle short stints when totally stock.
Well, I have had students in late model Porsche's who have had issues in their box stock cars on track. No street car is perfect in a track environment. That being said, are Porsche's generally more track-ready OOB; 'yes'.
 

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You write: "I have a lotus exige v6 cup car on slicks as a dedicated track car, and a stock elise I sometime track on 888r's because its just fun, seat time and I can drive the elise to the track unlike the exige which is truck trailer load up etc.

For most road driving Ive been in Honda HRV which does its job but is souless.
Looking for something fun on road that I can ocasionaly just take to the track for the day, not looking for ultimate lap times compared to other cars, but dont hold back so car that wilts after 3 laps is not on."

  • I'd say that the R ticks all the boxes except for use in snow.
  • It does not "have to have" pads and fluid but after a few track days you might as well upgrade a little and flush
  • The stock seat belts and seats are great but there is a seat belt based "plug-in" harness that is a nice addition
  • IMO as stated numerous times you can run this car at 7/10th to 9/10th all day long and have nothing but fun and no issues. If you want to drive it like your track day car at 10/10ths it ain't gonna work.
  • And ditch the stock wheels and tires for a nice 18" and some Michelin Pilot's.
I'm a few years older than you are and have plenty of track time in a track car too.
You'll have a blast in the R if you play within its limits.
Don't jump down the cooling issue rabbit hole... water wetter and forget it.
Nothing is worth throwing $10,000 at with the hope of a fix for a problem that might not exist.
Drive it and enjoy it for what it is.

Just IMO.
Thanks for your response.
Lol we keep reading that these cars are only for kids.
Where can the seatbelt harness be found?
Yeah have no desire to try solve the cooling problem, Im not looking for a science experiment.
 


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Stock pads and fluid are fine for shorter sessions. You will get a lot of pad transfer if you push though. You can pull factory guide pins for a bit more camber, but the front tires will get shredded if you try to trail brake into tight corners - you have to run a lot of PSI to at least reduce sidewall rollover (no way to eliminate it) and that makes the car understeer in lower speed stuff. I would recommend light/smaller 18" wheels with track appropriate tires (888R or RE-71 or something similar).

Overheating is a problem for all model years. Grille change plus running heater on max and keeping sessions short (20-30 mins) helps, as does running water wetter. In sub 80F temps, you should have a better chance of avoiding limp mode due to heat, but it's always a potential.

If you want something that will work out of the box on track, get a Porsche. The CTR is advertised as a track ready car, but really can only handle short stints when totally stock.
What sort of PSI do you run in the fronts, and how long do they last?

Ugh, not a porche, the only ones there really make sense are Gt3s(which are rough on street and $$$$) and the Gt4, which is sorta cool, but my exige is quicker than both of those. Yeah i know porche makes great quality stuff, and if I had the $$$ for sa Gt3 maybe. Actualy Id probably spend the 180K for a Gt3 on Gt350,CTR and a Challenger.

Friend just sold his cayman Gts to get a used exige after one drive in a lotus.
 

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djhartm
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Thanks for your coments.
Its good you find the car very versatile its what I'm looking for.
What pads do you use, do you swap pads at the track from street to track etc.
How long do rotors last, are you suing aftermarket ones.
With rotations each day on track, how long to tires last.

I wonder why your overheat issues have been less than others.

Windows open and running heat is Ok, what i cant handle is having to back off every 3 laps.

i was thinking maybe 100 octane would burn cooler, but if its no difference thats a great $ savings by running 93.
The exige cup burns 100 at 6-8 mpg full tilt, each day adds up. The elise uses 93 and gets 11mpg full tilt on track.

im curious why the CTR wont work in snow with the right tires, it does have a lsd so should work.

What i really need to do is keep the HRV for snow get a CTR for winter wen theres no snow and a GT350, alas...
 

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Curious why you think this car cannot be driven 10/10ths without issue in stock trim? Sure, it isn't a gutted track car, but as an instructor and former racer myself, I beat the living snot out of this car all year long at VIR without major issues (other than tires and lots of brake pads/rotors).
Like I said, just my opinion.
Everything I have ever read about the overheat issue is when folks are running at places like VIR at the peak of summer and wringing the neck out of the car.
Maybe your years and years of experience means you drive the car in a manner where you are very fast and pushing hard but not "over-driving" it? That would be my guess.
And ---- if you don't have any issues at VIR in the summer then I can't believe that it isn't something people are doing over some inherent flaw in the design of the car. (maybe?)


FWIW I'd guess the car is down abut 20% on power from an 85 degree day to a 58 degree day!
 

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Like I said, just my opinion.
Everything I have ever read about the overheat issue is when folks are running at places like VIR at the peak of summer and wringing the neck out of the car.
Maybe your years and years of experience means you drive the car in a manner where you are very fast and pushing hard but not "over-driving" it? That would be my guess.
And ---- if you don't have any issues at VIR in the summer then I can't believe that it isn't something people are doing over some inherent flaw in the design of the car. (maybe?)


FWIW I'd guess the car is down abut 20% on power from an 85 degree day to a 58 degree day!

I was also thinking the overdriving may be a cause for some. Could also be that shorter tracks have lower speeds and less airflow at high revs.

i also read the CTR has a exhaust manifold with coolant running though it, that and the oil cooler uses the coolant too, all adding lots of extra heat.
Still its surprising that even adding an air/oil oilcooler and grille dont have a marked effect on cooling. No one seems to have tried a 70/30 water coolant mix either.

if bigger radiators dont help, then its an airflow issue as much as anything else.
I wonder if a freer flowing grille and removing the fake vents behind the front wheels will let the air flow through adequately to solve the issue.

Heat for sure is the enemey of blown motors, most ecu's retard timing and richen the mixture to stave off problems, not surprised theres a 20% power reduction on a really hot day.

On the exige which is a non intercooled supercharged V6, we went to a full motec ecu becuase the stock ecu was dialing back power after 3 laps for unfathomable reasons. There was no overheat or even hot coolantt, its just that stock ecus don't actualy read that many parameters and therefore extrapolate data. Part of their job is to make cats live for 80k miles and a whole host of other non track requirements. Additionaly most stock ECUs dont really run off the oxygen sensors once up in the higher revs.

What we found was that the stock ecu was dialing back power 20%+ once things got hot(but not overtemp), that throttle response sucked and there was little point in the last 5-700 rpm once hot. the ecu was dumping fuel and pulling timing, probably because an internal hard calibration said the cats would melt .

By contrast with the motec there is only a 8% power loss when things are really hot(which will happen with any car) and it pulls cleanly to redline all the time, so actual on track speed is markedly improved. Between Motec and catless headers the car gained 40hp and heaps of tq everywhere.(400hp and 302ftlbs in a 2400lbs car)

My guess is the Honda ecu is throwing lots of fuel at the motor once it starts getting hot and pulling timing, hence the 20% power loss in summer, possibly an bigger intercooler may help intake temps but that will at best marginaly delay the rise in coolant temp which seems to be the real culprit as opposed to IAT.
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