Am I overspending?

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wildbilly32

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If I offloaded the car I’m fairly confident I could at the minimum get $28K for it, based on its condition and mileage. I only have a single accident on my carfax which helps. I could use that 3k as a down payment on a cheaper car (something around 20K) or I could pocket it and just drive the RAV. My issue with the RAV is I’m so used to modern creature comforts and my RAV4 has pretty basic stuff despite being fully loaded lol.

I would get a 2nd job but I already am exhausted on the weekends as is and don’t think I want to lose any more free time. I also dislike the entire concept of Uber/Lyft and I personally have never used it nor do I plan on it.
I realized you "lol'd" the highlighted above but I think this is a driver in your subconscious mind. I'm no financial expert but you appear really upside down with an income that's not going to help you much in digging out of this hole. I made a crap load of mistakes when I was young and finally learned with the help of a wife who could make me see the stupidity of my decisions. Our daily is a 2009 Rav4 and we could afford a much nicer-newer-fancier car, but do we need that...NO! Toys are for people who can afford them. You're not to that point yet, financially. Your life. Your decision. Good luck.
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charleswrivers

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Hmm... this is a hard decision, and my emotions aren’t helping. Here’s a breakdown of my monthly expenses... one thing I have done well and will continue to do well is never paying interest on a credit cards. Any balance I maintain is on 0% intro rate or it’s a financing plan on like a store card. Right before the interest free period expires I pay the balance off in full. My family taught me first hand how credit card interest can ruin you.

Monthly income is like $2400 after taxes

Car payment $526.37
Estimated gas payment $136 ($34 every week)
“Rent” payment $700
General credit card payments $220
Other payments $200

I’ve been playing with numbers and if I refinanced at 72 months again I would really only need like $2000 to bring the payment into something far more manageable. However I think refinancing for 6 years is beyond stupid... I would like to really only have 4 years but that would require another large cash injection by me.

If I offloaded the car I’m fairly confident I could at the minimum get $28K for it, based on its condition and mileage. I only have a single accident on my carfax which helps. I could use that 3k as a down payment on a cheaper car (something around 20K) or I could pocket it and just drive the RAV. My issue with the RAV is I’m so used to modern creature comforts and my RAV4 has pretty basic stuff despite being fully loaded lol.

I would get a 2nd job but I already am exhausted on the weekends as is and don’t think I want to lose any more free time. I also dislike the entire concept of Uber/Lyft and I personally have never used it nor do I plan on it.
That's 1782.37. 74% of your income. I don't see things like car insurance. Food. Going out and 'fun' money. Cell phone. These would be generally necessary expenses and we haven't even gotten into saving anything. I don't want to over-talk the good talk. I was only saving 3% of my income at 25. It wasn't nearly enough... but it was something. I remember being in my early to mid-20s and being pretty broke. My first full year in the navy, my taxable income was something like 17,000. My take home was about $1100/month. Yeah. That's "I-can't-afford-Kraft-Mac-and-Cheese... lemme get the generic" broke.

In a way... good on your folks for making you pay rent... but between your house and car... that's about 1/2 of what you make. You're house-poor and car-poor as it doesn't look like you have anything to hardly live off of and the house isn't even yours.

You're in a tough spot and I don't want to kick you while you're down. I wish I could turn back the clock and give you your $14000... what amount's to over 1/2 your annual pay back and un-do the car purchase. Right now... based on being in the black by $400/month... it'd take you 3 years to save up that amount of money again... and you'd be in your late 20s.

You need to improve your financial outlook somehow and I don't want to overly get into the weeds about it... but it's a tough spot. Spent 14000 to get rid of 1 car to get another car you can ill afford... then just giving that one up at a loss is damn near the most tragic thing I can think of from a financial aspect... because even if you offload the CTR and get away scott-free... it'd *still* take you over a year.... freeing up that ~$500 to get back the $14000 you threw in during the deal you got.

Have you spoke to your folks? I mean... I don't want to be down on them but they should have kept you from doing this. Shit happens. Now that it's happened, and you have your budget before you... you need to come up with a plan. A plan for this car. A plan for your finances in general. A plan for your life. Again... this conversation is going to get way in the weeds... but you *need* to have this conversation with someone. A parent. A mentor. Someone you know and trust. Recognize shortcomings... set achievable goals... got to work and start knocking it out. You're young enough to shake this off and be back on track in a few years... but it's going to take some changes in your life. If you want to talk more you're welcome to PM me... as I've done a lot of financial counseling for my Sailors... but I'd only be good with numbers. I don't know you... your goals... your situation. That's where you really need to lean on a parent or mentor... but one who can help you. If your folks are (no offense) no good at it... they may not be much help.

