Xtreme-DI EVO fuel upgrade discussion

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WhiskeyTango

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It depends on what the equation is trying to evaluate.

If youre looking to test the limits of the turbo without potentially grenading your engine, it makes sense to build the block if you have the means.

Not everyone has the means to buy a new engine if theirs tanks while making big power. Forged internals is insurance against that, you know as well as I do it gives you greater leeway to push the setup.

What are the other parts of the equation that is missing if this is the case?

Forged internals are negligible to the amount of power you make unless your static compression ratio and displacement are different than stock.

If I have two engines and the only difference between them were forged internals and everything else was the same, they should make the same power. Unless im missing something?
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that stock internals are forged already. They just aren't as strong as what the aftermarket produces.
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19typer

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compression, cubic inches, sleeves, and most will do head and cam work while its apart. We need complete details of engine to compare.
 

AlphaDigital

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I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that stock internals are forged already. They just aren't as strong as what the aftermarket produces.

You are correct. IIRC, I believe the rods are forged in these engines, I could be wrong so please dont quote me.

despite being forged, you still see that theyre prone to snap they probably just arent as strong as aftermarket I beams like Boostlines or Saenz.
 

AlphaDigital

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compression, cubic inches, sleeves, and most will do head and cam work while its apart. We need complete details of engine to compare.
You are right, we do need more details, but if everything is within stock specification and the only thing different is forged rods and pistons, then you can expect that the power Full race produces is something that can be replicated with the stock engine.

The only thing that is difference is that your potential for catastrophic bottom end failure is higher.

This was all I was trying to point out.
 

AlphaDigital

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Our high pressure line was carefully tested and sized to match our high pressure pump. If the high pressure line is not matched to the pump then the high pressure fuel control does not work correctly, for any pump. Keep that in mind when I see posts about people drilling it out to 'flow more'. There needs to be a restriction in the high pressure line for it to work correctly. It needs to be matched to the pump. Too big and you lose pressure control. Too small is probably better than too big.

Does drilling the Hondata line result in a greater pressure drop than drilling the oem line? Maybe thats why they chose to drill the oem line in comparison to the Hondata fuel line?
 


19typer

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You are right, we do need more details, but if everything is within stock specification and the only thing different is forged rods and pistons, then you can expect that the power Full race produces is something that can be replicated with the stock engine.

The only thing that is difference is that your potential for catastrophic bottom end failure is higher.

This was all I was trying to point out.

all true but we have no way of knowing that. To me, spending the money required to just change the rods and pistons to the stock equivalent doesn't make much sense. A complete upgrade would be much more beneficial, but that's just my opinion.
 

AlphaDigital

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Allegedly, both the Hondata HPFP and XDI fuel pump allow for a higher redline, in which case you would probably need new valve springs and retainers in order to do that.

Aside from that, forged rods and pistons and you should be set for some big power.

I think Luke from 4pistons makes 800+ on forged internals and stock sleeves, not sure on the headwork involved.

These engines really do not take much once youve solved the fueling issue to make good power. The K20c imo is really stout.
 

Fastrax04

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Not at all... Drilling the Hondata line would make more sense. But I'm just an engineer, what do I know ?‍♂
Ah an engineer Ok. Well let me further explain. The Hondata fuel line was flow matched to their pump, so I'd like to keep that as a set. If I modify the Hondata line, I cant easily replace that, whereas the OEM line is readily available. Uwe at XDI modified the OEM line to match the XDI pump. If I ever need to revert back to the Hondata fuel system for further testing, then I'd need their line built to their specs, not one I modified.
 
