Well, I'm knocking.

VitViper

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(someone broke at 21psi with ktuner)
Everything in that thread relates the incident to a lubrication issue and bearing failure. I would kindly ask you stop posting hearsay as pure fact as there has been no validation of any failures on any of the included basemaps.



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gtman

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I'm no expert but I have an observation. Clearly, with the wrong settings, in the wrong hands, under the right circumstances, ECU tuning can potentially cause problems.

I'm not talking about the base tunes, they seem safe.

I know the companies put up disclaimers about the risks but I wonder if there should be some limits in the software as to how aggressively the consumer can adjust them on their own. Maybe just open up the more aggressive stuff only for pro tuners?

Just a thought.
 

d1zguy

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I'm no expert but I have an observation. Clearly, with the wrong settings, in the wrong hands, under the right circumstances, ECU tuning can potentially cause problems.

I'm not talking about the base tunes, they seem safe.

I know the companies put up disclaimers about the risks but I wonder if there should be some limits in the software as to how aggressively the consumer can adjust them on their own. Maybe just open up the more aggressive stuff only for pro tuners?

Just a thought.
Or you can leave the tuning to people who know what they are doing or go through the proper channels of education to do so. I.e https://www.hpacademy.com/ for example and if they break it it's on them
 

charleswrivers

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21# at least for the Si's 20.3# spec (I know, I know.. it runs a little lower) being a 'engine blowing level of boost' would mean the engine has essentially zero safety factor built into it. It's simply not the case. Whether it's a bad tune or bad luck for a one in ten thousand flaw, user abuse... or other randomness, I'm still 100% comfortable w/running my gentle 19.5/21 basemap.

When I was on the 9th forums, folks with that big, certainly not-overpowered N/A port injection engine would make blown motor posts from time to time. With 5 years of history, I bet there's worlds of blown motor posts by now. I don't think anyone would call a K24 unreliable.

Honda wouldn't stake their reputation on a dud engine they're putting in the CRV, Civic and Accord...

I know I've only been here a few months since I got my Si but this past week or so it's been like the world is ending around here.
 

CIVICSPORT

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Or you can leave the tuning to people who know what they are doing or go through the proper channels of education to do so. I.e https://www.hpacademy.com/ for example and if they break it it's on them
Exactly, it doesnt have to be a turbo engine or a civic for someone to mess with tune settings they dont understand and crater their engines.

Leave it to the pro's.
 

KTuner

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I know the companies put up disclaimers about the risks but I wonder if there should be some limits in the software as to how aggressively the consumer can adjust them on their own.
We tried that initially. It got called ridiculous and we had several customers contact us to complain about it once it was brought up in discussion. Full control was then given for the purpose of proper tuning for those who wanted to take it further.

https://www.civicx.com/threads/ktuner-end-user-boost-target-limitation.11344/
 

gtman

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We tried that initially. It got called ridiculous and we had several customers contact us to complain about it once it was brought up in discussion. Full control was then given for the purpose of proper tuning for those who wanted to take it further.

https://www.civicx.com/threads/ktuner-end-user-boost-target-limitation.11344/
I think the issue is this. You have some people buying tuning software to take it to the ultimate and apparently don't care if they potentially blow their engine or fuck their clutch or CVT. More power to 'em (bad pun sorry). Others, like me, just want a bit more power and a more capable and fun daily driver. I know you're trying to please both groups.

I'm still probably getting a Ktuner and just run Stage 1 with a few quick adjustments. It won't be fast but it should run a lot better than stock, right?
 

charleswrivers

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KTuner

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I think the issue is this. You have some people buying tuning software to take it to the ultimate and apparently don't care if they potentially blow their engine or fuck their clutch or CVT. More power to 'em (bad pun sorry). Others, like me, just want a bit more power and a more capable and fun daily driver. I know you're trying to please both groups.

I'm still probably getting a Ktuner and just run Stage 1 with a few quick adjustments. It won't be fast but it should run a lot better than stock, right?
Leaps and bounds better from power and drivability standpoint. Absolutely.

