How long before the Type R is automatic only in the US?

frtorres87 · May 21, 2019

I've never personally purchased a car that wasn't a manual. With that said I'm
Pretty sure I'm holding onto my Type R for as long as I can to enjoy that "pure" feeing.

gtman · May 21, 2019

IMO as long as Honda manufactures the Type R it will come with a manual. Plain and simple. Will they ever have an optional automatic? Maybe.

noir · May 21, 2019

racer said:
Consider in europe that most folks buy the manual because its cheaper. And the majority drive small displacement gas or diesel motors. They aren't driving 5.0L V-8s that get 10MPG. Just owning, licensing, insuring a car is much more expensive in Europe for instance than here. Even getting a drivers license is harder.

Manual sales numbers are dropping in Europe too. As folks get richer and lazier, and traffic gets worse, and technology improves.. the Automatic is taking over. The killer is the Electrification required in China and in Europe that will kill both the manual and the ICE for their "local" markets.. but Automobiles are no longer a "local market" scenario. Costs are too high. Cars are global.

While Porsche had to recant to pressure and make manual available in its GT3, thats a$150-200K car. Not a $18K civic. There is a lot more money still to be made for Porsche to offer a "one off" like that vs Honda. You might be willing to pay more for a manual (ie, an SI or CTR) but most people (americans) no longer are interested.

Europe here

And yes, this is right. But not only because its cheaper - the old automatic transmissions were crap and had really bad MPG. Nobody bought them - imagine a VW Golf 1 Diesel, 50 hp, 3 speed AT. It was so slow at shifting, it took more than a second to change gears. Friend of mine owned one. This was a really terrible car.

Perhaps hard to believe for some of you: In the last 20 years I never owned a car with an AT. Heck, I don't even thought about buying one. If you only drive MT for such a long time, you don't even think about shifting. It happens automatically. Even in really worse traffic it is not that much of a problem.

And yes, cars which get 10 MPG are really expensive here - 1 Liter premium gasoline costs around 1.8€ (which makes ~ 7.63 $ / Gallon) . But nowadays, ATs getting better and better. So yes, more ATs will be sold. In the future, especially hybrid cars will get ATs.

Which isn't a always a bad thing - look at the NSX. AT + Hybrid can be really good. If the manufacturer wants to.

WhatThePuck · May 21, 2019

When my previous vehicle was purchased I was given the option of manual or automatic. First question I asked was what the price difference was. Automatic was another $1200. I had already wanted a manual, and learned on that car. I knew after I started driving it that I'd only want manual cars until my legs couldn't do it anymore lol. I test drove a Lancer, it was automatic and I asked if it came in manual. The dealer said no but understood why I wanted it and then told me how automatics are getting better on gas and whatnot and I said I don't care it's not the same. hehe

purist here for sure. It does seem to be switching now and I wouldn't be surprised if it would be an extra $1200+ to get a manual down the road. makes me sad

typeaarrr · May 21, 2019

Next generation. Honda will probably use the Accord auto transmission or use Acura's dual clutch. It doesn't make sense for Honda to produce a limited model of the Civic and restrict the market to only a small segment of car buying market.

OceansX · May 21, 2019

Wish I had a type r...cept wife cant drive stick and it doesn't come with heated seats or a sunroof...

racer · May 21, 2019

Just think, buying a new manual makes you nearly part of the " 1 % "

racer · May 21, 2019

typeaarrr said:
Next generation. Honda will probably use the Accord auto transmission or use Acura's dual clutch. It doesn't make sense for Honda to produce a limited model of the Civic and restrict the market to only a small segment of car buying market.

Well, again, cars are global. If there are people buying them elsewhere, it comes down simply to the cost of certification for the US market, assuming they (Honda) think the US market for manual transmission cars is worth pursuing. Once corporate decides that selling 10-20,000 manuals doesn't make sense (as it impacts product planning and dealer willingness) then yes.. maybe they develop a DSG/PDK type box or put in a full slush box.

typeaarrr · May 21, 2019

The biggest car market is the U.S. If Honda puts an automatic transmission in the CTR, your market for potential buyers just open up by 90ish percent.

racer said:
Well, again, cars are global. If there are people buying them elsewhere, it comes down simply to the cost of certification for the US market, assuming they (Honda) think the US market for manual transmission cars is worth pursuing. Once corporate decides that selling 10-20,000 manuals doesn't make sense (as it impacts product planning and dealer willingness) then yes.. maybe they develop a DSG/PDK type box or put in a full slush box.

