Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise

voiddweller

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I wanted to post up my latest experience dealing with a few warranty issues on my '17 CTR. I've owned a lot of new cars (five were from Honda) and have a pretty good idea how this is going to turn out so I'm simply sharing the fun :)

Issues:

Car taken to local dealer to review a few items:

  1. Check engine light "P2261"
  2. Peeling rear caliper paint
  3. Damage to front lower engine splash shield due to missing bolts

Resolution:

  1. Replaced bypass control valve under warranty
  2. Caliper will be replaced under warranty next week - it's on back-order
  3. They will not replace the shield and bolts (surprise!) lol

Next Day:

The following morning, the car was hesitating and bucking again, so it went right back to the franchise. I insisted that the Tech that did the work take a ride with me. The problem mysteriously went away after some slight bucking. He suggested I leave it overnight to see if it's related to a cold engine condition, so I'll do that when the caliper arrives. I was surprised that he wasn't a Master Tech, but he's a nice guy and we chatted for a bit about his MR2's. From our conversation, he's only worked on two CTR's because they don't sell many in the area.

After speaking with the Service Manager, I requested the contact information for the Honda regional rep that denied the warranty claim on the shield. Pics were sent that I took before I drove the car in for service showing the missing bolts. I had a feeling it was going to go this way, so I called Honda Customer Service three days ago and they assigned a rep to call me back today. The replacement parts are $60 shipped via my favorite online Honda dealer, so you'll get a kick out of the local quote. Since it's rainy season, I ordered the parts and they will take a week to get in.

I'll post back when this is resolved. The car has a little over 3,000 miles on the odometer. Enjoy the pics :)
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Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 1 (2)


Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 1 (8)


Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 1 (9)


Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 2


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Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 5


Honda Civic 10th gen Warranty Experience @ Local Honda Franchise 6
 

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voiddweller

voiddweller

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The caliper was replaced today. The P2261 Error, which came back the morning after my post, is still being diagnosed. They've had the car all day and may need to keep it overnight.

Honda Corporate called after they contacted the area field representative to re-review the case.

My pics and explaination didn't seem to make a difference so they will not to cover the damage. Corporate said my only remaining option would be through consumer protection channels. The corporate representative said she hoped this experience wouldn't deter me from buying Honda.

I figured it would go this way because the franchise kept implying I was at fault so I'm glad I ordered the parts. They'll be here in two days.
 
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voiddweller

voiddweller

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I just heard back from the service manager at the dealership and was informed the code was cause by an overboost situation from an aftermarket PCM and Honda Corporate was denying any warranty work. The car is completely stock, so I'm calling Honda Customer Care right now....

Left a message with the CSR handling the case so I expect to hear back within 5 business days....

I called the Service Manager back and it went to voicemail so I asked to speak with the GM. He's going to look into the situation and get back with me.

That Camaro 1LE is looking a lot better right now.... :)
 
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voiddweller

voiddweller

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How did you get them to replace the calipers? Because the clear coat from mine is coming off and they’re saying it’s due to heat and that it’s normal wear and tear..... /sigh
The District Honda Parts and Service Rep has the final say. From what I've found, the Tech, Service Advisor, and Service Manager need to take it to the Honda P&S Director to get approval. For something like the caliper, I'd try going to another Honda Service Department at a different franchise or calling Honda Customer Care. If you go the Customer Care route, they'll review your customer history and assign an agent that will call the franchise and the P&S Director. Be very professional and let them know your disappointed and would like them to review your issue.
 


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voiddweller

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I spoke with the local General Manager late last week. Honda sent a virgin ECU/PCM to see if the car still threw the same code. It arrived today and the local Master Tech said there were no codes after driving it for a baseline. Honda told the franchise that this confirmed the ECU/PCM was altered.

When I asked the GM for the data from the Tech Line evaluation, he stated Honda would not provide it to him or me because it is considered proprietary. Per the GM, Honda Corp stated that the store had to put a note into the car's service record stating the customer altered the ECU. If they didn't, the store would not be paid for the warranty work.

Further, Honda stated they would not cover any future warranty issues related to the current ECU/PCM. The GM suggested they replace ECU with a new part at my expense ($770) to ensure that car was 100% covered with the original terms of the new car warranty. Considering the situation, I'm not comfortable driving the car or selling it with a faulty ECU, so I told him to move forward with replacing it and to let me know when the car was ready.

I'd like to find a specialist to take the original ECU and pull the data. Hopefully, it will have dates and times so we can figure out what's going on.

Honda Customer care is supposed to be following up within 24 hours.

In my opinion, the CTR is a really good car. It's been fun at driving schools and as a daily driver. Monetarily, the residual value is outstanding.

Unfortunately, the false accusations (and unwillingness to provide data) for a 100% stock car leaves me feeling stressed out and disillusioned. The years of supporting petitions, calling customer care, and writing to Honda to bring the CTR to North America feel wasted. I sincerely hope Honda Customer Care steps in to provide a positive outcome.
 
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voiddweller

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I picked up the car this evening with the new ECU. On the way home, it started bucking and hesitating, then stopped. Exact same symptoms as before, but no codes. The Service Department was closed so I called the Service Manager and left a voicemail describing the situation.
 

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I picked up the car this evening with the new ECU. On the way home, it started bucking and hesitating, then stopped. Exact same symptoms as before, but no codes. The Service Department was closed so I called the Service Manager and left a voicemail describing the situation.
I seriously hope it throws a code again. If the car legitimately is stock, and I have no reason to doubt you, this is absolute bullshit. Fuck Honda corporate. I'm rooting for you!
 