Thank you for giving us the choice as to whether or not we can blow ourselves up.
No problem. By the sheer amount of people with tuning software on both platforms and the very few incidents we're discussing here currently it would seem most are choosing not to, which is a great choice. :)
 

davemarco

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I know PRL have mentioned working on internals for these motors, I just don't know when it's going to happen but quite a while back I contacted maybe 5 or 6 companies and only a couple got back to me and only one actually made the offer but I would need to send in 2 samples and a 50% deposit on 40 sets, $326 per set from Scat. Obviously I am in no place to do so, but seeing as the SI piston/rod combo could be the only currently available upgrade at right around 300 bucks shipped (I think that's what it was last time I checked) 326 for a nice set of heavy duty rods isn't too bad of a deal if that's all you could get. I've personally never run a scat product and know they don't buy from eagle any more so have no idea of the quality...

I'm thinking about buying a SI and a base rod just so I can have both in my hands to compare. what's stopping me is I end up with 125 bucks worth of paper weights when it's all said and done.
If you're still toying with the idea, I think that you should do a GoFundMe campaign just for this. I'm sure that many SI owners here would donate $5-$10 to help subsidize the cost of buying the rods for comparison.
 

charleswrivers

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If you're still toying with the idea, I think that you should do a GoFundMe campaign just for this. I'm sure that many SI owners here would donate $5-$10 to help subsidize the cost of buying the rods for comparison.
That's a great idea. I'd throw in on it .
 

Acraig3

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I'm no expert but I have an observation. Clearly, with the wrong settings, in the wrong hands, under the right circumstances, ECU tuning can potentially cause problems.

I'm not talking about the base tunes, they seem safe.

I know the companies put up disclaimers about the risks but I wonder if there should be some limits in the software as to how aggressively the consumer can adjust them on their own. Maybe just open up the more aggressive stuff only for pro tuners?

Just a thought.
What's nice about these base tunes like the ktuner maps are very close to stock, just boost parameters are changed as well as spool time and throttle response. So knock sensor data, fuel corrections ect are very close to, if not, stock. I'd say most of these "oopsies" are due to the wrong parameters changed.

We have to remember what Honda's are known for and what the old threads looked like... Best thing I've ever seen was a guy on an old civic thread said something along the lines of... To fill the oil properly put oil in the fill cap until you begin to see it come out of the fill cap. It's not the cars faults or the tuners, its very much user error.

This is one of the first civics in a while to prove to be stout, interesting little cars. It's interesting to see what kind of power people are making on these threads, but there are always going to be "those guys" who don't know what they are doing, don't change oil, and dont understand basic mechanics.

I've always been a Honda guy, I love small motors with high horsepower, and here we have a perfect example of a small engine making high amounts of torque. They are an amazing engineering company .
 

charleswrivers

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here we have a perfect example of a small engine making high amounts of torque
Very true. With some mods... this itty bitty 1.5 liter is doing basically what a LS1 was doing 20 years ago. At just over 1/4 the displacement... it's amazing what 20 years can do. I know, the big V8s got more torque down at the very bottom... but give the little guy a break! I never thought I'd ever own a car w/under 2Ls.

Just for fun (because thats all it is) Vits turbo sneak peak on ethanol vs a fresh '02 SS with an LS1

pump_vs_e40.png


9026-2002-Chevrolet-Camaro-Dyno.jpg
 

Acraig3

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Very true. With some mods... this itty bitty 1.5 liter is doing basically what a LS1 was doing 20 years ago. At just over 1/4 the displacement... it's amazing what 20 years can do. I know, the big V8s got more torque down at the very bottom... but give the little guy a break! I never thought I'd ever own a car w/under 2Ls.

Just for fun (because thats all it is) Vits turbo sneak peak on ethanol vs a fresh '02 SS with an LS1

pump_vs_e40.png


9026-2002-Chevrolet-Camaro-Dyno.jpg
I've been looking at ways to get that upper end horsepower. The only thing that's a bummer about this motor is the top end horsepower. Looks like that's the answer
 

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I've been looking at ways to get that upper end horsepower. The only thing that's a bummer about this motor is the top end horsepower. Looks like that's the answer
Bigger turbo
 

                           
































































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