Type R Remote Start Install issue

JW0914

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Brands are preference.
It's more than that... CompuStar Alarm and Remote Start brains (7000AS/CM7000) are more akin to Arduinos and can control anything in the vehicle that's controlled via analog voltage via PICs and POCs (e.g. rolling up and down windows with the remote, activating LED lighting with the remote, etc. - anything controlled by analog voltage in the car can be controlled from the remote.

I personally went with viper because the DC3 didn't appear to have firmware at the time of install... I personally prefer the DC3 over the DS4. Whether FirsTech has triumphed over directed is irrelevant. They both work, they are both Stand up products backed by good companies.
The DC series are low-tier brains that do not carry the same features as the CM7000 - they're two completely different products and are the only series allowed to be carried by big-box stores, such as Best Buy.

...the Pro series remote I wanted was on backorder from my distributor. Viper was readily available.
Remotes are personal preference, however CompuStar's are more technologically advanced than Viper's and any other brand that I'm aware of (anyone can compare the two to fact check)

I'm not sure what you were here to accomplish. If it's the credit you want for your succession prior to mine, you can have it.
All I was doing was offering the knowledge regarding what extra needs to be done on the FK8 since most installers don't have a clue, and neither did FirsTech for months - the CPSS circuit was found by an installer and shared on the FirsTech Feed on Facebook (which is also now apart of the info for the 10th gen Civic on FirsTech Data), however it's still not common knowledge, as detailed by one of the users above in their experience with a CompuStar dealer.
  • I believe in the free flow of information, which is why I maintain an FK8 section in my GitHub repo with information pulled directly from Honda's TechInfo SIS subscription - I encourage you to check it out, as it has a wealth of information, much of it the same information dealer's user
I have come across many who are and can't trace a draw or broken wire. Schematics look like Chinese writing.
A child can trace a broken wire with a multimeter by testing continuity, all someone needs is someone to show them the basics of the features on a multimeter - you turn the dial to continuity, touch the black lead's tip to one end of the circuit, the red lead to the other, and if it doesn't beep, there's a break in the circuit.

As to schematics, I wouldn't describe them as Chinese writing, however I get the point you're making; here again, someone just needs to be walked through the basics:
  • each circuit's wire is a colored line the same color of the wire and it goes from point A to point B
    • At Point A and B there will be a letter and/or number next to the line, with the letter being the connector's letter and the number being the pin number in the connector for that specific wire
  • the electrical symbols are harder to comprehend, but there are cheat sheets that can be found on google.

While you posted information that could help not everyone is knowledgeable or brave enough to attempt this and they will go to a shop.
I give folks more credit than that, as folks aren't dumb or idiots and if they want to do it on their own, they likely don't have an issue taking an hour to research the basics, as the most complex part of the install in the FK8 is the extremely limited amount of room to work with under, and through, the dash

Unfortunately, not all shops will have success with this as we have seen so with that in mind I was confirming to others that I have had success with my own personal car and I am willing to offer the service for those who may be seeking it.
Yeah, there's no excuse for that other than laziness, as all dealers have the tech line for FirsTech and the Facebook feed that Wade and other FirstTech techs do reply back on relatively quickly
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OverRev

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Are you a DEI dealer?

There's only one thing on the CTR that's different than a non-CTR install, which is the CPSS wire must be broken during crank (it requires three wires to be cut, not two: starter [UH FB Relay Bank A2], ignition [BCM F2], and CPSS [firewall bundle exiting driver's side])

JW0914, thanks a lot for the very detailed wiring diagram and note provided for FK8. I guess Blazindominican didn't cut for starter wire for external starter kill so only 2 wires to be cut in his install. I have been installing Compustar system since 2004 around the time they introduced their first pager. Tech has gone a long way since then and it's hard to find good installer that could actually think outta the box instead of just following wiring diagram. Let's keep this post alive and positive for the community.
 

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Installed a CompuStar CM7000 on my FK8 today. Few things worths mentioning are:

1. the CPSS plug can be accessed quite easier, with the lower steering cover removed but extremely difficult to make a solder connection at that tight spot.

2. It’s surely a lot easier make wire connections with the BCM dropped or unplugged. There is a accelerometer integrated to the BCM on all the new Honda so the car won’t start if the BCM is not at correct orientation. (For emergency shut down in case the car’s flipped)

3. there will be a few error messages displayed on the dash after remote start but won’t log any permanent error in the system. Once you restart the car during the take-over the BCM will clear it. Tried to played around for a little but couldn’t get rid of them.

4. It’s possible to have the car starter setup up as automatic to eliminate the need of reservation mode, although not recommended for safety reason.

Honda Civic 10th gen Type R Remote Start Install issue 1712D777-4BA8-4FA9-9A90-05321CC64630








Honda Civic 10th gen Type R Remote Start Install issue 3C5F73C4-7FB2-4FAC-BB6F-441591AC19D7
 
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JW0914

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Installed a CompuStar CM7000 on my FK8 today. Few things worths mentioning are:

1. the CPSS plug can be accessed quite easier, with the lower steering cover removed but extremely difficult to make a solder connection at that tight spot.
There's no way to efficiently make a connection near the plug, which is why it's recommended to grab the wire in the main firewall bundle.

