2020 Kia Forte GT

Just read what Kia will be adding to their 2020 platform:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/dri...forte-gts-modest-looks-belie-its-zippy-drive/

Much like the 2019 Hyundai Elantra GT N Line,
It will have their 1.6 turbo paired with a DCT, making 201 hp and 195 lb-ft of torque.

Full disclaimer, some of these models/trims seem to be only offered in Canada but wondering if anyone has had any experience with this platform and specifically the 7 speed Dual Clutch transmission?

Hope that the Civic is offered with a similar transmission next gen, as much as i'm now used to the CVT.
Overall, I've read better reviews with DCT than CVTs especially with higher TQ/HP.

It seems like Honda decided to go with CVT for the 10th gens based on cost/efficiency which would make perfect sense for the 2.0 non turbo platform but doesn't make sense to me for the 1.5 Turbo.

Interested to hear your thoughts.

As the vehicle ages, DCTs don't always operate very smoothly. Hyundai and Kia DCTs don't seem to give much of an advantage over a regular automatic in shift speed or performance, but still come with the typical DCT drawbacks like occasional stumbling at low speeds.

turbo lover said:

As the vehicle ages, DCTs don't always operate very smoothly. Hyundai and Kia DCTs don't seem to give much of an advantage over a regular automatic in shift speed or performance, but still come with the typical DCT drawbacks like occasional stumbling at low speeds.

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Can't comment on the speed vs a regular automatic but i've heard a lot of good things about the DCT used by Hyundia/Kia. I've heard it's smooth and responsive. From my expierience Honda CVT at low speeds stumbles quite often when RPMs increase/decrease from idle. The biggest selling point for me is that DCTs are considered more robust at higher power levels.

as well having more control such as being able to actually downshift..the paddles on the civic are pointless since the CVT is meant to operate at a precise ratio and what's most "ideal" so why would anyone want to choose something different to make the transmission perform worse. In other words the CVT is designed more for the average driver and not the enthusiast

I hope they bring the GT hatch version here. It's getting rave reviews in Australia. I'd consider that for my next car.

Prometheon said:

as well having more control such as being able to actually downshift..the paddles on the civic are pointless since the CVT is meant to operate at a precise ratio and what's most "ideal" so why would anyone want to choose something different to make the transmission perform worse. In other words the CVT is designed more for the average driver and not the enthusiast

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Why are the paddles pointless? Don't they raise the engine RPM when you "downshift"?

Prometheon said:

Can't comment on the speed vs a regular automatic but i've heard a lot of good things about the DCT used by Hyundia/Kia. I've heard it's smooth and responsive. From my expierience Honda CVT at low speeds stumbles quite often when RPMs increase/decrease from idle. The biggest selling point for me is that DCTs are considered more robust at higher power levels.

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Car & Driver weren't big fans of the 1.6T / DCT combo in the Kia Soul: "Regardless, overall, the Soul would be better off with a conventional automatic that would shift more smoothly and predictably, since the DCT doesn't deliver particularly sharp responses, anyway."

turbo lover said:

Why are the paddles pointless? Don't they raise the engine RPM when you "downshift"?


Car & Driver weren't big fans of the 1.6T / DCT combo in the Kia Soul: "Regardless, overall, the Soul would be better off with a conventional automatic that would shift more smoothly and predictably, since the DCT doesn't deliver particularly sharp responses, anyway."

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I've been following discussions and reviews of the Elantra Sport and (now) the Forte GT for a while now, including subscribing to FB groups for both cars. I almost started a Forte GT thread myself, but here we are.

The C&D review long-term review of the Soul was even more negative than the previous post indicates. The found that the DCT developed performance issues that were not evident when they first purchased the car. Looking at the Elantra Sport boards too, there are definitely concerns about the long-term performance and health of the Hyundai/Kia DCT. Kia does have the 100K powertrain warranty, but what about if you are just losing performance over time, or having random problems crop up, as happened to C&D (and I've seen mentioned elsewhere)? The MT, by contrast, appears to be much more reliable, anecdotally at least. I'll leave it to others to decide how the feel about the Kia / Hyundai MT vs the Si. There are many reviews online (Straight Pipes, Throttle House, Savagegeese) that are very complementary of the Elantra Sport, even if on balance they have preferred the Si -- although I think Straight Pipes in 2017 chose the ES in their face-off (like me, Yuri loves a good infotainment setup).

