Tsp misfire Knock.

Craigfc1

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Just got the tsp tune,
Started to say it misfired, my gas type is 94 from petro,
Shows misfire in cyl 1.3.4
Knock count of 12 for a 8min drive
and knck ctrl is .89

just tuned**
does it take time to adapt?
Just want some insight and some clarification so I don’t freak out lol

thank you all! ??
Ps bone stock **
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LilToTo17

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Just got the tsp tune,
Started to say it misfired, my gas type is 94 from petro,
Shows misfire in cyl 1.3.4
Knock count of 12 for a 8min drive
and knck ctrl is .89

just tuned**
does it take time to adapt?
Just want some insight and some clarification so I don’t freak out lol

thank you all! ??
Ps bone stock **
misfire in the cylinders shown are normal. Your knock control is a tad bit high. Does your 94 and any E in it or is it ethanol free since you know Canada.
 
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Craigfc1

Craigfc1

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misfire in the cylinders shown are normal. Your knock control is a tad bit high. Does your 94 and any E in it or is it ethanol free since you know Canada.
what I’ve been reading is the “ecu” needs to adapt to the tune, ie. give it a nice drive. And about the 94, that’s a good question, I think it says “contains up to 10% ethanol” lol
 
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Gotch

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Petro Canada Ultra 94 is 10% Ethanol.

And, yes, you need to give the ecu some time to adapt. After a flash, I wait until K.Cont is down to 0.49 before beating on it. If you want to speed the process up, find some slight inclines where you can run between 0 and 1 psi boost (not running in vacuum, negative psi).
 

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misfire in the cylinders shown are normal. Your knock control is a tad bit high. Does your 94 and any E in it or is it ethanol free since you know Canada.
Hey man! I'm queries what do you mean that misfire is normal? I'm getting occasional misfires which bugging me out!
So maybe you can explain it to me, please?
 


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Hey man! I'm queries what do you mean that misfire is normal? I'm getting occasional misfires which bugging me out!
So maybe you can explain it to me, please?
You aren’t having real misfire is your knock control is within .49-.90 depending on your fuel used.
Also if your knock count isn’t climbing by the hundreds then you aren’t misfiring.
 

LilToTo17

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Hey man! I'm queries what do you mean that misfire is normal? I'm getting occasional misfires which bugging me out!
So maybe you can explain it to me, please?
Also if you were misifiring you’d throw a code
 

LilToTo17

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Hey man! I'm queries what do you mean that misfire is normal? I'm getting occasional misfires which bugging me out!
So maybe you can explain it to me, please?
Here’s an answer by the tuner who made the tsp stage tunes as well as the most known and respected 10th gen tuner
Honda Civic 10th gen Tsp misfire Knock. 3FE6086E-5793-499E-A262-258EB833739E
 
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DmK

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Also if you were misifiring you’d throw a code
You aren’t having real misfire is your knock control is within .49-.90 depending on your fuel used.
Also if your knock count isn’t climbing by the hundreds then you aren’t misfiring.
Do you know why it's showing Misfire Cyl 1,2,3,4 in Ktuner?
Thanks for your response! I know that as long as a Knock control 0.49 you should be fine,
but I'm still confused about how Knock Retard works and Misfires indications.
 

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Here’s an answer by the tuner who made the tsp stage tunes as well as the most known and respected 10th gen tuner
3FE6086E-5793-499E-A262-258EB833739E.png
This just explains why Knock count (which is supposed to react only on Knock in cylinders) also showing misfires in Honda logic. But doesn't say that misfires are normal events from the begging, or maybe I'm understanding it wrong?
 


LilToTo17

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This just explains why Knock count (which is supposed to react only on Knock in cylinders) also showing misfires in Honda logic. But doesn't say that misfires are normal events from the begging, or maybe I'm understanding it wrong?
If your not throwing a misfire code then you ain't misfiring simple as that.
 

LilToTo17

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Do you know why it's showing Misfire Cyl 1,2,3,4 in Ktuner?
Thanks for your response! I know that as long as a Knock control 0.49 you should be fine,
but I'm still confused about how Knock Retard works and Misfires indications.
The knock control can be anywhere between .49-.9 as that's the ecu doing it's job adjusting to whatever quality of fuel used. I am normally around .49-.65 on 91 Cali pump gas with all my bolt ons and tuned by DRob too. I am not misfiring even if it shows on the side piece.

