Touring speaker replacement woes and semi-success

[GAVZDAD]

the system is optimized to perform at its best with the components chosen; installing non-honda components is not advisable but if desired will be at the risk of the owner and should be consulted with honda...blah blah blah.

Well, they speak the truth. With a Honda factory stereo, it's hard to get aftermarket speakers to sound anywhere near as good as stock. I'm not saying it's fair, but it's true.

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[1WickedCivic]

Well, they speak the truth. With a Honda factory stereo, it's hard to get aftermarket speakers to sound anywhere near as good as stock. I'm not saying it's fair, but it's true.

That's definitely not true - any aftermarket speaker system will outperform a factory stock speaker system, which is optimized for cost not performance. You will need something like this to start things off http://www.jlaudio.com/fix-86-car-audio-processors-system-tuning-98103

 

[GAVZDAD]

That's definitely not true - any aftermarket speaker system will outperform a factory stock speaker system, which is optimized for cost not performance. You will need something like this to start things off http://www.jlaudio.com/fix-86-car-audio-processors-system-tuning-98103

Dude, I said aftermarket SPEAKERS, I said nothing about a system. There are very few speaker only replacements that will sound as good.

 

[1WickedCivic]

Dude, I said aftermarket SPEAKERS, I said nothing about a system. There are very few speaker only replacements that will sound as good.

You're not getting it - the goal of replacing stock speakers in a factory system is to improve the sound, not have it sound "as good" which would just be a waste of money. I had a set of Polk DB651S speakers installed that are already light years ahead of the stock speakers because I couldn't stand how poor the sound was. This is to tide me over until I can figure out the optimal way to upgrade the sound properly.

 

[GAVZDAD]

it's hard to get

There are very few

You're not getting it

I didn't say impossible. There might a couple sets that would sound better, but not very many. If you have found some, great, but I'm still right.

 

[Dead Pool1]

The hard thing with a debate on sound is that it is solely subjective to the listener. Over my years I had systems with 14 grand wrapped up in equipment alone. This was almost purely for range of 200 hertz and above. I went down the sub route for a few years but soon dedicated money and time on audiophile. I loved it. But I know some of my peers scratched there heads wandering where all the extreme lows were. For this reason I try to avoid the definitive "you want this" approach to audio. I find it best to always start a fresh check sheet.
1. What trim level do you have? Our civics have 3 distinct variations that alters the complexity of upgrading.
2. What equipment do you listen to your music with? Radio. Xm. Phone Bluetooth. Phone usb. Memory stick. There are limitations to some of these. I.e. Bluetooth and xm have extreme compression altering the music. In some cases upgrading your stereo will only bring these deficiencies to light and make the listener more dissatisfied.
3. What is the music preference. I love blues. Jazz. And classic rock. But I hate all live recordings.
4. This is one to take note on. How do you listen to your music? How loud? Bass, treble, mid and sub levels. Is your fader set at mid point, front or back? Do you listen to the nuance of the music or become part of the music? Meaning a audiophile tends to pull the details out of the music. Almost dissecting it. Very little emotion is at play. The other end of the spectrum is being absorbed into it. Letting emotions ride. This helps to paint a portrait of what the individual really likes.
5. number one question. What are you looking to gain from a upgrade? Feel Bass? Just Louder? More definition in the Mids. Highs are too harsh or not defined. Get past the "system sucks" statements.
6. What is the budget?
In some cases I found that after reviewing questions like these the perception of what was wrong did not align with what they felt needed to be done. For some, it may be as simple as using usb over xm and Bluetooth. Others may want more depth to the low bass and just need a sub and amp. While more may require a good DSP like the jl posted above. But even that gets tricky now that everyone seems to use a phone. You can change every speaker, clean up the amps filters or even add new amps, but if the sorce (I.e. Phone) is sending out crap then it's all for not.

 

[1WickedCivic]

I didn't say impossible. There might a couple sets that would sound better, but not very many. If you have found some, great, but I'm still right.
And for the record, I'm talking about only changing speakers.

Actually, you are still not right. For the record, the stock speakers don't sound "good" and no one in their right mind will try to upgrade factory speakers so they can sound the same as stock - what's the point?!?

 

[Slickone]

You're not getting it - the goal of replacing stock speakers in a factory system is to improve the sound, not have it sound "as good" which would just be a waste of money. I had a set of Polk DB651S speakers installed that are already light years ahead of the stock speakers because I couldn't stand how poor the sound was. This is to tide me over until I can figure out the optimal way to upgrade the sound properly.

So the OEM system has time delay? Why?

 

[1WickedCivic]

So the OEM system has time delay? Why?

No idea, my audio buddies up in Portland are helping me figure out how to best upgrade the sound on this car. I'm looking to throw in a set of these http://www.morelhifi.com/product/virtus-nano-2-way-3-way/ & a JL sub, and a couple of old school Precision Power amps that I've kept over the years - once I find out, I'll post an update.

 

[Design]

I am finding that many factory systems throttle the high/low frequencies to promote speaker life. They also tweak their designs because of 1) weight, and 2) power/sensitivity. Most mid range factory systems are intended to run at the lowest power possible. Which is why we see paper factory speakers with well over 90 db sensitivity. I haven't seen the Touring speakers, but imagine they are similar.

We found this very same issue on Mazda's Bose integration. And it was a pain to bypass. The fronts ran a different impedance than the rear. The line level signal between the HU & amp was .5 volts. And the HU (along with the amp) trimmed high/low frequencies that could only be properly boosted by an aftermarket signal processor.

 

[Design]

Also, I had posted this in a couple other threads. For those wanting to do a full HU replacement, this is likely what we are are waiting for:
http://maestro.idatalink.com/

Word is they are working on a solution for us. Best option now appears to be splicing the factory HU with some type of signal processing (which I'm also trying to avoid).

 

[Slickone]

No idea, my audio buddies up in Portland are helping me figure out how to best upgrade the sound on this car. I'm looking to throw in a set of these http://www.morelhifi.com/product/virtus-nano-2-way-3-way/ & a JL sub, and a couple of old school Precision Power amps that I've kept over the years - once I find out, I'll post an update.

Sorry, no idea if it has time delay or no idea why?

 

[Slickone]

Also, I had posted this in a couple other threads. For those wanting to do a full HU replacement, this is likely what we are are waiting for:
http://maestro.idatalink.com/

Word is they are working on a solution for us. Best option now appears to be splicing the factory HU with some type of signal processing (which I'm also trying to avoid).

I've also seen on another forum where they replaced the factory HU with an aftermarket unit that was designed for retaining some OEM features. It wasn't a brand I'd heard of but brand but it looked pretty nice.

 

[Design]

There are a few of them out there. It's getting more complicated (obviously) with the continued integration of things like HVAC controls. Many of the aftermarket HUs have an out-of-the-box connection protocol for solutions like Maestro. It won't do everything. But it should retain a good portion of the OEM HU's functionality once available.

I'm really trying to be patient and not dump money into a solution right away (haven't bought the car yet either). But it's threads like these I tend to follow closely. Maybe offer some advice and hopefully learn off others' successes/challenges.

Good luck OP.

 

[GAVZDAD]

the stock speakers don't sound "good"

That's subjective. I think Honda's stock speakers sound fine for what they are. Someone who works in a car audio store and is around expensive car audio stuff all day, would disagree. It's all in the individuals ears I guess. Honda can't please everyone though.

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