If you had 60k to spend on a different car..

heavyD · May 10, 2019

ipeefreely said:
Then i question your taste in cars.

That's fine. Your opinion is trivial to me.

kevv_FK8 · May 10, 2019

ipeefreely said:
I'm a huge modder so I'm totally with you that every car can be made better for the track. But the sheer amount of mods to get the M2 to just be comparable to ... say a Gt4, ZL1 1LE ..etc... just isn't worth it. Because in the end you're still left with this heavy ass vehicle and a BMW no less. lol.

The point about used price is sort of moot because you can buy the other cars used too (sometimes at a greater discount than what the M2's go for).

Oh and just in case if anyone decides to question my credentials... here's a picture of my m2... lol. Fully built. Track ready.

that's awesome that you actually owned it because you have real world experience....how do you like the type R compared to it? which car do you think performs better?

Hollywoo0220 · May 10, 2019

$60K budget....hmmm....I'd choose sensibly. Something naturally aspirated that will have less maintenance. Unless of course the $60K is just for the car with maintenance not being a factor. A $60K budget really brings down the purchase price to $54500 (Tax/Title/Doc) would bring it up to $60K.
Don't let the "mid-life" push you into decisions that aren't the prudent choices. You should be well enough mature at this point to make sound personal business decissions. There are far many other choices that supercede the fleeting emotion that captivates us about a machine that gets us from A to B and back.

jinderC · May 10, 2019

Can’t see why you would want anything else after owning a iconic machine like the Type R Civic

ipeefreely · May 10, 2019

heavyD said:
That's fine. Your opinion is trivial to me.

likewise.

kevv_FK8 said:
that's awesome that you actually owned it because you have real world experience....how do you like the type R compared to it? which car do you think performs better?

I've only driven my cousin's type r at the track so I don't have too much track experience with it. I'll be taking mine out to Sonoma on 24-25th so i'll have to report back after that.

But so far... compared to the m2...

Pros:
- Much cheaper to modify
- Much lighter and thus more "flickable"
- can compete with cars in a much higher price bracket
- reliable
- much better thought out in terms of everything - infotainment, ease of modifying....etc...

Cons:
- boy racer look - it looks ricey. This is kind of good and bad depending on your preferences but can definitely get the wrong type of attention
- has that jdm build quality interior. It's definitely not luxurious
- makes less power so the car can feel a bit sluggish at times

leehom · May 11, 2019

ipeefreely said:
Pros:

- much better thought out in terms of everything - infotainment, ease of modifying....etc...

You have strange tastes. BMW infotainment is leagues above CTR and no lag. Even the Veloster N has a better system.

ipeefreely · May 11, 2019

leehom said:
You have strange tastes. BMW infotainment is leagues above CTR and no lag. Even the Veloster N has a better system.

This is probably just a ME thing but I really did not enjoy the idrive. I also did not like how any of the controls were integrated together. They seemed clumsy and not that intuitive to me. For example: The M2's driving modes were confusing as hell.

This is not to say that the CTR controls are great either.... It's just, albeit slightly, better than the ones in the m2.

Ironically, I actually have the least amount of "trouble" with the controls in my Raptor.

heavyD · May 11, 2019

leehom said:
You have strange tastes. BMW infotainment is leagues above CTR and no lag. Even the Veloster N has a better system.

He clearly has an axe to grind here with some of the misinformation he's posting. If he in fact owned one, he just didn't like it which is fair. Not everyone universally loves every single car as I was underwhelmed with my STI as IMO it didn't live up to the hype as I came from an EVO which I felt was simply a better performance car. Some of the stuff he is saying is blatant misinformation as for example with the heavier DCT transmission the M2 still weights under 3500 lbs not 3700. Here is a thread discussing owners actually weighing their cars; https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1612825. As you can see BMW's published weight is right in the same ballpark as what owners are seeing at the scales; https://www.caranddriver.com/bmw/m2/specs/2016/bmw-m2/383792.

BMW unreliable? Anyone can head over to bimmerpost and see that few people are having issues with these cars as they are largely bulletproof. I will also back that up in that BMW is actually one of the more reliable automakers; https://businesstech.co.za/news/motoring/299586/these-are-the-most-reliable-car-brands-for-2019/.

As for the infotainment system iDrive is one of the best in the business while the Honda one of the worst; https://www.consumerreports.org/automotive-technology/choose-an-infotainment-system-you-will-love/.

