10th Gen Si Owner Abuses and Blows Motor

[TypeSiR]

Sometimes negative publicity is better than no publicity in this age of social/YouTube media: viewership is everything. What’s the worst that can happen? Blown CVT? Cha-Ching!

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[gtman]

Sometimes negative publicity is better than no publicity in this age of social/YouTube media: viewership is everything. What’s the worst that can happen? Blown CVT? Cha-Ching!

Yep. I think this .gif probably explains some of Youtube guy's thinking...

 

[charleswrivers]

Theories aside... the tune did make good power. There's convenience to running straight E85 vice mixing. Running straight E85 vice ~E37 should be better. You should need a greater volume of fuel due to it's lower BTU content. That greater volume should provide even more cooling off a fuel that's easier to vaporize (double whammy).

What I don't get is why, if the cars fuel system, due to narrow injection windows, is unable to properly supple the fuel so straight E85 cars run hot and lean and kill themselves is why it isn't caught during their tuning sessions.

I myself, who've never run E85 in anything in my life have read up on it long before getting this Civic and it was always folks running straight E85 in the Z crowd... not intentionally blending. I didn't see the purpose behind it on ours either when I first was reading and hearing the "run E35-E40" for the most power. Even if that was sufficient to effectively make the car no longer be knock-limited, I didn't realize that some injection windows for DI made it's possible duty cycle way less. For FI, I think it's only like, what... 30% more fuel, so you need 30% more of the existing duty cycle to work. Still comfortably under 100%? You're good. Not on ours though.

Anyways... any tune... weak or powerful in power... can kill an engine if it's done improperly. Building the engine up to run hot and lean on E85 again seems like a good way to wreck a built engine. Rods won't matter. More durable pistons could hang in there longer. Same valves? Eh... it doesn't sound like a good plan.

@kshawn I agree about the water/meth for more cooling and (the big one) supplemental fueling at WOT. It could make the difference.

 

[boosted180sx]

Theories aside... the tune did make good power. There's convenience to running straight E85 vice mixing. Running straight E85 vice ~E37 should be better. You should need a greater volume of fuel due to it's lower BTU content. That greater volume should provide even more cooling off a fuel that's easier to vaporize (double whammy).

What I don't get is why, if the cars fuel system, due to narrow injection windows, is unable to properly supple the fuel so straight E85 cars run hot and lean and kill themselves is why it isn't caught during their tuning sessions.

I myself, who've never run E85 in anything in my life have read up on it long before getting this Civic and it was always folks running straight E85 in the Z crowd... not intentionally blending. I didn't see the purpose behind it on ours either when I first was reading and hearing the "run E35-E40" for the most power. Even if that was sufficient to effectively make the car no longer be knock-limited, I didn't realize that some injection windows for DI made it's possible duty cycle way less. For FI, I think it's only like, what... 30% more fuel, so you need 30% more of the existing duty cycle to work. Still comfortably under 100%? You're good. Not on ours though.

Anyways... any tune... weak or powerful in power... can kill an engine if it's done improperly. Building the engine up to run hot and lean on E85 again seems like a good way to wreck a built engine. Rods won't matter. More durable pistons could hang in there longer. Same valves? Eh... it doesn't sound like a good plan.

@kshawn I agree about the water/meth for more cooling and (the big one) supplemental fueling at WOT. It could make the difference.

I agree on the convenience for the most part but 1.5s have a flex fuel kit so the it's not really that inconvenient to mix fuels imo. I wish flex fuel was available for the CTRs.

iirc, his tuner told him that he shouldn't run full E85. E85 is much better than a blend. Like you said, higher the alcohol content, the cooler it burns too. It's just the 10th gen civics can't provide enough fuel to run full E85...

 

[LilToTo17]

Theories aside... the tune did make good power. There's convenience to running straight E85 vice mixing. Running straight E85 vice ~E37 should be better. You should need a greater volume of fuel due to it's lower BTU content. That greater volume should provide even more cooling off a fuel that's easier to vaporize (double whammy).

What I don't get is why, if the cars fuel system, due to narrow injection windows, is unable to properly supple the fuel so straight E85 cars run hot and lean and kill themselves is why it isn't caught during their tuning sessions.

I myself, who've never run E85 in anything in my life have read up on it long before getting this Civic and it was always folks running straight E85 in the Z crowd... not intentionally blending. I didn't see the purpose behind it on ours either when I first was reading and hearing the "run E35-E40" for the most power. Even if that was sufficient to effectively make the car no longer be knock-limited, I didn't realize that some injection windows for DI made it's possible duty cycle way less. For FI, I think it's only like, what... 30% more fuel, so you need 30% more of the existing duty cycle to work. Still comfortably under 100%? You're good. Not on ours though.

