Grambles

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See my previous replies in this thread about the 1.5T.
Source? If it's Jason or Rollednsx then I don't have full belief yet. I'm still shuffling through my channels.

If it's internal, I will respect the discretion
 

Vtak Groceries

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Time will tell! If it's the 2.0t I am going to put a order down on a civic si. That engine will have alot of potential. Can't wait for an official word from Honda.
 

Tuttle

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Seems like more than one "source" pointing to this being true. A detuned 2.0L would be a huge win for Si owners, not so much for CTR if they care to be in exclusive company. Which they will by virtue of price tag if nothing else.
 

Phosky

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This statement doesn't particularly indicate Si getting a 2.0T. It merely says they go mass production with the K20C engine for the Civic lineup.

We already know the Type R is being released for this platform so all signs might point to that as indication. In my opinion, it seems Honda might want to distance the TypeR from the Si and create a more powerful 1.5T to top the engine series off and leave the 2.0T on its own island. Seeing as though the 2.0T will fill the entire Honda lineup eventually, I would guess this would be the case. This engine will have a large foundation set for it.

I could be wrong and hopefully am. But to close the gap between Si and TypeR would cannibalize Type R sales for an already limited production vehicle. Also, their plans to make the next Type R faster than current doesn't particularly mean it needs to have more horsepower.
I'm bewildered with the 1.5T infatuation. Honda announced back in 2013 that there would be three new turbo Earth Dreams engines: a 1.0L, a 1.5L and a 2.0L. Now the first one I imagine most of us don't really care about, and we've seen the second offered up in certain trim levels of the new Civic. The super-sized version is the one that really piques my interest, and I believe this is the one that will power the new Si and Type-R. Here's why:

1. It's safer to make a strong engine with a little less power than it is to make a mid-range engine with a little more power. In the case of the latter, there's certainly warranty considerations that have to be factored in
2. Honda's positioning of the Si in it's own competitive market (GTi, Focus ST, Mini Cooper S, maybe even a WRX or Evolution, if you're feeling froggy). These are all 2.0L+ cars. If you knock it down a size where other sub-2.0L cars play, you're into the Fiesta/Fiat Abarth/Fit territory -- not a traditional playground of the Si.
3. With the ostensibly limited production of the CTR, it would be absurd to build a totally unique power plant just for the R platform. Better to build a strong 2.0L mill and throw some lower CR slugs in it with a tune to match. With closer parts commonality with a "regular" model, the rationale behind a Type-R variant is far more palatable.
4. Type-Rs have always used a power plant based off an existing Si model (or region equivalent). Well, perhaps with the sole exception of the vaporous 2016 CTR.

The writing is all over the wall, the floors, and even the mirrors. All we have to do now is wait for Honda to make it official.
 


haztorks

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This 1.5T is basically like what Ford's 1.6T EcoBoost is/will be for the company. The Si will surely have a 2.0L
 

limitedslip

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my sneak suspicion is that Honda was wanting to get 210-20 crank hp out of the 1.5t, and together with the 150lb savings on the dry curb of new chassis and a few lbs over the heavier 2.0t .. thus effectively making the Si a 5.8 - 6.0 sec and sub 15sec quarter runner (with mech. limited slip of course)
and this was my opinion when talk began last year of the turbo intro's .. but what i do know is that Honda (HPD racing arm too) listens to the fans and will make late term decisions if needed !! .. and HPD would want to campaign a competitive chassis / engine package in the various ST(street tuner) and TC(Touring Car) series in the US .. that only allows the 1.6t (200bhp) of the Kia Coupe in 2015 regulations
all IMO of course
 

haztorks

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My suspicion is that they want to aim closer to the Focus STs 2.0L @ 252hp and reach for over 300hp for the type-r.
 

Design

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2.0T has been the game plan all along. And 230 is a fairly conservative number. If Honda chose to do so, they could easily wrangle 250-260 out of the Si without encroaching on the 9th or 10th Gen CTR.

That said, 230-240 will be the likely target, unless they find another way to dial out torque steer.
 

limitedslip

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2.0T has been the game plan all along. And 230 is a fairly conservative number. If Honda chose to do so, they could easily wrangle 250-260 out of the Si without encroaching on the 9th or 10th Gen CTR.

That said, 230-240 will be the likely target, unless they find another way to dial out torque steer.
yup .. with the 260max figure they would need to use the Type R twin pivot (or whatever they call it) front end

fair target with the ST as rabbit !!
 


Grambles

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2.0T has been the game plan all along. And 230 is a fairly conservative number. If Honda chose to do so, they could easily wrangle 250-260 out of the Si without encroaching on the 9th or 10th Gen CTR.

That said, 230-240 will be the likely target, unless they find another way to dial out torque steer.
False. The 2.0T hasn't been the game plan all along. Your sources know this. Honda realized that to be the best, they would need more than just "feature driven" help. If this is the case then it is a win.

If Honda has chosen the 2.0T for the Si then it is very recent news that will certainly impact their scheduling but will be very welcomed across the community. This may be the best thing for the Civic lineup. However, I still think the Type R will need some massaging to make it unique.

The rumored 340hp would suffice.
 

Grambles

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I'm more butt hurt that this change delayed the original target for Si release, among other platform reasons.

Good thing though. The Si needed it.
 

Tuttle

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I'm more butt hurt that this change delayed the original target for Si release, among other platform reasons.

Good thing though. The Si needed it.
I take it you've checked your own sources and they have told you the same info about the 2.0L in the next Si?
 

Grambles

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I take it you've checked your own sources and they have told you the same info about the 2.0L in the next Si?
Negative. Although I haven't spoken with my sources for a while since they've been busy with the recent Civic launch and working hard on the Coupe launch. If the change happened, it happened very recently.

But it requires all new testing for harmonics, chassis dynamics etc etc.

Actually I take that back, if the Type R team is where I believe it is they are actually ahead of the Si team. Seeing as though it shares a lot with the 4DR already, they could be using the same metric values give or take some sound deadening to provide a better "street comfort". It's plausible, but then again so is the 1.5T.

We haven't seen spy shots of an Si. But we've seen a Type R.

It's whether the engineers want to tune UP a 1.5T or DOWN a 2.0T. Both are difficult because it requires some assumptions for customer usage.
 

BakedTuna

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3. With the ostensibly limited production of the CTR, it would be absurd to build a totally unique power plant just for the R platform. Better to build a strong 2.0L mill and throw some lower CR slugs in it with a tune to match. With closer parts commonality with a "regular" model, the rationale behind a Type-R variant is far more palatable.
The Type R engine is being ran in such small numbers That if this engine were exclusive to just the Type R Civic the cost they would charge would be absurd. Phosky I believe has nailed it with his quote above.
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