I'll say... while my 21 year old self made $1100/month... my 37 year old self makes many times that. I save more money into retirement than my mortgage payment a month. I have 4 cars... a beater... a toy... a 2 newish cars, one being the Civic. I provide for my family pretty damn well. What's my secret? It's pretty simple... though it took me a few years to realize it: Live below my means. Rich people get rich by not spending all their money. Don't try to match other people... in their homes... cars... random 'stuff'. More often than not... a lot of those folks who may criticize you for what you have, or don't have, are actually in terrible shape and are a few bad months away from losing everything. If you can be at peace with living a good life, but beneath your actual means... you really will live a good life.
 

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Hey guys, when I bought this car 18 months ago, the hype surrounding the purchase and the heat of the moment may have caused me to put myself in a fairly bad place. The reason is due to the fact that when I was budgeting the car, I was really planning for my 2017 coupe to fetch at least 21K - it fetched about 16K, and to compensate I threw a bit more money down (almost 14K) on the purchase so I could "afford" the monthly payments. (My original plan had $450ish... after taxes it was close to 40K and then the negative equity pushed the price to close to 47K, which is where I threw the cash down to bring it to something more affordable) Afford is a relative term here. I am paying $526.37 a month for 72 months. I had read that I should not be pushing a loan out this far, but I really wanted the car. Plus, all the hassle of getting the dealership to get it in, ugh, I felt obligated to do it, even though a part of me was like "that's way too high of a payment". I also did not factor in how much more I'd be spending on fuel compared to my 2017 coupe.

A little background about me... I'm 25 years old, with a stable job but I still live at home. I don't plan on living here forever, but I would rather live at home compared to living in an apartment (sorry, that kind of living just doesn't suit my tastes, not to mention rent up here isn't really cheap). I am fortunate to be able to live at home, but I have to contribute to the bills and such (around 700 a month). So, what I've been saving up for (slowly..) is a down payment on a modest sized townhome, within the next 3-4 years hopefully. My job nets me a salary of $48K before taxes, which should increase over the next year because it was mentioned to me more or less that a promotion is coming. But that's still months away, so I'm operating on 48K before taxes.

Well recently, it just feels like I'm burning through cash left and right. So I took a few hours to deeply analyze all my spending, and I would be partially right about that. Between the monthly payments and fuel costs (which is about $34 a week because even with 28mpg a small fuel tank don't hold anything), I'm spending almost $700 a month to own the CTR. Now, in terms of emotions, I'd say it was totally worth it, considering the times and smiles the CTR has given me. But ultimately I have a habit of focusing on the present and not the future.

My car related expenses are about 25% of my monthly income, and that's not including the thousands I've spent on tires, modding my exhaust, and two insurance deductibles. It's honestly a lot.

One of the things I could do - not that i even want to think about it - is trade this in for something that might not kill me financially and wouldn't totally suck my soul out. (Don't really know what that is but...) The only reason I figure that I can do this is because the resale value should still be high enough to close my loan without earning me negative equity. Or, I could try and refinance, but my fear is the maintenance that is creeping up will still be pricey. At least I don't need tires again this year...

Anyone have any advice? This is the only place where I can feel like I can actually get advice so I'm hoping someone has insight on what is best. This is a really special car and despite all the pains I love it dearly still, but at the same time I don't want to be stuck at home at 30 years old. I'm also in no risk of defaulting any time soon; I have a decent amount in savings I keep for emergency funds. Plenty in there to keep me afloat even if I lost my job.
Hey bro do you ever come down to CivicX meets in the King of Prussia area?
 

charleswrivers

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it's rolling the negative equity into the new loan that burned him. It is a lot of money but at this point, i feel like it'd be a big waste if you do sell it just to break even. He's already lost the 14k that he put down along with the monthlys that he has paid.
Agreed. That's one of the worst parts of it. I know what's it's like to be young and scrimp and save to come up with that kind of cash. To lose it... lose the previous car in a trade... then be saddled with someone that's taking practically everything to where I can't hardly go out and do anything... it's the worst part. Had he paid nothing down, then it wouldn't be all that bad. That $14000 committed him into a situation which would be best to get out of. But paying into a bad situation makes it feel like you damn near ought to just stay put and consider that the money's gone and you might as well enjoy the fruits of your past labor... even if you're car-poor.
 

