What happens when it’s time to smog in CA... or anywhere?

[GraphiteAZ]

Does this work? How would you access the PO Box in another state? Friends or relatives?

Mail forwarding. It's why so many people have PO boxes in Montana. Lower registration costs and no smog.

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[tinyman392]

Mail forwarding. It's why so many people have PO boxes in Montana. Lower registration costs and no smog.

Steve Lehto did a video about this actually (specifically Montana). Granted in his video he talks about creating an LLC in Montana to register a car (no registration, fees, or smog in Montana). But there is the entire thing going on with the fact that you're technically scamming the state you are in from registration/tax fees. This might fall under tax evasion in your state/county. I know in 2018 Georgia made a statement that they'd start cracking down on this. Note that this portion applies whether or not you registered on your own (as an individual) or using a created LLC.

Another problem arises if you make an insurance claim. They may look and see it's registered in Montana and question why a policy holder in [insert state here] has a Montana car on their account registered to a different address. Steve also pushes that fraud is listed as a reason to deny claims on most insurance policies (go back up to the registration/tax fee fraud which would apply). He also made a claim that if you went the LLC route, the insurance company could simply deny the claim because you don't own the car, the LLC does. But this obviously doesn't apply if you don't go the LLC route (the previous denial reason could though). Other policies may require the vehicle to be legally on the road. They could claim that by registering in a different state to circumvent smog, then that vehicle isn't legally on the road as you're trying to circumvent the law.

If you plan to go this route, make sure to ask your insurance company that it's OK to do and get it in writing. You can read more odd things here regarding multi-state car insurance since it is a thing. At the end of the day though, if you're doing something shady, the insurance company will feel like fraud is involved and not want to do business with you.

That said, I won't stop anyone from going this route. But I'd advise people who do to tread carefully and understand exactly what you may end up getting yourself into.

 

[DRUSA]

Not all areas of CA require bi-annual smog testing, some areas only require a smog test done upon initial registration. This does not mean the car is smog exempt, it just means you only test the car once in it's lifetime, you are still on the hook for referee tickets etc if you get pulled over.

UPS store PO Boxes are physical addresses, I know people who have their driver's license forwarded to a UPS store. The Montana LLC and South?North? Dakota one is a route also, big with people doing tax evasion on motorhomes and high end cars.

IMO, f*ck em. This country was founded on tax evasion.

 

[DRUSA]

 

[DRUSA]

Woops. Dropped this map of where someone could register a car without bi-annual smog testing.

 

[fatherpain]

I’m in the Orange enhanced zone... does that mean I’m screwed?

Woops. Dropped this map of where someone could register a car without bi-annual smog testing.

 

[DRUSA]

I’m in the Orange enhanced zone... does that mean I’m screwed?

Yes. I will light a little Guadalupe candle for you every 2 years when it comes registration time and we all pray we don't read "STAR required".

Time for a PO box in the white areas of the map.

 

[spyder57]

Does this work? How would you access the PO Box in another state? Friends or relatives?

Wuuo

Yes. I will light a little Guadalupe candle for you every 2 years when it comes registration time and we all pray we don't read "STAR required".

Time for a PO box in the white areas of the map.

Yeah except if you get into an accident, your insurance company can easily use this as an excuse to deny claims and cancel your insurance.

 

[DRUSA]

Yeah except if you get into an accident, your insurance company can easily use this as an excuse to deny claims and cancel your insurance.

Because you have a PO box an hour away from where you live? Heaven forbid someone has multiple residences in the same area they live in. Nothing says you can't live in a tent in the boonies and have a PO box in town. Insurance companies will try to slip out of any claim if they can regardless. All of these smog sneaks come with their own inherent risks.

I feel like more effort would be put into this if you wrecked a Lambo or a 400k motorhome. I was surprised my insurance was as low as it was for a CTR, I was expecting the Integra LS vs Type R gap of the past. It's just another 5 door civic in the system to them when I inquired if the pricing was correct with my VIN.

 

[spyder57]

Because you have a PO box an hour away from where you live? Heaven forbid someone has multiple residences in the same area they live in. Nothing says you can't live in a tent in the boonies and have a PO box in town. Insurance companies will try to slip out of any claim if they can regardless. All of these smog sneaks come with their own inherent risks.