Anyways... any tune... weak or powerful in power... can kill an engine if it's done improperly. Building the engine up to run hot and lean on E85 again seems like a good way to wreck a built engine. Rods won't matter. More durable pistons could hang in there longer. Same valves? Eh... it doesn't sound like a good plan.

@kshawn I agree about the water/meth for more cooling and (the big one) supplemental fueling at WOT. It could make the difference.

His car was tuned by Church which they are known for running 10-15% higher on their dyno for #’s

 

[LilToTo17]

I agree on the convenience for the most part but 1.5s have a flex fuel kit so the it's not really that inconvenient to mix fuels imo. I wish flex fuel was available for the CTRs.

iirc, his tuner told him that he shouldn't run full E85. E85 is much better than a blend. Like you said, higher the alcohol content, the cooler it burns too. It's just the 10th gen civics can't provide enough fuel to run full E85...

If flex fuel was available for CTR they would go boom haha max the rods could handle is around 400wtq if not lower

 

[boosted180sx]

If flex fuel was available for CTR they would go boom haha max the rods could handle is around 400wtq if not lower

People are already booming it lol

Just need to move the torque curve to the right but yeah. I mainly want it so i can run like a E20 blend and get similiar output as a 93 octane without having to pay for 100 octane and mixing it with 91. I just don't like the inconvenience of constantly having to mix it correctly and deal with the inconsistency of the ethanol content from pump. You seem to be in cali so you know how limiting 91 octane is.

In the end, it's all on the user to use what is available in a "smart" way.

 

[charleswrivers]

I agree on the convenience for the most part but 1.5s have a flex fuel kit so the it's not really that inconvenient to mix fuels imo. I wish flex fuel was available for the CTRs.

iirc, his tuner told him that he shouldn't run full E85. E85 is much better than a blend. Like you said, higher the alcohol content, the cooler it burns too. It's just the 10th gen civics can't provide enough fuel to run full E85...

My main thing was it's a 20+ minute drive to get E85. I planned on filling, then mixing back 93 E10 on the next fill up when I was down around 1/2 a tank so I'd get the full E-effect. But wasn't until later and a lot if phrasing from folks repeatedly giving recommendations about not running more than E-40 and some threads about folks having poorly running cars under WOT with E85 it started to paint a picture that either the ethanol adjustment tables were not right for high ethanol percentages or that the cars simply couldn't provide enough fuel based on a hardware limitation. I saw in a thread once that, hardware aside, the software limits injection in those windows and it simply doesn't work within the confines the existing hardware/software combination.

For a long time though, I was kind of dismissive of the idea of mixing. I mean, E85 is cheap... for me, I had to go out if my way to get it... I didn't see why I didn't want to run full E85.

 

[thebutcher]

Not real helpful to the community...

So let me get this straight. People know the actual details but someone is telling them to keep it a secret? Not cool.

I watched one of his videos and at the end he mentioned he was getting a new Turbo but couldn’t talk about it yet. My guess is it’s his sponsors telling him to not talk about it. If that new Turbo was still in the production phase, it wouldn’t be good to leak out any information. The same applies to his new engine. It might be the people supporting this new build that are telling him to keep quiet until they’re done.

 

[thebutcher]

Or do you think all this madness is about getting more subscribers?

Youtubers don’t get paid by subscribers, it has to do with the views they get. That’s why more youtubers have ads in their videos. There is a good video on this where the guy actually shows us how much he makes in a year and how all the numbers break down from just viewing to sponsor revenue.

 

[LilToTo17]

People are already booming it lol

Just need to move the torque curve to the right but yeah. I mainly want it so i can run like a E20 blend and get similiar output as a 93 octane without having to pay for 100 octane and mixing it with 91. I just don't like the inconvenience of constantly having to mix it correctly and deal with the inconsistency of the ethanol content from pump. You seem to be in cali so you know how limiting 91 octane is.

In the end, it's all on the user to use what is available in a "smart" way.

Haven’t really heard any CTRs booming it like the Si lol

 

[amirza786]

was hush hush $ paid again?

I need some of that "hush hush" $. Pass it my way!

 

[dallasjhawk]

Haven’t really heard any CTRs booming it like the Si lol

they are out there, they were just good at keeping it quiet my inside sources tell me

I need some of that "hush hush" $. Pass it my way!

well we know of at least one person who was paid to take down their posts and hide the blow up, but it was already out there, so we all know he got paid and signed and NDA....

 

[charleswrivers]

I need some of that "hush hush" $. Pass it my way!

For real. I'm good at it. Loose lips and all that jazz. If someone wants to blow up my car from a crappy tune... then pay to fix it... cool. They just need to make sure the follow up one isn't crap.

View attachment 144195

 

[boosted180sx]

Haven’t really heard any CTRs booming it like the Si lol

oh trust me ... they are there lol.

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