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Have you spoke to your folks? I mean... I don't want to be down on them but they should have kept you from doing this. Shit happens. Now that it's happened, and you have your budget before you... you need to come up with a plan. A plan for this car. A plan for your finances in general. A plan for your life. Again... this conversation is going to get way in the weeds... but you *need* to have this conversation with someone. A parent. A mentor. Someone you know and trust. Recognize shortcomings... set achievable goals... got to work and start knocking it out. You're young enough to shake this off and be back on track in a few years... but it's going to take some changes in your life. If you want to talk more you're welcome to PM me... as I've done a lot of financial counseling for my Sailors... but I'd only be good with numbers. I don't know you... your goals... your situation. That's where you really need to lean on a parent or mentor... but one who can help you. If your folks are (no offense) no good at it... they may not be much help.
yeah it's really unfortunate. Rolling negative equity is probably the biggest mistake you can do when purchasing a car since your basically even more upside down the moment you sign the papers and takes years to recover.
if he would have kept that 14k or use that as a downpayment, he wouldn't be in the same situation that he is in now. His payment would've probably been 1/2 of what it is now.

I also agree about speaking to your parents. Noone knows you better than your parents. Don't be embarrassed about speaking to them and explain the situation your in. They have lived longer than you, have experienced more and most parents wants to see their kids succeed and do good.
 


WhatThePuck

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Hmm... this is a hard decision, and my emotions aren’t helping. Here’s a breakdown of my monthly expenses... one thing I have done well and will continue to do well is never paying interest on a credit cards. Any balance I maintain is on 0% intro rate or it’s a financing plan on like a store card. Right before the interest free period expires I pay the balance off in full. My family taught me first hand how credit card interest can ruin you.

Monthly income is like $2400 after taxes

Car payment $526.37
Estimated gas payment $136 ($34 every week)
“Rent” payment $700
General credit card payments $220
Other payments $200

I’ve been playing with numbers and if I refinanced at 72 months again I would really only need like $2000 to bring the payment into something far more manageable. However I think refinancing for 6 years is beyond stupid... I would like to really only have 4 years but that would require another large cash injection by me.
Yikes, I am sorry you're in a sticky situation. Refinancing would be a good idea and should be on the top of the to do list (or at least near the top). Would it be possible to rid your credit card debt? How much do you use your card? I think that staying with your parents while you get all this squared away and saving for your own place is a good idea. You're saving money because you're only forking out $700 when it could very easily be $2k (guesstimating) or so with rent, electricity, cable, internet, etc. What I've done to figure out what I have left is write out every bill I have - like you have done here - but also write what date they're due so I know what check to use for that bill. So every check I take out the basics; food, gas, things that are weekly "payments". And then if I have a bill that lands after that check but before the next check I will plan to take it from that check. I know where every penny of my money is going every check and was able to save up a lot of money that way. And it really helps you realize how much you're spending, including any going out to eat spending, or my problem is ebay hahahaha. Then from there see if you have any smaller debts you can get rid of first. I don't know how much help this would be but it would be worth a good 'ol college try lol. If you did refinance for 6 years wouldn't you be able to get it paid off before then if you made larger payments? My loan is at 72 mos and (at a higher rate, eek) but I plan to have it paid off before then. Or at least try to. Good luck with what you decide!
 
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Zeffy94

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yeah it's really unfortunate. Rolling negative equity is probably the biggest mistake you can do when purchasing a car since your basically even more upside down the moment you sign the papers and takes years to recover.
if he would have kept that 14k or use that as a downpayment, he wouldn't be in the same situation that he is in now. His payment would've probably been 1/2 of what it is now.

I also agree about speaking to your parents. Noone knows you better than your parents. Don't be embarrassed about speaking to them and explain the situation your in. They have lived longer than you, have experienced more and most parents wants to see their kids succeed and do good.
My dad cautioned me about doing it but supported it regardless. Like I said, it was blindness to the fact that 526 a month didn’t sound like a lot of money, but the truth is because of the tires I bought, needing to use premium gas at least once a week, and other things I’ve spent a crap load of cash on the car. He suggested I should’ve stayed with my old Civic since it had everything I needed. Hindsight is 50/50 here. Shoulda listened.

The remaining balance of the loan is 25K. I only financed 32K because of the cash I threw as a down payment. I originally wanted to put 10 down but in the heat of the moment I threw more. I have about 55 payments left I believe. That’s the shining light at the end of the tunnel, since the car still should be worth at least 28 grand even with an accident on my carfax.