Here's what DRob said too, "
"Knock Count" = This parameter is a reflection of the ECU's misfire monitor. It is NOT an accurate reflection of anything other than misfire events. When will you see these normally? Startup, rapid throttle closures, rapid throttle inputs, rapid release of the clutch pedal, and sometimes at idle (especially if you have a lighter flywheel/clutch combo, and/or plugs that have been gapped down to prevent spark blowout at high load). A completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts. In my experience with these engines, you will see more activity on cylinder four compared to others, as the crank position sensor is physically located closest to there on the block. This usually isn't a concern area unless you see a steep count in a very, very short time (like 50+ in a few seconds), which will likely trip a P0300-variant DTC code.

"Knock Control" = This parameter is the ECU's determination of fuel quality. Movement here indicates the knock sensor hears what it thinks is knock activity, and reports to the ECU to apply a steeper ignition retard to avoid continued knock activity. This value is dynamic, and WILL move from time to time. On Civic Si models, there doesn't seem to be a forced rise at play at WOT like the non-Si 1.5T ECU's (which naturally rise above 5,200-5,400rpm regardless of sensor input). Movement that goes up and up and up and never comes down is more concerning than movement alone. Knock control can typically be manipulated down by driving the car in a higher gear at lower engine speeds and targeting atmospheric pressure on the MAP sensor reading.

Also here's what Ktuner said, "If the count is not zero then one of the cylinders will show as "misfired". Knock count is not as useful on this platform as it was on previous generations. "
 
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gtman

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Lil is right on the money. When you see those "misfires" in the KTuner logs, it's about as valuable as seeing the knock counts. I'm not sure why Honda set it up like that but these misfire "events" aren't reflective of your engine truly misfiring.

Like DRob says, "a completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts".

Concentrate on Knock Control instead. The lower, the better (less timing retard). And remember it will rise from time to time and that's normal as long as it drops back down to the lower numbers.
 
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DmK

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The knock control can be anywhere between .49-.9 as that's the ecu doing it's job adjusting to whatever quality of fuel used. I am normally around .49-.65 on 91 Cali pump gas with all my bolt ons and tuned by DRob too. I am not misfiring even if it shows on the side piece.

Here's what DRob said too, "
"Knock Count" = This parameter is a reflection of the ECU's misfire monitor. It is NOT an accurate reflection of anything other than misfire events. When will you see these normally? Startup, rapid throttle closures, rapid throttle inputs, rapid release of the clutch pedal, and sometimes at idle (especially if you have a lighter flywheel/clutch combo, and/or plugs that have been gapped down to prevent spark blowout at high load). A completely stock car, operating perfectly will still accumulate these counts. In my experience with these engines, you will see more activity on cylinder four compared to others, as the crank position sensor is physically located closest to there on the block. This usually isn't a concern area unless you see a steep count in a very, very short time (like 50+ in a few seconds), which will likely trip a P0300-variant DTC code.

"Knock Control" = This parameter is the ECU's determination of fuel quality. Movement here indicates the knock sensor hears what it thinks is knock activity, and reports to the ECU to apply a steeper ignition retard to avoid continued knock activity. This value is dynamic, and WILL move from time to time. On Civic Si models, there doesn't seem to be a forced rise at play at WOT like the non-Si 1.5T ECU's (which naturally rise above 5,200-5,400rpm regardless of sensor input). Movement that goes up and up and up and never comes down is more concerning than movement alone. Knock control can typically be manipulated down by driving the car in a higher gear at lower engine speeds and targeting atmospheric pressure on the MAP sensor reading.

Also here's what Ktuner said, "If the count is not zero then one of the cylinders will show as "misfired". Knock count is not as useful on this platform as it was on previous generations. "
Thanks for the very informative answer!
I'm pretty much debating should I do a custom tune by DRob now or wait when I'll put retro clutch, (PRL or 27won) IC and 27won AI
 

gtman

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Thanks for the very informative answer!
I'm pretty much debating should I do a custom tune by DRob now or wait when I'll put retro clutch, (PRL or 27won) IC and 27won AI
Drob is a great tuner and I'm sure he could work magic with your car but definitely wait til you get the bolt ons.
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