SixxSpeed · May 21, 2019

typeaarrr said:
The biggest car market is the U.S. If Honda puts an automatic transmission in the CTR, your market for potential buyers just open up by 90ish percent.

The US might be the biggest car buying market overall, but the US is not the biggest Japanese car market.

SixxSpeed · May 21, 2019

typeaarrr said:
Next generation. Honda will probably use the Accord auto transmission or use Acura's dual clutch. It doesn't make sense for Honda to produce a limited model of the Civic and restrict the market to only a small segment of car buying market.

What? Why? Developing a new automatic transmission is expensive. Reusing an existing 6MT is not. Honda doesn't have to reinvent a whole new 6MT for every car. All they need to do is change gear ratios inside, and voila. Same basic layout. maybe change the mounting face, and Thats it. The transmission is already developed. And has been since 2002 when the K series engine first emerged.

I'm not saying a 6MT in a new CTR would be free, but they're also not developing an all new transmission. For what reason?

typeaarrr · May 21, 2019

SixxSpeed said:
What? Why? Developing a new automatic transmission is expensive. Reusing an existing 6MT is not. Honda doesn't have to reinvent a whole new 6MT for every car. All they need to do is change gear ratios inside, and voila. Same basic layout. maybe change the mounting face, and Thats it. The transmission is already developed. And has been since 2002 when the K series engine first emerged.

I'm not saying a 6MT in a new CTR would be free, but they're also not developing an all new transmission. For what reason?

Read my post again. I said Honda will borrow a transmission from the Accord or use Acura's dual clutch transmission. Where did I say Honda will develop a new transmission?

typeaarrr · May 21, 2019

SixxSpeed said:
The US might be the biggest car buying market overall, but the US is not the biggest Japanese car market.

The U.S is the biggest consumer for Japanese car. The market here is so big that Honda, Toyota, and Nissan has factories here in the U.S. Also, we buy so many cars, that Honda has to produce other Civics from other countries to import to U.S because the factory here can't keep up with the demand.

SixxSpeed · May 22, 2019

typeaarrr said:
Read my post again. I said Honda will borrow a transmission from the Accord or use Acura's dual clutch transmission. Where did I say Honda will develop a new transmission?

So what you're saying is they'll use the lower rated Accord transmission over an existing and better CTR transmission? What's the difference? Both already exist. I'm assuming you're referring to the 6MT in this case.

In my previous post I thought you were referring to the 10AT in the Accord (this thread is about the CTR going auto, isn't it?). That would NEVER go into the CTR. I'll bet whatever you like that'll never happen.

Also, that Acura DCT was not designed to handle CTR power levels. There's a reason it's slapped to a naturally aspirated I4 and nothing else. The DCT attached to the RLX is too big and meant for V6s.

While it might be able to handle the power load in the real world (the I4 DCT, that is) it likely cuts too deep into Honda's own safety factor values for them to feel comfortable using it on a car designed to be a daily driven track slut.

SixxSpeed · May 22, 2019

typeaarrr said:
The U.S is the biggest consumer for Japanese car. The market here is so big that Honda, Toyota, and Nissan has factories here in the U.S. Also, we buy so many cars, that Honda has to produce other Civics from other countries to import to U.S because the factory here can't keep up with the demand.

Japanese brands have factories all over Europe. And in Canada. And all over Japan. And China. Not just America, my friend.

The reason there are factories in Canada and the US is more due to trade agreements, than anything else.

The biggest market for Japanese vehicles is in southeast Asia and the likes. They don't consider them by individual countries, but by the area as a whole.

How long before the Type R is automatic only in the US?

frtorres87

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