Another thing was when I first bought the car I was freeloading at home - I didn’t have the rent payment. When we moved into PA since we had a lot of surprise expenses pop up I offered to help. Since I have my own place to stay it’s the least I could do, plus it’s cheaper than finding my own place by far.
 
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Zeffy94

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Sounds like the RAV 4 is now your primary vehicle! (I assume its paid for? or has a minimal monthly cost?)

Consider this a life lesson... Pay back the negative equity. If you are throwing $500/mo at a car currently, then you could turn around and put $500/mo towards your debts if it was gone.

If i skimmed the numbers, your car is worth about $35k? you still "owe" $38K (47-9,5 you've already paid)? Whats the official "pay off" price? Do you have $3-5K saved to get out of this bad situation?
I got the RAV4 with cash. There’s no lien on it. It’s all mine.
 

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If you're living with parents you can't afford any new car at all really. Lesson learned.

It's honestly not a lot of money in the grand scheme of things- work hard on improving yourself and make more money and enjoy the car. Can't be picky about what jobs you're willing to do in your shoes.
 

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@Zeffy94 you're impulsive just like me...and the problem for both, you and I, is credit...we have good credit scores and being impulsive?!?! We'll be in trouble so fast! we'll have to learn how to live with cash / credit, and not confuse the two...I've just consolidated all my credit card under one payment, and I'm trying really hard to only use cash...

Car finance issues are not as bad as credit cards...just don't get yourself into a credit card bind...don't try to use your credit cards to try fix this problem, as you'll get into deeper shit!! High debt and low FICO score! Be careful!
 


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My dad cautioned me about doing it but supported it regardless. Like I said, it was blindness to the fact that 526 a month didn’t sound like a lot of money, but the truth is because of the tires I bought, needing to use premium gas at least once a week, and other things I’ve spent a crap load of cash on the car. He suggested I should’ve stayed with my old Civic since it had everything I needed. Hindsight is 50/50 here. Shoulda listened.

The remaining balance of the loan is 25K. I only financed 32K because of the cash I threw as a down payment. I originally wanted to put 10 down but in the heat of the moment I threw more. I have about 55 payments left I believe. That’s the shining light at the end of the tunnel, since the car still should be worth at least 28 grand even with an accident on my carfax.

Another thing was when I first bought the car I was freeloading at home - I didn’t have the rent payment. When we moved into PA since we had a lot of surprise expenses pop up I offered to help. Since I have my own place to stay it’s the least I could do, plus it’s cheaper than finding my own place by far.
if that's the case, idk ... i'd just keep driving it. 25k isn't a lot of money in the big picture.

getting rid of it and driving the RAV4 is the smarter choice but i don't know if i'd be able to do that if i was in your shoes. I'd try to look for a better job or work another job to try to make it work. I worked 2 jobs when i was in my early 20s. It's tiring for sure but i had to do what i had to do.

but like i said before, i'm probably not the best person to listen to lol.
 

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The lesson I learned early in life (joined the army at 18 and learned to live on $650 a month, granted this was back in 99) is if you can learn to survive poor when you are young, life gets much easier in the later years (assuming you aren't lazy and all).

I tell my kids all the time that you have two options in life: "Play now and pay later" or "Pay now and play later". Choosing the latter usually allows you to "play" bigger and better.
I suggest paying now (read: live cheaply and save) and playing later.
 

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if that's the case, idk ... i'd just keep driving it. 25k isn't a lot of money in the big picture.

getting rid of it and driving the RAV4 is the smarter choice but i don't know if i'd be able to do that if i was in your shoes. I'd try to look for a better job or work another job to try to make it work. I worked 2 jobs when i was in my early 20s. It's tiring for sure but i had to do what i had to do.

but like i said before, i'm probably not the best person to listen to lol.
+ 1 on get rid of the R, then bring yourself back to a financially conformable position, then start finding your next ride, being really careful not to make the same mistakes. This is one very good way to fix the problem yourself...but if not, Family bailout is always an option! just remember to pay them back and extra kisses and hugs as interest!
 

charleswrivers

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My dad cautioned me about doing it but supported it regardless. Like I said, it was blindness to the fact that 526 a month didn’t sound like a lot of money, but the truth is because of the tires I bought, needing to use premium gas at least once a week, and other things I’ve spent a crap load of cash on the car. He suggested I should’ve stayed with my old Civic since it had everything I needed. Hindsight is 50/50 here. Shoulda listened.