I made the decision several months ago to wait for the Forte GT before pulling the trigger on my next car. At this point, it's probably down to the Si and the GT for me. I'm strongly leaning to manual transmission regardless -- I drive an automatic now but want one more fun MT in my life while I still can. But if I wasn't, I'd be particularly hesitant to buy the Kia/Hyundai DCT, because of what I noted above. Unfortunately for me, Kia decided to make some of the most appealing "extras", specifically adaptive cruise and heated/cooled seats, available on the DCT only, but not the MT. A classic "people who drive manuals don't like nice things" move. I live in an apartment in the northeast, heated seats at my age are non-negotiable, although I suppose I could add them aftermarket (and have already considered doing that if I go the Forte GT MT route).

I was caught by surprise that Honda added adaptive cruise (and the rest of Sensing) to the 2020 Si. I recently had a chance to spend some time in an adaptive cruise Civic, and was shocked at how much I enjoyed it for an extended road trip. It's not something I would use often, but as a guy in his 50s, it would be nice to have ACC in the car I plan to drive for the next 7 years or so. So right now I'm leaning towards the Si, even though I thought I would never be able to tolerate its unreliable, laggy, outdated-the-day-it-was-released in 2016 infotainment system. We all have to make trade-offs. But I will take some time to test drive and get a feel for both cars before making a final decision. I'm avidly looking forward to seeing reviews of both cars, especially the 2020 Si, to find out if one can actually notice the changes to the final drive ratio.

BTW, @gtman , by all accounts I've read the Forte5 is NOT coming to the USA. The Canadians are getting the Forte5 GT, but DCT only. The USA is getting the MT, but not the hatch. It's funny the choices automakers make.

I had a hunch that the DCT had a catch 22. What do you think of the Veloster N ? With the new added saftey features the 2020 Si has increased in price by around 2k here in Canada. For an extra 4k you can get a veloster N which only comes in manual and has a significant power bump along with good sounding exhaust. Personally idk if I can get over the look of the rear and having the uneven 2 doors on one side but I'm picky when it comes to styling. The tech looks a bit better than the civic at least.

Prometheon said:

I had a hunch that the DCT had a catch 22. What do you think of the Veloster N ? With the new added saftey features the 2020 Si has increased in price by around 2k here in Canada. For an extra 4k you can get a veloster N which only comes in manual and has a significant power bump along with good sounding exhaust. Personally idk if I can get over the look of the rear and having the uneven 2 doors on one side but I'm picky when it comes to styling. The tech looks a bit better than the civic at least.

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Youtube is absolutely your friend here. Start with two pairs of guys I love following (both Canadian!), The Straight Pipes and Throttle House. Different styles, but both have reviewed the Veloster N multiple times in comparison to other models. Based on what I've read, it has a crazy amount of power (275 HP peak vs 205 for the SI), and has won over a lot of Hyundai skeptics with its performance (even Jalopnik!). Savagegeese is also outstanding, but hasn't reviewed the Veloster N. Personally, the car doesn't interest me because it's my daily driver and I prefer having a sedan, and am willing to trade of some power for creature comforts.

Hyundai / Kia infotainment is light years ahead of the Civic. I've ranted about this on the audio board (as have many, many, many others), but I find it infuriating how bad the infotainment is in the Civic compared to the rest of the car. I would have bought a Civic instead of my Jetta way back in 2016 if it wasn't for that. And I've been very happy with my Jetta since then, but I have a hankering to go back to stick while I still can.

And don't just take my word for it on the DCT, keep researching. I'm close enough to the fence that I likely will test drive a Forte GT DCT just for the heck of it, but like I said, I really want a manual.

Autoweek seemed to love everything about the car...

https://autoweek.com/article/sponsored/kia-forte-gt-sharpened-performance

gtman said:

Autoweek seemed to love everything about the car...

https://autoweek.com/article/sponsored/kia-forte-gt-sharpened-performance

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Look closely, the dreaded "sponsored content" (i.e. ad masquerading as content).

Be advise. Kia's DCT is not very good.

Here's a comparison between a Dual Clutch automatic 2020 Kia Forte GT and the Civic Si. Its in Portuguese so you can just skip to the drag race. Race starts at 9:25 mark. Manual vs manual would have been a better comparison.

Joe Rati just did a review of the Forte GT MT -- although he doesn't really answer the question in the title.

xbbnx said:

Here's a comparison between a Dual Clutch automatic 2020 Kia Forte GT and the Civic Si. Its in Portuguese so you can just skip to the drag race. Race starts at 9:25 mark. Manual vs manual would have been a better comparison.

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Youtube has an "auto translate" function in the cc settings