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WhiskeyTango

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Ah an engineer Ok. Well let me further explain. The Hondata fuel line was flow matched to their pump, so I'd like to keep that as a set. If I modify the Hondata line, I cant easily replace that, whereas the OEM line is readily available. Uwe at XDI modified the OEM line to match the XDI pump. If I ever need to revert back to the Hondata fuel system for further testing, then I'd need their line built to their specs, not one I modified.
I can see reverting back to stock, but I can't see any reason in the world that once you already have the XDI pump that you'd want to go back to the Hondata but its your money boss...
 

theangelofspace15

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Also just to clarify, the Hondata/XDI/Full Race FK8 hit 596/525 back on the Church Automotive Dynapack in Dec 2020 on race gas with the following mods

XDI EVO35 HPFP
Hondata HP Fuel Line
Hondata LPFP
Hondata LP Fuel Line
Hondata Injectors
Full Race G25-660 Turbo Kit
Built Longblock

As of today, its on its 3rd fuel line, which is an OEM line that was modified by XDI. It definitely flows more than the Hondata line. Car should be going back on the dyno soon with some small tweaks.
How are people modifying the fuel line? Is there a tutorial out there?
I can see reverting back to stock, but I can't see any reason in the world that once you already have the XDI pump that you'd want to go back to the Hondata but its your money boss...
well, it is a test car, you been an engineer idk what dont you understand about going back to hondata after some
Modification to test... see if the new addons yells different results with homdata and modified OEM. ITS a TEST vehicle.
 


WhiskeyTango

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How are people modifying the fuel line? Is there a tutorial out there?

well, it is a test car, you been an engineer idk what dont you understand about going back to hondata after some
Modification to test... see if the new addons yells different results with homdata and modified OEM. ITS a TEST vehicle.
Your logic is flawed. I have literally read for 21 pages how the XDI is so much better than the Hondata, flows 12% more than the Hondata, higher RPM threshold, etc. Going back to the Hondata wouldn't make sense in any realm. That's how I see it as an engineer.

And you're asking how its done. Literally guys are just drilling it out. In a very imprecise way, probably using hand drills. If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't do it. This should be done by a skilled machinist in my opinion.

Personally I'm glad I bought the Hondata kit and don't have to fuck around with any of this. I'll spend a day installing it and be done and ready to tune.
 

theangelofspace15

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Your logic is flawed. I have literally read for 21 pages how the XDI is so much better than the Hondata, flows 12% more than the Hondata, higher RPM threshold, etc. Going back to the Hondata wouldn't make sense in any realm. That's how I see it as an engineer.

And you're asking how its done. Literally guys are just drilling it out. In a very imprecise way, probably using hand drills. If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't do it. This should be done by a skilled machinist in my opinion.

Personally I'm glad I bought the Hondata kit and don't have to fuck around with any of this. I'll spend a day installing it and be done and ready to tune.
You see you contradict yourself, you ask why would they comprare back to hondata if XDI is better, cause they are people like you still buying hondata and saying they are happy, dont forget the final goal of companies. It is not to make you happy, it is to produce revenue so let me ask you again, why do you think they will comprare again to closet item in the market to theirs, the one people are choosing when not choosing theirs, and using one of the reason (it comes with more stuff) why would they show that the parts that you already have could be better. I should ask myself the same question ?.
 

theangelofspace15

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You see you contradict yourself, you ask why would they comprare back to hondata if XDI is better, cause they are people like you still buying hondata and saying they are happy, dont forget the final goal of companies. It is not to make you happy, it is to produce revenue so let me ask you again, why do you think they will comprare again to closet item in the market to theirs, the one people are choosing when not choosing theirs, and using one of the reason (it comes with more stuff) why would they show that the parts that you already have could be better. I should ask myself the same question ?.
I think thats why we have engineers and business administrators. Been good at one does not make you good at the other one. ??‍♂
 
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theangelofspace15

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You see you contradict yourself, you ask why would they comprare back to hondata if XDI is better, cause they are people like you still buying hondata and saying they are happy, dont forget the final goal of companies. It is not to make you happy, it is to produce revenue so let me ask you again, why do you think they will comprare again to closet item in the market to theirs, the one people are choosing when not choosing theirs, and using one of the reason (it comes with more stuff) why would they show that the parts that you already have could be better. I should ask myself the same question ?.
Btw that last paragraph is funny, as en engineer you rather not fk around with stuff? ?
 
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