FK8 Master Spring Thread!

ctrmofo

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Appreciate the detailed response. Would a 255 have noticeably more grip in the dry/be more sketchy in the wet than the stock 245 or not so much? Also, may be a dumb question but with the speedo being digital is there no way to apply a correction factor?
i went back and checked the calculations. 255/35/19 will be fine for your speedo and only 1% off on speedo which is negligible vs. 245/35/19 i'm running which is 0.1% off on speedo as comparo. you're fine there and no there is no way to correct the speedo.

as for "grip in dry", are you referring to forward/longitudinal or lateral grip? what are you looking for when you say "grip"? wider front tires reduces understeer at low speed and quicker turn in due to greater slip angles thus more lateral/cornering grip. if rear is also increased to 255 then it sort of neutralizes the gains from the front and brings you back similar to stock behavior so fine there. if you go 255 front and 245 rear then greater turn in with some induced oversteer effect.

on street it reduces gas mileage just a tad. 255 has a little bigger contact patch than 245 thus less pressure (psi) on the contact patch (same total car weight on larger surface area) thus on wet is a little more skittish than 245's contact patch but shouldn't be something to worry about as long as tread pattern moves water good enough.

if you're looking for forward grip on launches from a stop, yes, you'll get a little bit more grip. just something i've never really been concerned with in a fwd car. grip while moving or in corners are what i personally look for but just me.
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Estoril4

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i went back and checked the calculations. 255/35/19 will be fine for your speedo and only 1% off on speedo which is negligible vs. 245/35/19 i'm running which is 0.1% off on speedo as comparo. you're fine there and no there is no way to correct the speedo.

as for "grip in dry", are you referring to forward/longitudinal or lateral grip? what are you looking for when you say "grip"? wider front tires reduces understeer at low speed and quicker turn in due to greater slip angles thus more lateral/cornering grip. if rear is also increased to 255 then it sort of neutralizes the gains from the front and brings you back similar to stock behavior so fine there. if you go 255 front and 245 rear then greater turn in with some induced oversteer effect.

on street it reduces gas mileage just a tad. 255 has a little bigger contact patch than 245 thus less pressure (psi) on the contact patch (same total car weight on larger surface area) thus on wet is a little more skittish than 245's contact patch but shouldn't be something to worry about as long as tread pattern moves water good enough.

if you're looking for forward grip on launches from a stop, yes, you'll get a little bit more grip. just something i've never really been concerned with in a fwd car. grip while moving or in corners are what i personally look for but just me.
You the man - moreso meant lateral grip; so a larger contact patch wont provide and more lateral grip? Sounds like there isn't a whole lot of benefit to running 255 on a daily then? As far as looks is there any distinguishable difference
 

ctrmofo

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You the man - moreso meant lateral grip; so a larger contact patch wont provide and more lateral grip? Sounds like there isn't a whole lot of benefit to running 255 on a daily then? As far as looks is there any distinguishable difference
yes, larger contact patch does provide more lateral grip for sure. 255 on daily vs stock 245 has pluses and minuses but may not be that much of a difference.

- 255 heavier tire since it's also slightly taller and moves rotational mass outward from axle
- maybe tiny reduction in gas mileage due to increased rolling resistance if you care about mpg
- some improvement in forward grip upon launch from stop but not going to give you crazy launches without wheel spin
- 255 is 3.5 mm taller than 245 in same 35 series so depends if you can see that 3.5 mm or not
 

02SilverSiHB

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I see RSR makes springs for our car also. Not sure if that's been posted yet.
This site lets you buy from yahoo japan auctions for RSR and other springs (other parts) like ESPELIR: https://www.nengun.com/auction/search#k:fk8;g:8 (scroll to the top and click search, then yahoo japan. Then on the left in the search box, put FK8, click go)

I'm not sure if this is really the drop for RSR springs...if so, that's like a 1.5" drop :eek:
https://www.rs-r.co.jp/script/e_itemsearch/index.html?CIVIC&FK8&suspension
Front spring rate: 5.36
Rear spring rate: 5.1
Drop is 40mm~35 (1.3" to 1.5")

Edit, I found this on the yahoo japan auction site, so may be more accurate:
Drop F:20-15
Drop R:25-20
Spring rate F:5.31
Spring rate R:5.31

Honda Civic 10th gen FK8 Master Spring Thread! fk8_d
 
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r712

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Drove in +R mode with the Spoon springs for the first time today. Car felt insanely planted and the ride was super smooth around some serious corners. It was probably the most fun I've had in the car this morning and I definitely don't feel like I lost anything compared to stock.

