Harness Bar Options

Is anyone actually using a "universal" bolt-in harness bar like the Cipher from K?
I desperately want a set of harnesses for an upcoming track day but I don't want to ruin my car by installing a bar. It is far from a daily driver but every once in awhile I do need the back seat to accommodate an adult passenger.
1) Does anyone make a bar specific to the 2018 R?
2) Anyone routinely switching between a bar and ordinary seatbelts?
3) How much is involved in swapping out the belts for the bar? [4 bolts out and 4 bolts in or are we taking half the interior apart?]
4) What about the mounting of any submarine belt?
Thanks
John

Depending on the track day club or track itself, ensure that using just a harness bar is ok. The longer I've done these events, the higher the safety bar is raised to keep the insurance companies happy. I've seen some say that harnesses bars are NOT allowed.. Or that harnesses, harness specific seats and rollbar must be used together.. Or that if you run harnesses, you must also use a HANS device and that both driver and instructor must be afforded the same equipment.

In the end, its a system and more often than not, its become binary.. all or nothing. Stock seats and 3 pt belts, or full on race gear.

Interesting.
I wonder if the stock seats in an R are considered harness specific seats?
Yeah, I knew the part about driver and passenger/instructor must be afforded equal levels of protection.
Thanks

JESFromASC said:

Interesting.
I wonder if the stock seats in an R are considered harness specific seats?
Yeah, I knew the part about driver and passenger/instructor must be afforded equal levels of protection.
Thanks

Click to expand...

Well, while the CTR seats do have a place for shoulder straps, I do not see a hole for a submarine strap(s) and running them over the front of the cushion tends to be frowned upon by most these days.

I guess this all leads to one simple question - just how horrible is it running on the track with the stock 3-point seatbelts?
I mean heck it has set track records with the likes of JB wearing just that...
I'd rather not fix anything that isn't broken.

Safety is a personal preference.. as are the tradeoffs made to meet that goal.
Pro racers wear fire resistant suits and shoes. Helmets. Cool suits. HANS devices. 6pt belts. FIA certified race seats. Full roll cage.
The weekend hack, jeans, longsleeve T-shirt, Helmet. Maybe gloves. Maybe a Hans. Maybe 3pt belts.. or if they are goign down a slippery slope, Seats and harnesses.
Often, we slide towards "the minimum required" when we first partake in a new experience. I've done DE events for 20+ years. I've been very lucky. A few spins. Never any contact. In racing, its not "if" you crash, but "when".

whether its DE or a Race, however, when it goes wrong, it goes wrong. Your Civic, as a starting point, is much safer than a 1980s civic for instance. Then again, you could be hitting 130mph in your Type R. Hit some unseen coolant someone else dropped on track, and you could be going off track with little warning.. backwards, up and over a tire wall.. see.. Its all fine, until its not. Sometimes it goes bad quickly. Sometimes, its a spin at a hairpin in the rain.. you tried it at 45mph, but 43 was the maximum.. whoops. but you gather it up.. straighten the wheel.. drive off under control and re enter without issue..

All that said.. I've run factory seats and 3pt belts and felt safe. I've run 6pt harnesses/seats/cage and been scared (as an instructor) with a driver who didn't know what they were doing in a car capable of going way too fast for their skill set.

After all that, just do it.. Sign up. Go to an event. Learn. Learn some more. You may find that you don't like it at all.. Or that you'd rather have a Spec Miata for $10K with all the safety goodies in place and leave the TypeR for street use.

I have a universal harness bar that I modified to fit my R. I run ASM Takata harnesses tied to them for AutoX purposes only since its allowed by my tech inspector. It WILL NOT pass tech inspection for bigger track use as well as for drag racing. I leave my oem 3 point seatbelts installed for those type of events and while street driving. I also have the oem rear seat belt buckle bolts replaced with takata eye bolts to clip harness to in case my harness bar is denied useable at autoX depending on tech inspecting car. Planning on going with a EVS roll bar eventually but as far as harness bar use I would definitely check with your track tech inspector and track rules to see if it’s even allowed before considering one.

https://www.unitedspeedracing.com/index.php?id_product=178&controller=product

Our harness bar was developed specifically for the CTR. It uses the same DOM tubing and plates we use for roll cages, and is designed to bolt into factory safety mounting points in the floor rather than the pillars. It can be installed or removed in under 15 minutes and requires zero permanent modification. We recommend using it in conjunction with a proper 5/6 point capable seat but using the stock seats in conjunction with Schroth ASM (or other certified ASM) harness will work as well.

racer said:

Safety is a personal preference.. as are the tradeoffs made to meet that goal.
Pro racers wear fire resistant suits and shoes. Helmets. Cool suits. HANS devices. 6pt belts. FIA certified race seats. Full roll cage.
The weekend hack, jeans, longsleeve T-shirt, Helmet. Maybe gloves. Maybe a Hans. Maybe 3pt belts.. or if they are goign down a slippery slope, Seats and harnesses.
Often, we slide towards "the minimum required" when we first partake in a new experience. I've done DE events for 20+ years. I've been very lucky. A few spins. Never any contact. In racing, its not "if" you crash, but "when".

whether its DE or a Race, however, when it goes wrong, it goes wrong. Your Civic, as a starting point, is much safer than a 1980s civic for instance. Then again, you could be hitting 130mph in your Type R. Hit some unseen coolant someone else dropped on track, and you could be going off track with little warning.. backwards, up and over a tire wall.. see.. Its all fine, until its not. Sometimes it goes bad quickly. Sometimes, its a spin at a hairpin in the rain.. you tried it at 45mph, but 43 was the maximum.. whoops. but you gather it up.. straighten the wheel.. drive off under control and re enter without issue..

All that said.. I've run factory seats and 3pt belts and felt safe. I've run 6pt harnesses/seats/cage and been scared (as an instructor) with a driver who didn't know what they were doing in a car capable of going way too fast for their skill set.

After all that, just do it.. Sign up. Go to an event. Learn. Learn some more. You may find that you don't like it at all.. Or that you'd rather have a Spec Miata for $10K with all the safety goodies in place and leave the TypeR for street use.

Click to expand...

Thanks for taking the time for the detailed reply - but - I'm coming out of a SCCA race car so I know the drill!
;-)
John