I feel like more effort would be put into this if you wrecked a Lambo or a 400k motorhome. I was surprised my insurance was as low as it was for a CTR, I was expecting the Integra LS vs Type R gap of the past. It's just another 5 door civic in the system to them when I inquired if the pricing was correct with my VIN.

Yes, absolutely. Do you think insurance companies are idiots? If were an insurance company and you noticed that your customer registered their car to a PO address that's different from where they live, that wouldn't raise red flags? That's not them slipping out of a random claim, that's just due diligence to avoid insurance fraud.

 

[GraphiteAZ]

Yes, absolutely. Do you think insurance companies are idiots? If were an insurance company and you noticed that your customer registered their car to a PO address that's different from where they live, that wouldn't raise red flags? That's not them slipping out of a random claim, that's just due diligence to avoid insurance fraud.

PO boxes exist for a reason - not everyone can receive mail at their home. Insurance companies understand this. This is a $30K civic - not a $500K exotic.

I have a PO box because at my old place in college packages would get stolen from my porch. I opened a PO box and got all my mail and packages delivered there. This ensured my packages are kept safe. My ID had my PO box, all my bills had my PO box, and....DING DING my car insurance did as well.

 

[ez12a]

There are some shops out there in CA that will help. I've heard you will need a passing donor type r though.

The out of state registration idea is iffy if you have snitching neighbors: https://www.chp.ca.gov/PressReleases/Pages/CHP-REVAMPS-REGISTRATION-VIOLATORS-PROGRAM.aspx

 

[MadMage]

PO boxes exist for a reason - not everyone can receive mail at their home. Insurance companies understand this. This is a $30K civic - not a $500K exotic.

I have a PO box because at my old place in college packages would get stolen from my porch. I opened a PO box and got all my mail and packages delivered there. This ensured my packages are kept safe. My ID had my PO box, all my bills had my PO box, and....DING DING my car insurance did as well.

What I don't think you're considering is the address of both your house and your PO Box. It's easy for an insurance company to map the two addresses and see if they are near each other, or 200 miles away. I have no idea if the insurance company cares if your house address is Tucson, AZ and your PO Box address is Globe, AZ, but it seems like it might be something they notice.

 

[BlueFalcon]

What I don't think you're considering is the address of both your house and your PO Box. It's easy for an insurance company to map the two addresses and see if they are near each other, or 200 miles away. I have no idea if the insurance company cares if your house address is Tucson, AZ and your PO Box address is Globe, AZ, but it seems like it might be something they notice.

It matters because an insurance company will adjust rates dependent on risk- that calculation seems to weigh heavily on the risk associated with where you reside, your regular daily travels and the exposure associated with those factors.

If you live and commute to work in LA, then your property is at a significantly higher risk given that exposure, versus someone out in the country who is retired and never drives. Oppositely, an address and a short drive to work at a local company in Montana is likely at significantly less exposure.

I believe local crime rates, incident reports, etc. all play a part in rate, in addition to the risk of the actual driver on record given age, driving history, etc. I've always been told that it's fraudulent to claim an address in the suburbs, if you live in the city, in order to pay a significantly reduced rate. You're effectively defrauding the insurance company, because you aren't appropriately paying for a policy that encompasses the risk the insurance company is taking on your policy. This is grounds for denial of benefit, the way I understand it.

 

[ayeitsmikko]

Intercooler does not need to be stock, that is a free mod. Refer to Smog Manual Appendix C. Gasoline powered vehicle DO NOT need a CARB EO number for intercooler changes, diesel vehicle DO need a EO number. Water injection as well, DOES NOT require a CARB EO number, not to be confused with ethanol injection kits. Catch cans are also completely legal, but ONLY if they are a completely sealed system or a system that drains back to the oil pan. They cannot have a breather filter on the top of the tank, no emissions gases should be able to vent to atmosphere. Air filters can be aftermarket, JUST THE FILTER, any "intake kit" needs a EO number. CARB legal intakes do not need to have the sticker present, so if a smog tech tells you that your legal intake fails because he doesn't see a sticker, that's bullshit. It is up to the smog technician to verify EO status, not the customer, but he can fail the intake if he cannot verify it's legal. So he must attempt to do the research.

https://www.bar.ca.gov/pdf/2017_Smog_Check_Manual.pdf
See page 49

You sir, are a God. Thank you for providing us with useful information. Really appreciate your input and knowledge.

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