(Note: I haven't tracked the car yet so this is a casual daily driver's review. Lol)
 


jinderC

2 minute mark...just replacing the springs isn’t ideal for performance

 
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HONDA X

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Drove in +R mode with the Spoon springs for the first time today. Car felt insanely planted and the ride was super smooth around some serious corners. It was probably the most fun I've had in the car this morning and I definitely don't feel like I lost anything compared to stock.

(Note: I haven't tracked the car yet so this is a casual daily driver's review. Lol)
It seems like Spoon Sports make’s the best lowering springs for the CTR as of date. I have heard nothing but good reviews about Spoon Sports lowering springs. Then again it’s Spoon Sports. I will probably take this route when it’s time to lower the ride height of my car.
 

ctrmofo

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It seems like Spoon Sports make’s the best lowering springs for the CTR as of date. I have heard nothing but good reviews about Spoon Sports lowering springs. Then again it’s Spoon Sports. I will probably take this route when it’s time to lower the ride height of my car.
not sure about "the best". it's very similar to eibach pro kit. don't what what "the best" springs really are since they are pretty much same with linear front and progressive rears when it comes to aftermarket, with the exception of swift which are opposite (progressive front, linear rear).

only difference is spring rate and height. eibach pro kit, h&r, and spoon are all same lowering height. swift are 0.25" lower and stiffer. really nothing magical about spoon springs other than the brand name which you pay for.
 

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not sure about "the best". it's very similar to eibach pro kit. don't what what "the best" springs really are since they are pretty much same with linear front and progressive rears when it comes to aftermarket, with the exception of swift which are opposite (progressive front, linear rear).

only difference is spring rate and height. eibach pro kit, h&r, and spoon are all same lowering height. swift are 0.25" lower and stiffer. really nothing magical about spoon springs other than the brand name which you pay for.
"Best" is subjective, but there's a small difference in the spring design between Spoon and Eibach, combine that with maybe a difference in material and you could get enough a difference to notice. I think the Spoon rep on here said they designed theirs to be more compliant in turns and over bumps vs. the Eibachs. The difference is probably really small and only under certain conditions and if that's worth the cost upcharge is going to be up to the individual.
 

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not sure about "the best". it's very similar to eibach pro kit. don't what what "the best" springs really are since they are pretty much same with linear front and progressive rears when it comes to aftermarket, with the exception of swift which are opposite (progressive front, linear rear).

only difference is spring rate and height. eibach pro kit, h&r, and spoon are all same lowering height. swift are 0.25" lower and stiffer. really nothing magical about spoon springs other than the brand name which you pay for.
The spoon sport springs are progressive in the front and the back

And if you look at the picture , there's a difference of where the progressive loop are located
Stock vs. Eibach vs. Spoon Progressive Spring
IMG_9908.JPG

IMG_9920.JPG
 


02SilverSiHB

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"Best" is subjective, but there's a small difference in the spring design between Spoon and Eibach, combine that with maybe a difference in material and you could get enough a difference to notice. I think the Spoon rep on here said they designed theirs to be more compliant in turns and over bumps vs. the Eibachs. The difference is probably really small and only under certain conditions and if that's worth the cost upcharge is going to be up to the individual.
Dont even worry about him. I'm confident he's being sponsored by eibach and probably gets paid each time he says eibach or prokit like that dude in idiocracy that gets paid each time he says brought to by Carl's junior
 

02SilverSiHB

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2 minute mark...just replacing the springs isn’t ideal for performance

Yeah this is how I feel man. I keep thinking of removing the prokits <waiting for ctrmofo to defend prokit any second>

It's cold right now...but hopefully I can get it done before snow hits. I'm also not sure how it will look on stock height with my 18s as I'm running slightly smaller diameter with the 265/35 tires
 