3. there will be a few error messages displayed on the dash after remote start but won’t log any permanent error in the system. Once you restart the car during the take-over the BCM will clear it. Tried to played around for a little but couldn’t get rid of them.
The errors exist for two reasons - Keyfob isn't in the vehicle and bypassing VSA, however take-over is not possible, regardless of configuration, and no one should try to get around that unless they'd like their car stolen.
  • Upon opening a door and the engine shutting off, you'll want to wait until the BCM goes to sleep (~10s) before starting (once the Type R logo on the dash turns off), else you will end up with communication issues and DTCs.
4. It’s possible to have the car starter setup up as automatic to eliminate the need of reservation mode, although not recommended for safety reason.
Please don't even broach the topic of bypassing Reservation Mode, as it's the only safety measure that exists to prevent a manual transmission vehicle from starting in gear while remote starting.
  • General FYI: CompuStar changed the CM7000 so that once the loop wire is cut, it's permanently configured for an Automatic even if the wire is re-soldered or firmware flashed.
 
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The clutch wire is required, if they did not wire it in the starter never had a chance. Look up the instructions for a Fortin remote start sytem for a 2016+ 6MT Civic. Your answer will very likely be found there, assuming the wire for the R is the same as the rest of 10th gens.
It’s not the same for the other civics. That wire has to have a certain frequency to match the rev match thresholds on startup. My installer had to put a relay in with help from a Honda tech giving the frequency or ohms specified for the relay.

mobile systems solutions in st charle Il.
Knows exactly what he’s doing.
 
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JW0914

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It’s not the same for the other civics. That wire has to have a certain frequency to match the rev match thresholds on startup. My installer had to put a relay in with help from a Honda tech giving the frequency or ohms specified for the relay.

mobile systems solutions in st charle Il.
Knows exactly what he’s doing.
Rev match has zero to do with starting and everything to do with switching gears to bring the transmission up to the crankshaft RPM (without it, you'd have to blip the throttle via heel-toe shifting)
  • As mentioned several times, there are two clutch wires, one is for the clutch to allow emulation of the clutch being depressed and the other is for VSA, which must be broken during crank via a relay (instructions on pg 4)
 

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Rev match has zero to do with starting and everything to do with switching gears to bring the transmission up to the crankshaft RPM (without it, you'd have to blip the throttle via heel-toe shifting)
  • As mentioned several times, there are two clutch wires, one is for the clutch to allow emulation of the clutch being depressed and the other is for VSA, which must be broken during crank via a relay (instructions on pg 4)
Alright well hook it up wrong and I guarantee using rev match will trip the codes.

The emulation of the clutch is tied into a certain range. The Honda tech that worked with the installer is the one that brought it up.

I installed it and the relay went bad and it started tripping codes whenever I used rev match.

Rev match is tied into those bands on the clutch.
 

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Alright well hook it up wrong and I guarantee using rev match will trip the codes.

The emulation of the clutch is tied into a certain range. The Honda tech that worked with the installer is the one that brought it up.

I installed it and the relay went bad and it started tripping codes whenever I used rev match.

Rev match is tied into those bands on the clutch.
The DTCs and CELs result from the VSA MCU [Modulator Control Unit] (right-click on SVG and open in new browser window) when the CPSS [Clutch Pedal Stroke Sensor] circuit is not broken during crank (when you depress the clutch pedal it breaks the CPSS circuit and is why this needs to be broken with a relay when remote starting), which is what the CPSS circuit goes to (as explained on page 4 in the install guide I created and previously linked to).
  • When the CPSS is not broken during crank, the PCM and BCM detect the vehicle has started without clutch depression and is why numerous DTCs and CELs are registered until the vehicle is turned off, allowed to enter its sleep state (~10s), and restarted, since a manual transmission vehicle isn't supposed to normally start without clutch depression for safety (else the vehicle can start in gear and is the same reason why Reservation Mode is required for remote starts on manual transmission vehicles)
  • This is also why once remote started, the BCM must be allowed to enter its sleep state (~10s) when turning it off before starting since takeover is not supported (once the Type R logo fully disappears, the vehicle can be started - do so beforehand and you'll receive DTCs and CELs from the VSA MCU)
 
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The DTCs and CELs result from the VSA MCU [Modulator Control Unit] (right-click on SVG and open in new browser window) when the CPSS [Clutch Pedal Stroke Sensor] circuit is not broken during crank (when you depress the clutch pedal it breaks the CPSS circuit and is why this needs to be broken with a relay when remote starting), which is what the CPSS circuit goes to (as explained on page 4 in the install guide I created and previously linked to).
  • When the CPSS is not broken during crank, the PCM and BCM detect the vehicle has started without clutch depression and is why numerous DTCs and CELs are registered until the vehicle is turned off, allowed to enter its sleep state (~10s), and restarted, since a manual transmission vehicle isn't supposed to normally start without clutch depression for safety (else the vehicle can start in gear and is the same reason why Reservation Mode is required for remote starts on manual transmission vehicles)
  • This is also why once remote started, the BCM must be allowed to enter its sleep state (~5s) when turning it off before starting since takeover is not supported (once the Type R logo fully disappears, the vehicle can be started - do so beforehand and you'll receive DTCs and CELs from the VSA MCU)
That’s like what I said with a lot of extra words lol. Mine works fine and has but it might help someone else.
Might be simpler to paraphrase though.
 

