Titan7 T-S5 (18x9.5 +45) vs Titan7 T-S5 Stig JDM (18x10.7 +55)

[anthony.j.labuda]

I want to preface this post with when it comes to wheels and tires, the extent of my knowledge is severely limited.

Background: I currently have zero interest in tracking my Type R. My intention is more for "spirited street driving". I will be doing this mod at the same time that I am doing the following mods to suspension/handling: Whiteline springs, Whiteline 27mm front sway bar + 22mm rear sway bar w/ links, Whiteline front anti-lift kit, and Magic Collar rigid collar kit. I plan on wrapping these new wheels in Michelin PS4S (specs TBD).

I am planning on picking up a set of Titan7 T-S5's to replace my factory wheel set up but I noticed that there were 2 different version I could get: standard (18x9.5 +45) and Stig JDM (18x10.7 +55). From my research, I am coming to the following conclusions:

• When it comes to torque steer, the closer to the factory offset the less likely that additional torque steer will be introduced. Standard: 0, Stig JDM 1
• When it comes to grip/traction, the wider the wheel/tire the more surface area that is available to achieve grip. Standard: 0, Stig JDM: 2
• When it comes to price, the standard come in at $520 while the Stig JDM comes in at $535. I am calling this a wash because $15/wheel is negligible. Standard: 0, Stig JDM: 2

So the questions I have are:

• Am I missing something or does it sound like the Stig JDM version sounds like better buy over the standard?
• Would doing a squared or staggered set up make more sense for my use case?

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[BlueFalcon]

I want to preface this post with when it comes to wheels and tires, the extent of my knowledge is severely limited.

Background: I currently have zero interest in tracking my Type R. My intention is more for "spirited street driving". I will be doing this mod at the same time that I am doing the following mods to suspension/handling: Whiteline springs, Whiteline 27mm front sway bar + 22mm rear sway bar w/ links, Whiteline front anti-lift kit, and Magic Collar rigid collar kit. I plan on wrapping these new wheels in Michelin PS4S (specs TBD).

I am planning on picking up a set of Titan7 T-S5's to replace my factory wheel set up but I noticed that there were 2 different version I could get: standard (18x9.5 +45) and Stig JDM (18x10.7 +55). From my research, I am coming to the following conclusions:

• When it comes to torque steer, the closer to the factory offset the less likely that additional torque steer will be introduced. Standard: 0, Stig JDM 1
• When it comes to grip/traction, the wider the wheel/tire the more surface area that is available to achieve grip. Standard: 0, Stig JDM: 2
• When it comes to price, the standard come in at $520 while the Stig JDM comes in at $535. I am calling this a wash because $15/wheel is negligible. Standard: 0, Stig JDM: 2

So the questions I have are:

• Am I missing something or does it sound like the Stig JDM version sounds like better buy over the standard?
• Would doing a squared or staggered set up make more sense for my use case?

If you aren't tracking the car, you should absolutely not use the Stig version.

I say this because it's NOT a setup that you just mount to the car and roll away. I have the Stig wheels for track purposes, and I'm getting ready to add wheel spacers and pound out the wheel studs to accommodate them. It will not fit without rubbing on stock suspension, or most aftermarket coilover setups. It's far more involved than a common 18x9.5 +45 setup.

That being said, you can find the 18x9.5 +45 setup in ton of different flavors of wheel, and it's easy to live with. You aren't going to feel a difference in torque steer. Just get it properly aligned and you'll be fine.

 

[anthony.j.labuda]

If you aren't tracking the car, you should absolutely not use the Stig version.

I say this because it's NOT a setup that you just mount to the car and roll away. I have the Stig wheels for track purposes, and I'm getting ready to add wheel spacers and pound out the wheel studs to accommodate them. It will not fit without rubbing on stock suspension, or most aftermarket coilover setups. It's far more involved than a common 18x9.5 +45 setup.

That being said, you can find the 18x9.5 +45 setup in ton of different flavors of wheel, and it's easy to live with. You aren't going to feel a difference in torque steer. Just get it properly aligned and you'll be fine.

Thank you so much!

That is pretty much all I need to know.

Standard Titan7 T-S5 (18x9.5 +45) it is!

 

[BlueFalcon]

Thank you so much!

That is pretty much all I need to know.

Standard Titan7 T-S5 (18x9.5 +45) it is!