The car isn't perfect as 3500 lbs is heavy for a car of this size without a doubt (handicapped by originating from the entry level 2 series), while the interior isn't terrible it's the same ho-hum BMW interior design that is long overdue for an overhaul, the suspension is very firm and for the price tag you would expect the adaptive M suspension of the M3/M4, and last but not least the electronic steering is just okay as BMW has had a difficult time reducing the numbness of EPS as for example even Ford has done EPS much better in the Focus RS or even the Focus ST which is kind of embarrassing. It's not as bad as the EPS in say the Golf R but it's definitely a downgrade that's very noticeable if you get out of a 1M and into an M2. As far as pricing goes yes it's a little pricey but it's priced in-line with it's competition such as the RS3 and AMG CLA 45 which are both based on FWD economy car platforms and both slower around a track. The reason the M2 is popular (has there ever been a bad review?) is because it's a good car as there are so few RWD performance cars left in this day and age. Like every car today it's too heavy and not perfect but it's still a solid performer (faster than a CTR around the VIR; https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a23319884/lightning-lap-times-historical-data/) so take a disgruntled owners comments with a grain of salt as I at least provided some factual evidence rather than try pass off a biased opinion as fact.

jred721 · May 11, 2019

heavyD said:
He clearly has an axe to grind here with some of the misinformation he's posting. If he in fact owned one, he just didn't like it which is fair. Not everyone universally loves every single car as I was underwhelmed with my STI as IMO it didn't live up to the hype as I came from an EVO which I felt was simply a better performance car. Some of the stuff he is saying is blatant misinformation as for example with the heavier DCT transmission the M2 still weights under 3500 lbs not 3700. Here is a thread discussing owners actually weighing their cars; https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1612825. As you can see BMW's published weight is right in the same ballpark as what owners are seeing at the scales; https://www.caranddriver.com/bmw/m2/specs/2016/bmw-m2/383792.

BMW unreliable? Anyone can head over to bimmerpost and see that few people are having issues with these cars as they are largely bulletproof. I will also back that up in that BMW is actually one of the more reliable automakers; https://businesstech.co.za/news/motoring/299586/these-are-the-most-reliable-car-brands-for-2019/.

As for the infotainment system iDrive is one of the best in the business while the Honda one of the worst; https://www.consumerreports.org/automotive-technology/choose-an-infotainment-system-you-will-love/.

The car isn't perfect as 3500 lbs is heavy for a car of this size without a doubt (handicapped by originating from the entry level 2 series), while the interior isn't terrible it's the same ho-hum BMW interior design that is long overdue for an overhaul, the suspension is very firm and for the price tag you would expect the adaptive M suspension of the M3/M4, and last but not least the electronic steering is just okay as BMW has had a difficult time reducing the numbness of EPS as for example even Ford has done EPS much better in the Focus RS or even the Focus ST which is kind of embarrassing. It's not as bad as the EPS in say the Golf R but it's definitely a downgrade that's very noticeable if you get out of a 1M and into an M2. As far as pricing goes yes it's a little pricey but it's priced in-line with it's competition such as the RS3 and AMG CLA 45 which are both based on FWD economy car platforms and both slower around a track. The reason the M2 is popular (has there ever been a bad review?) is because it's a good car as there are so few RWD performance cars left in this day and age. Like every car today it's too heavy and not perfect but it's still a solid performer (faster than a CTR around the VIR; https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a23319884/lightning-lap-times-historical-data/) so take a disgruntled owners comments with a grain of salt as I at least provided some factual evidence rather than try pass off a biased opinion as fact.

He basically doesn't want to admit that the M2 is amazing car, every single review and even people I know personally who own one say it's either the best car BMW offers right now and they love it. It's one of the last true drivers cars out there, short wheelbase, a great motor up front, RWD, and available manual. As far as reliability goes, I always laugh when people trash talk BMW without actually owning one. I've had 2 BMW's so far, a 2015 550i which was tuned and had some bolt-ons making about 510 Horsepower to the wheels, and it treated me great even with those mods and all I ever needed was routine maintenance. And now, I currently own a 2018 M550i which I traded in my 2015 for and I bought the '18 CPO with about 13K miles on the clock. It's now up to around 16.5K and I've been on the BMW forums about these cars and I have yet to see any shred of evidence that BMW is in fact unreliable.