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Shit man. Good luck.

Dealership did my oil change and forgot some bolts for my cover. Fell off a bit (unknown to me) and eventually hit something which bent it similar to yours. Happened like a day after the oil change and they replaced it.
 
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Honda Roadside Assistance is sending a AAA flatbed over to pick up the car. I'm not comfortable driving it.
 


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voiddweller

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A Honda Tech and I went out for a test drive and the CEL came on.

They are pulling the codes now...
 
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voiddweller

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Dealership did my oil change and forgot some bolts for my cover. Fell off a bit (unknown to me) and eventually hit something which bent it similar to yours. Happened like a day after the oil change and they replaced it.
I called the out of state dealership that did the oil change and the Service Manager was off today. A service advisor looked up the work order and said the Tech that did the work was really good. He suggested I call back tomorrow and set my expectation that (most likely) nothing positive will result from the conversation.
 
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The Service Advisor just called and said the new PCM/ECU had a programming error due to some data that didn't copy over from the old unit. They said to bring back the original unit for the source data. I'll be heading over there in 30 minutes.
 

SCOPESYS

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I spoke with the local General Manager late last week. Honda sent a virgin ECU/PCM to see if the car still threw the same code. It arrived today and the local Master Tech said there were no codes after driving it for a baseline. Honda told the franchise that this confirmed the ECU/PCM was altered.

When I asked the GM for the data from the Tech Line evaluation, he stated Honda would not provide it to him or me because it is considered proprietary. Per the GM, Honda Corp stated that the store had to put a note into the car's service record stating the customer altered the ECU. If they didn't, the store would not be paid for the warranty work.

Further, Honda stated they would not cover any future warranty issues related to the current ECU/PCM. The GM suggested they replace ECU with a new part at my expense ($770) to ensure that car was 100% covered with the original terms of the new car warranty. Considering the situation, I'm not comfortable driving the car or selling it with a faulty ECU, so I told him to move forward with replacing it and to let me know when the car was ready.

I'd like to find a specialist to take the original ECU and pull the data. Hopefully, it will have dates and times so we can figure out what's going on.

Honda Customer care is supposed to be following up within 24 hours.

In my opinion, the CTR is a really good car. It's been fun at driving schools and as a daily driver. Monetarily, the residual value is outstanding.

Unfortunately, the false accusations (and unwillingness to provide data) for a 100% stock car leaves me feeling stressed out and disillusioned.
The Service Advisor just called and said the new PCM/ECU had a programming error due to some data that didn't copy over from the old unit. They said to bring back the original unit for the source data. I'll be heading over there in 30 minutes.
So much about this just STINKS of lies and deception.

1st they accuse you of re-programming your old ECU (but refuse to show proof) and then when they put in a new ECU, that goes on to exhibit the same issues and the old one, They then claim it does so because they did not cop[y across data from the old ECU that they CLAIM has been re-programmed incorrectly !! :doh:

And the whole Splash Shield story is just so flawed.

(1) If the Splash screen was missing fasteners from the factory, then its WARRANTY.

(2) If the Splash Screen was missing fasteners after the DEA:ER did the oil change, then its NOT Warranty, it's Dealer Error, and the dealer should cover it (Not cover it up !!)

(3) If the Splash Screen was missing because someone else did the oil change, then its Neither HONDA or Dealer fault/warranty.

Far to many "reported" instances of missing fasteners, typically after dealer oil changes .
Either the unskilled Dealer OIL Changers are not bothering to fit the fasteners, or iare re-fitting them incorrectly, or there is a design fault with the fasteners.

Personally I think it is the Dealers unskilled oil changers, because I have had my Splash Screen on and off twice myself, and each time, when re-fitted correctly with all the fasteners, there have been no issues of fasteners or screen coming loose.

(Note: I did NOT try to use an Air Impact wrench to remove or re-attach the fasteners !! get the picture !! ;))


I would suggest than anyone getting an oil change, checks the fasteners themselves--- before and after, and take at least before pictures to prove the fasteners were there when the car was submitted for the oil change.

Has it really come down to this, that Honda Owners cannot even trust their Dealer to do a simple oil change, without screwing it up, and then, if they do, not lie about it afterwards.
 
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SCOPESYS

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I Per the GM, Honda Corp stated that the store had to put a note into the car's service record stating the customer altered the ECU. If they didn't, the store would not be paid for the warranty work.
This does not make sense...

If the Customer had altered the ECU, then it needs to be noted that they did, and it is NOT warranty. (some PROOF would be nice !!! )

If the Customer did NOT alter the ECU, then its Warranty and the note, if any, should say that the customer had NOT altered the ECU.

Sound like the GM is an Idiot !!!

Its a COMPUTER !!! If it has been altered, then that altered data is NOT Honda Propriety, an they should be able to tell you what has been changed !! -- but they cannot, because it's all BS !!!
They should also be able to Flash it back to Factory .. you should only need a new ECU, if the ECU is damaged ??? .. More BS !!!


Of course, all of this assumes that the problem is being caused by the ECU ... which does not seem to be definitely confirmed yet to be the correct diagnosis of the problem.

Unfortunately, you may never know, because the Dealer seems to be able to say whatever they like, and do whatever they like "out the back" where you cannot see what they are doing, and all you have is their word that they are telling the truth, and not covering up their incompetent diagnose, or lies to maximize their profit on the "service" work.
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