Why is the Type-R so slow?

[heavyD]

Please clarify

Are you saying a stock BRZ/GT86 will lap a track faster than a stock CTR?

I doubt that seeing the BRZ is down over 100 hp, comes with weak brakes, and those Michelin grand touring tires that belong nowhere near a sporty car.

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[typemismatch]

I doubt that seeing the BRZ is down over 100 hp, comes with weak brakes, and those Michelin grand touring tires that belong nowhere near a sporty car.

Agreed, I just wanted to see if he'd commit himself to it.

 

[_leslietu]

I was comparing the Civic Si Coupe with BRZ/FRS because it's in the same price range, same weight class, same power level, and both 2 door that sits 4.

There's plenty of cars that fit sub 3200lb, ~300hp, and RWD. Z4M comes to mind but I am not going to use it in this comparison because I am not going to cross shop the two. Just like I am not going to cross shop a MR Lotus with a FF Civic.

Again, there is no FR, sub 3200LB, ~300hp, performance oriented 4 door hatch, and ~35k USD new. The FK8 is the king of hot hatches right now.

 

[Gansan]

What a weird argument. Just my opinion, but part of the appeal of FF performance is the engineering required to achieve that performance to overcome the front wheel drive handicap. It's part of why touring car racing with FF race cars is so great.

You shouldn't really compare mid-engined cars like the Lotus or Cayman to the CTR because now you're introducing very different weight distribution and polar moments. Too many variables.

 

[e85sbm]

Please clarify

Are you saying a stock BRZ/GT86 will lap a track faster than a stock CTR?

Yes, I would say that the FRS would lap faster than the CTR. If you look at lap time boards, you will see that the FRS is a very good car. Perfect example would be the Top Gear Test Track where the FRS lapped it at 1:31:30 on a wet track. The fastest FWD is the current generation GTI at 1:29:6 in the dry

 

[e85sbm]

I was comparing the Civic Si Coupe with BRZ/FRS because it's in the same price range, same weight class, same power level, and both 2 door that sits 4.

There's plenty of cars that fit sub 3200lb, ~300hp, and RWD. Z4M comes to mind but I am not going to use it in this comparison because I am not going to cross shop the two. Just like I am not going to cross shop a MR Lotus with a FF Civic.

Again, there is no FR, sub 3200LB, ~300hp, performance oriented 4 door hatch, and ~35k USD new. The FK8 is the king of hot hatches right now.

King of hot hatches is difficult as every manufacturer seems to be entering this arena, the Megane has been the king for years, but sadly, not offered in North America. Yet, the Focus RS is the most sought after and has been killed off after a few properly created 'special editions' with limited production runs.

Cross shopping is a hard thing as everyone has different wants or needs. If the buyer wants to spend $35k and get the sportiest car possible, he would consider a Z4, Cayman, Elise/Exige, etc

 

[CWCTR2018]

Focus RS was killed off probably because head gasket were being blown. S2k is a baddass car with either a turbo or supercharger and can keep up with the CTR around a track if the driver is good. Who wants to deal with BMW maintenance or some porche yikes.
CTR for what it is built tough with japanese engineering for 35k you cant go wrong . I mean really if you want to compare other vehicles , just get a used GTR and hope it doesnt break. It will be several years until another FWD car comes along that can beat the current gen CTR unless its a new CTR generation and if they do keep on making them , i will trade up every 6-7 years.

 

[Vortexhunter]

Yes, I would say that the FRS would lap faster than the CTR. If you look at lap time boards, you will see that the FRS is a very good car. Perfect example would be the Top Gear Test Track where the FRS lapped it at 1:31:30 on a wet track. The fastest FWD is the current generation GTI at 1:29:6 in the dry

Where did you get that info? The fastest FWD car is the FK8 with 01:25:6, they did it this season! Also, faster than several modern AWD and RWD cars, including Focus RS!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_times

 

[CWCTR2018]

Where did you get that info? The fastest FWD car is the FK8 with 01:25:6, they did it this season! Also, faster than several modern AWD and RWD cars, including Focus RS!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_times

Stig did this in comfort mode

 

[David Harper]

can someone tell me how tall are the gears on the CTR? The big complaint with the regular mt civic is the short gearing. 2400 rpm at 60 mph. So if you're going 60 in your CTR, what rpm's are you at?

 

[typemismatch]

Stig did this in comfort mode

 

[Night Fury]

can someone tell me how tall are the gears on the CTR? The big complaint with the regular mt civic is the short gearing. 2400 rpm at 60 mph. So if you're going 60 in your CTR, what rpm's are you at?

https://www.civicx.com/threads/gear-speeds-recommended-shift-points.25398/

 

[typemismatch]

Where did you get that info? The fastest FWD car is the FK8 with 01:25:6, they did it this season! Also, faster than several modern AWD and RWD cars, including Focus RS!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_times

I noticed the Stig let the ass step out a couple times, not a common trick for a FWD car.

 

[e85sbm]

Must have missed it as it was not posted on Top Gear website's power lap board.
However, everyone has their own opinion and I would go for a European car for performance and handling any day. I would go with an e46 M3 and save thousands over the price of a CTR. With that cash I can buy a winter beater and a few trips to iconic tracks like Spa, Nurburgring, Silverstone and Laguna Seca.

Maintenance is not as bad as everyone claims on German cars, the CTR will also end up being expensive long term as it has many bespoke parts

 

[TypeRinATL]

I noticed the Stig let the ass step out a couple times, not a common trick for a FWD car.

Actually with stability off the rear end likes to slide on this car. Not hard to get it to slide at all, and it’s very compliant.

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