It just costs more to maintain because it's a more expensive car with expensive parts, but that's something you just have to come to terms with and accept. A lot of people assume a BMW should cost as much to maintain as a Honda Civic, and then get mad about it when they realize that isn't the case. And honestly it's not that bad anyway. I only bring it in for service like every 10,000 miles and the rest of the time i'm worry free. I actually made a post earlier on this thread saying I would go with an Audi RS7, but I ended up getting a almost brand new M550i for under 60K and honestly couldn't be happier. Perfect blend of performance that can rip your face off on a launch and practicality.

87elco · May 11, 2019

Hmm 60k I'd have everything si for daily, 370,mustang by camaro ss,or s2000 for fun,and a truck lol all payment free hahah

ipeefreely · May 11, 2019

heavyD said:
He clearly has an axe to grind here with some of the misinformation he's posting. If he in fact owned one, he just didn't like it which is fair. Not everyone universally loves every single car as I was underwhelmed with my STI as IMO it didn't live up to the hype as I came from an EVO which I felt was simply a better performance car. Some of the stuff he is saying is blatant misinformation as for example with the heavier DCT transmission the M2 still weights under 3500 lbs not 3700. Here is a thread discussing owners actually weighing their cars; https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1612825. As you can see BMW's published weight is right in the same ballpark as what owners are seeing at the scales; https://www.caranddriver.com/bmw/m2/specs/2016/bmw-m2/383792.

BMW unreliable? Anyone can head over to bimmerpost and see that few people are having issues with these cars as they are largely bulletproof. I will also back that up in that BMW is actually one of the more reliable automakers; https://businesstech.co.za/news/motoring/299586/these-are-the-most-reliable-car-brands-for-2019/.

As for the infotainment system iDrive is one of the best in the business while the Honda one of the worst; https://www.consumerreports.org/automotive-technology/choose-an-infotainment-system-you-will-love/.

The car isn't perfect as 3500 lbs is heavy for a car of this size without a doubt (handicapped by originating from the entry level 2 series), while the interior isn't terrible it's the same ho-hum BMW interior design that is long overdue for an overhaul, the suspension is very firm and for the price tag you would expect the adaptive M suspension of the M3/M4, and last but not least the electronic steering is just okay as BMW has had a difficult time reducing the numbness of EPS as for example even Ford has done EPS much better in the Focus RS or even the Focus ST which is kind of embarrassing. It's not as bad as the EPS in say the Golf R but it's definitely a downgrade that's very noticeable if you get out of a 1M and into an M2. As far as pricing goes yes it's a little pricey but it's priced in-line with it's competition such as the RS3 and AMG CLA 45 which are both based on FWD economy car platforms and both slower around a track. The reason the M2 is popular (has there ever been a bad review?) is because it's a good car as there are so few RWD performance cars left in this day and age. Like every car today it's too heavy and not perfect but it's still a solid performer (faster than a CTR around the VIR; https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a23319884/lightning-lap-times-historical-data/) so take a disgruntled owners comments with a grain of salt as I at least provided some factual evidence rather than try pass off a biased opinion as fact.

In fact if I ever owned one? Lmao. ok. Yeah. Not going to waste my time trying to convince you if you're going to attack me on that front...

As for your other points...

1. Now I'm sorry if I wasn't super exact but let's be honest here.... It doesn't matter whether it's 3500 or 3700 lbs. The car, on track, feels like it's an overweight cow. And it eats up brakes... badly. I put pagid RS29's pads on mine and it still had really bad brake fade 3-4 laps in.
2. As I stated before, the idrive is a matter of preference. Me? I personally hate it. I hate every car that has idrive or anything close to it (for example: our family's GL has it and i honestly hate that thing).
3. Interior - it sucks. My sister's Mazda honestly has a better interior. The seats are dated and don't hold you well. A lot of the controls are oddly placed (such as the lock / unlock button).
3. Pricing - it's expensive. I bought my m2 second hand and even that was close to 45k. Well... closer to 50 if you add tax and delivery. Add some basic and "essential" mods (roll cage, brakes, and coilovers) for the track and you're knocking on the door of 60k. That's crazy.
4. Reliability - I come from an asian family full of Toyotas and Hondas. That's what I'm comparing the reliability to. You gonna tell me BMW is more reliable than those brands?