The remaining balance of the loan is 25K. I only financed 32K because of the cash I threw as a down payment. I originally wanted to put 10 down but in the heat of the moment I threw more. I have about 55 payments left I believe. That’s the shining light at the end of the tunnel, since the car still should be worth at least 28 grand even with an accident on my carfax.

Another thing was when I first bought the car I was freeloading at home - I didn’t have the rent payment. When we moved into PA since we had a lot of surprise expenses pop up I offered to help. Since I have my own place to stay it’s the least I could do, plus it’s cheaper than finding my own place by far.
All that info paints a more positive picture. You've got positive equity. You and your old man have a good dialogue. I was very tight with my dad and totally admit to having him give me advice that I shrugged off... it's natural. We're all our own men and want to do what we want. Just keep that dialogue going and try and see yourself how he must see you through his eyes. He loves you and I'm sure he's proud of you... proud for chipping in with the family and paying your way. I'll tell you as a dad myself... it hurts you when you see your kids get in a spot you wanted to try to keep them from. I haven't gotten to the point I've got to really let my kids succeed or fail with minimal intervention on my part because they're all still young... but it'll get here eventually.

You're just going to have to decide if 55 months... really from now until you're about 30 years old, if you're willing to let this car be a focal point of your finances or let it go to do a bit better than break even. If you walk out and see that car ahd love it... driving it is a huge part of your life and you can equate it as money well spent... then I can fathom it being ok. While at 25 I was driving a $1300 '86 300zx with Tokico Illuminas all around, a smidge more boost and a CAI and it was badass (to me) while my old lady was driving a new Escape Limited I got for a steal... you went more all-in than I can even stomach now. Still... I know that feeling of looking at a car and loving it and feeling like it's worth it. I had a '90 300zx twin turbo in pearl yellow that nickle and dimed me to death. A hundred here... a hundred there... but it was my ride in college and in my first year in the Navy and really enjoyed it and I was fine with it taking (mostly from random repairs and upkeep) a good chunk of my disposable income.

If you look at the car and don't feel that joy but it feels like a burden that you've got to get from under, maybe it is... and maybe you should. Remember live below your means if you want wealth... you should be trying to improve your means or lower your spending. I did the 2 job thing through my teens and it's tough. I worked a second job in the summer and worked full-time on another job. At 18 I was living in my own... paying all my bills, with some cash I had saved I was covering school costs (largely from my 75% scholarship) drove a car I loved and life was pretty good. Enlisted after 9/11 and went off to do whatever I thought was best at the time. Ended up loving the life and never quit. I didn't start really looking ahead and setting goals... I was just kept from getting into things too deep from this feeling of being unsettled if I owed anyone or relied on anyone for anything materially. To get to the point, rather than falling into the trap of taking on another shitty job on top if one that hardly pays a living wage, GET A BETTER JOB. It won't happen overnight and I don't know your education or work experience, but don't get trapped in life making not enough money doing something that leaves you wore out and unfulfilled at the end of the day. This definitely should be a intermediate goal... if not a short term goal. Do you want to be making <30k 5 years from now at 30? Don't get stuck or comfortable in a bad spot. You have to yourself to look after and owe it to yourself to be your best you.

So... you need to make some short, intermediate and long (life) goals for yourself. Say... this year... 5 years (30) and life (let's say, retirement... be that at 50, or 70). Keep evaluating your goals. Adjust as you see fit. Finances is just one part of the picture. I did quip about the staying at home vs moving out thing and I, well... it would have been bad for me, but that's me. I needed to get out on my own, be my own man and not feel like I owed anyone anything because it was very important to me. I would have been miserable at home, even though my folks and I were good. (shrug) If you're not in that situation... and you're in a good spot, that's 100% ok. Our folks aren't going to be around forever... my old man passed unexpectedly at 72 so I'd still work towards self-sufficiency regardless. Knowing your kids are going to be fine without you gives a parent peace.

Good luck. :thumbsup:
 

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+ 1 on get rid of the R, then bring yourself back to a financially conformable position, then start finding your next ride, being really careful not to make the same mistakes. This is one very good way to fix the problem yourself...but if not, Family bailout is always an option! just remember to pay them back and extra kisses and hugs as interest!
haha. i am not going to lie, i made a very bad decision when i was young and had CC debt up the behind. Spoke to my parents about it, explained to them the situation and what my plan is and they helped me pay it off to get me out of it. Spent the next few years of my life paying them back and thanks to them, i am sitting at 800+ credit score. You live and learn. If it wasn't for them, i'd probably have a low credit score and not be able to do anything that required credit.
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