JW0914

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That’s like what I said with a lot of extra words... Might be simpler to paraphrase though.
Your comments contained factual inaccuracies regarding rev match and other things, so my replies were not what you said and were descriptive to explain what exactly goes on and why DTCs and CELs are thrown due to the CPSS circuit if it's not broken during crank when remote starting.
 


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Your comments contained factual inaccuracies regarding rev match and other things, so my replies were not what you said and were descriptive to explain what exactly goes on and why DTCs and CELs are thrown due to the CPSS circuit if it's not broken during crank when remote starting.
final note hook it up wrong and rev match won’t work correctly. Full stop. So it’s connected whether if it’s in your description or not if you hook it up wrong.
 

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final note hook it up wrong and rev match won’t work correctly. Full stop. So it’s connected whether if it’s in your description or not if you hook it up wrong.
I'm unsure why you keep going on about this - you cannot "hook it up wrong", the CPSS circuit simply needs to be broken during crank, else Remote Start will not work correctly, so how exactly do you "hook it up wrong", as it's either wired to a negative start output/relay or not touched? (e.g. the main difference is the FK8 CTR has two clutch wires instead of the normal one)

Rev match has nothing to do with any of this (you'd see that if you pulled the actual DTCs, instead of referencing a generic CEL message), and it will always work, with or without the CPSS circuit being broken, since 10th gen Civics do not support takeover (the ability to get in the vehicle and drive off without shutting it off first), so the engine shuts off as soon as a door is opened once remote started. As previously mentioned, the BCM must be allowed to enter sleep mode once the engine shuts off prior to restarting, else the DTCs and CELs will still be registered.

It would be extremely helpful if you took the time to research what you're talking about before shooting from the hip - I provide significant tech information on the FK8 CTR on my GitHub (previously linked to) and anyone can get the exact same information via the SIS subscription on TechInfo.Honda.com
 
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I'm unsure why you keep going on about this - you cannot "hook it up wrong", the CPSS circuit simply needs to be broken during crank, else Remote Start will not work correctly, so how exactly do you "hook it up wrong", as it's either wired with a relay or not touched? (e.g. the main difference is the FK8 CTR has two clutch wires instead of the normal one)

Rev match has nothing to do with any of this (you'd see that if you pulled the actual DTCs, instead of referencing a generic CEL message), and it will always work, with or without the CPSS circuit being broken, since 10th gen Civics do not support takeover (the ability to get in the vehicle and drive off without shutting it off first), so the engine shuts off as soon as a door is opened once remote started. As previously mentioned, the BCM must be allowed to enter sleep mode once the engine shuts off prior to restarting, else the DTCs and CELs will still be registered.

It would be extremely helpful if you took the time to research what you're talking about before shooting from the hip - I provide significant tech information on the FK8 CTR on my GitHub (previously linked to) and anyone can get the exact same information via the SIS subscription on TechInfo.Honda.com
I just wanted to chime in here to say that the Fortin kit, with their plug and play kit, allows full takeover even with the manual transmission. I could remote start, enter vehicle, press ignition, foot on brake and then off I could go. I had this on my Si and will be installing this into the CTR shortly.
 

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I just wanted to chime in here to say that the Fortin kit, with their plug and play kit, allows full takeover even with the manual transmission. I could remote start, enter vehicle, press ignition, foot on brake and then off I could go. I had this on my Si and will be installing this into the CTR shortly.
I wasn't aware Fortin offered takeover, thanks! =]
 

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What's different in the Type R is the CPSS [Clutch Pedal Stroke Sensor (VSA Modulator Control Unit)] #3 pin (YEL: CSS_SIG2) must be broken during crank with a relay, in addition to the CPPS [Clutch Pedal Position Sensor] #4 pin (YEL - located at BCM Connector C #26).
I’m about to install the Fortin unit on my R, that I had previously on my Si. Is it possible to just tap that CPSS with the Fortin GWR or similar instead of doing the relay? To me it makes sense I could but I’m not an electrician. If not, could you tell me the pins on the relay and what wire would need to go where?

Also, when this is all said and done, does the remote start still throw all the warning lights? I never had this issue on the 2020 Si, but I know the R is different with that CPSS.

And thanks for all your detailed info on GitHub, it’s amazing and I’ve bookmarked it.
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