I think the issues with this whole debate is that a lot of this stuff is just my opinion and preferences. And a lot of those preferences circle around how the car feels, to me, on track. You guys obviously have different priorities when it comes to selecting a car. So understand that I'm not trying to pass anything off as FACT. All I'm trying to do is share my experience, using my preferences as a guideline, with you guys. So like you said, take it with a grain of salt.

mechaniconsunday · May 11, 2019

midlifejohnny said:
I'm considering the Type R. I have had many sports cars of the years. Several Corvettes, Porsches AMG Mercedes. Sold my 2014 C4S in 2016 and for some reason this little Hot hatch has my attention big time. My question to all of you, and I understand Im on a Honda forum, is if you were currently back in the market for a car and had a budget of 60k what would you be considering? Im sure many of you are like me and after 6 months of ownership you have "other car envy'.. Is it crazy to think that some of you love this car so much that you would, if given the option, choose the TypeR over an Audi RS3, slightly used Camaro ZL1 or Corvette Grandsport, Mustang GT PP2. Before responding, there are lots of things to consider. I may occasionally track this car. I have three teenage kids and do I really want them asking for the keys to 650Hp? Will they be embarrassed that dad is driving a car with a wing. lol
I still own a 2010 GTI that my 17 year old drives. Miss the zippin around town feel of a hot hatch. I like the idea of 22+ miles per gallon. Escalade bothers me at 14mpg so I think the cars I listed above will just add to that. Anyway, sorry for the long winded "first post" on the forum but I'm seriously considering this car. Want to have something again in the garage that makes me just want to go for a Sunday drive and at 3117 lbs and 306bhp seems plenty for street legal driving. Lastly, three teenagers translates to 3 kids in college very soon so spending 35k vs 60k would be a good thing Thanks in advance

If I had 60K to spend on a car, I would buy the new Toyota Supra, might not be the fastest 0 to 60 mph ever made but a 50-50% weight distribution will make it a track beast, plus a toyota OCD oriented quality control will give its owners peace of mind and they will be able to keep a long time, or not loose too much value if they sell it, not like a german or an american sports cars that hold their value like a plastic chair holds the ground in the middle of a hurricane...

boosted180sx · May 11, 2019

mechaniconsunday said:
If I had 60K to spend on a car, I would buy the new Toyota Supra, might not be the fastest 0 to 60 mph ever made but a 50-50% weight distribution will make it a track beast, plus a toyota OCD oriented quality control will give its owners peace of mind and they will be able to keep a long time, or not loose too much value if they sell it, not like a german or an american sports cars that hold their value like a plastic chair holds the ground in the middle of a hurricane...

i like the way it looks, love the way it sounds, and looks like it's a lot of fun. however I just can't buy a fun car that is not MT.
I don't care how good the ZF transmission is. An AT is just not as fun to drive to me.

ipeefreely · May 11, 2019

boosted180sx said:
i like the way it looks, love the way it sounds, and looks like it's a lot of fun. however I just can't buy a fun car that is not MT.
I don't care how good the ZF transmission is. An AT is just not as fun to drive to me.

I actually hated how the new supra looked like. BUT man it's growing on me. Seems like it will be a lot of fun. Just waiting for that manual version.

I'm sure Toyota will release one. It'd be a damn shame if they didn't.

mechaniconsunday · May 11, 2019

boosted180sx said:
i like the way it looks, love the way it sounds, and looks like it's a lot of fun. however I just can't buy a fun car that is not MT.
I don't care how good the ZF transmission is. An AT is just not as fun to drive to me.

It comes to personal preferences, even though I agree with you that a MT is more fun to have in a sports car, I think that some sports cars are better with an AT, such as an audi RS7 ou a MB C63amg s or the Kia Stinger with the 3.3 turbo. The new Supra will probably get a 6 speed MT in the future, but even without it it stays a great new performance vehicule from Toyota, and I would like to see a Honda/Acura vehicule in this segment, currently there is no honda product in this category and the NSX is a very expensive supercar (which is not worth the price when you see its interior and it hondalink navigation 7 inch screen) and the TLX is just a fancy honda accord with AWD and a naturally aspirated good V6 and it would never come to the mind of somebody whos lookin for a zippy and good handling sports car

If you had 60k to spend on a different car..

heavyD

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kevv_FK8

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Hollywoo0220

Customer Service oriented (most of the time) :-)

jinderC

ipeefreely

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leehom

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ipeefreely

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heavyD

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jred721

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87elco

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ipeefreely

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boosted180sx

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ipeefreely

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