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Dont even worry about him. I'm confident he's being sponsored by eibach and probably gets paid each time he says eibach or prokit like that dude in idiocracy that gets paid each time he says brought to by Carl's junior
He's an active member and runs the kit himself so I don't really have a problem with him advocating for them. The general consensus on the forums is that the Eibachs are pretty good and ride fairly close to stock, you are one of the few (maybe only) that has been actively posting about them being bad. That's not to discredit how you feel, or the mechanics behind what is covered in that Youtube video either. I haven't ridden in a CTR other than a stock one so I can't say anything about any spring with any certainty, but based on what I know:
  • Springs that keep rates close to OEM will ride better because an OEM damper is designed to work for a certain spring rate, so going way stiffer is going to be a mismatch
  • Springs that have a larger drop will usually perform worse since you're reducing the travel more on a damper that was designed to have more travel
Therefore, a spring that keeps rates close to OEM and keeps the drop modest should, in theory not have a really adverse effect on how car handles. Full coilovers introduce their own set of issues and negatives too. I have my own worries about going with any suspension change as I enjoy the car stock and just wish it was a little lower, I am leaning towards Spoon as available information puts them at the closest to the stock ride as anything so it's potentially worth the cost to me. I'm also tempted to just not drop it and go with a wheel/tire combo that would fill out the wheel arches more (something like a 255/40/18 tire) and just leave it at that.
 

ctrmofo

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Dont even worry about him. I'm confident he's being sponsored by eibach and probably gets paid each time he says eibach or prokit like that dude in idiocracy that gets paid each time he says brought to by Carl's junior
it's hard to educate people who don't want to learn or have the experience and knowledge to even discuss intelligently.

you're the same guy who spews "hondata blows up motors" when you have no idea what tuning is about.

please explain to me 3 critical elements of handling tuning in the areas of: 1) mechanical balance, 2) aero balance, and 3) center of gravity....AND for each during low speed cornering and high speed cornering.

go explore the limits of the factory setup before you hurt yourself doing things you shouldn't be.

if you can't technically explain the results and impact of suspension tuning and jump right to you uneducated comments above, then i know it's out of your league.

ps - for the record eibach does not sponsor me although many other product companies do - that's not simply a discount that you think is a "sponsorship" but it's actually joint development and pre-production feedback done for such companies.
 

ctrmofo

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The spoon sport springs are progressive in the front and the back

And if you look at the picture , there's a difference of where the progressive loop are located
correct, spoon decided to go opposite to the stock setup on both front and back end with progressive springs vs stock both linear front and rear. they did that mainly for ride impact in a steady state condition ala going straight and a bump comes up. i'm fine with that design as it will be a somewhat "softer" (if i can describe in words) as the car rides in a straight line.

keep in mind too springs and not just about going straight, and i focus on low speed cornering which is most impacted and tunable via suspension components (vs. high speed cornering which is impacted by aeros, ie, front/rear diffusers and wings).

like i said the spoon springs are fine and will perform similarly to eibach pro kit or h&r....not as drastically different as the swift which are 60% stiffer in rear and about 25% stiffer front. what i'm saying is a group spoon, eibach pro kit, and h&r in one group - incremental change. then the next group would be swift and upcoming eibach sportline to be released soon, both of which will significantly stiffer.

where i believe ALL springs available should have done was provide both front and rear linear - not one end only - at a no more than 25% increase in stiffness equally front and rear.

MOST ppl just do springs for the look and "close that gap" but don't really think about low speed cornering impact and how it changes the dynamics of a very well designed suspensions setup by honda out the box. it's is NOT your grandfather's civic. ppl seem to forget the car comes with AHS (active handling system) and torque vectoring....all work in concert with the LSD and abs system.

there's no holy war for me on springs...they're simple and straightforward. what is holy for me is how the balance of the car is maintained or improved in a positive way for specific results under specific conditions.

mind you i come from a different reference point too....if you want to know what rock hard non adjustable suspensions are, my lambo is ALWAYS stiff and makes ctr even on stiffest springs feel like a baby's carriage.
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