No prob. I can make a couple of extra suggestions to you, based on what you listed above.

I would skip the front sway bar, for sure. You won't need it. I have also heard of people seeing tearing/dismount of the Whiteline spherical bushings. Not sure if this has been addressed, as of this time.

I'm a big fan of RV6 products, and their customer service is excellent. I would recommend trying their front compliance mounts and rear sway bar. I will say that if you are going to change out the compliance mounts, you should just do the forward bushings on the control arm at the same time. It needs to be pulled to fit the compliance mounts anyway, and it might save you from binding/lack of compliance from the forward softer OEM control arm bushings.

 

[anthony.j.labuda]

Unfortunately, I snagged their Grip Kit over Black Friday which came with all of their parts except for the anti-lift kit so there is no ability to return it. While you say it is not needed, would it also be fair to say that it couldn't hurt to install it anyways? I will already have the front suspension disassembled anyways so since I have it, might as well install it. For the tearing of the Whiteline spherical bushings, is this with respect to the anti-lift kit or the bushings on the link?

I have definitely heard a lot of Owners praising RV6 and their amazing quality. The deal I was able to get on all the Whiteline parts was extremely significant in my decision. Although, as the adage goes, you get what you pay for so maybe it wasn't worth it in retrospect.

 

[BlueFalcon]

Unfortunately, I snagged their Grip Kit over Black Friday which came with all of their parts except for the anti-lift kit so there is no ability to return it. While you say it is not needed, would it also be fair to say that it couldn't hurt to install it anyways? I will already have the front suspension disassembled anyways so since I have it, might as well install it. For the tearing of the Whiteline spherical bushings, is this with respect to the anti-lift kit or the bushings on the link?

I have definitely heard a lot of Owners praising RV6 and their amazing quality. The deal I was able to get on all the Whiteline parts was extremely significant in my decision. Although, as the adage goes, you get what you pay for so maybe it wasn't worth it in retrospect.

I meant the front compliance mounts/bushings. I remember seeing a member of one of the Type R groups with the bushings basically squeezing through the mounts and tearing out. He does track his car, so I know that it's under more duress than the average street driver.

As for the front sway bar- it all depends on where you want your grip/slip. I prefer to keep the traction in the front, and the slip in the back. I wouldn't mount it, but that's me. You can try it and test the car to see if it handles the way you'd like it to.

 

[merakiautoworks]

Hey,

Yeah the Stig version is more for track oriented wheels, and is not a plug and play wheel, it does require some work to make it fit. Usually meant for the track dedicated wheel with coilovers, camber, control arms, etc.. It's like for the A90 Supra, its a 18x10.7 and require linear coilovers to fit, will not fit on stock suspension.

We're a Titan7 dealer, let us know if we can get you setup with a set of TS5! We might have them in stock.

-Josh

 

[Unity Performance]

Hey Anthony, definitely go for standard-spec, the STIG spec is best for track only. 18x9.5 +45 woth a 255/35 or 265/35 is the popular setup for FK8's.

@BlueFalcon, the Whiteline Front Sway Bar on the CTR will add some high-speed stability, and exhibit less body roll. The Double Wishbone suspension design on the CTR is really good at keeping the front-end planted, so the difference won't be as drastic as non-CTR's using the McPherson Strut suspension, but still felt. When adding a thicker rear sway bar, an upgraded Front Sway Bar will be even more noticeable. Our CTR has the Whiteline 26mm RSB, and was super tail-happy with the stock FSB. The Whiteline 27mm helped neutralize the oversteer tendencies.

We made a post explaining more here:


Also, it was clarified that the person running the Anti Lift Kit had the older front compliance bushings that were updated in Spring 2020. We noticed some clicking with our kit installed, reached out to Whiteline about the concern, and learned that they have a new bushing which they sent overnight for us to install. No issues since on street and track, there's a whole thread here you can read through:
https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/whiteline-anti-lift-kit.40655/post-938788

The ALK and FSB combined have been awesome front suspension mods on our shop builds

 

[BlueFalcon]

Hey Anthony, definitely go for standard-spec, the STIG spec is best for track only. 18x9.5 +45 woth a 255/35 or 265/35 is the popular setup for FK8's.

@BlueFalcon, the Whiteline Front Sway Bar on the CTR will add some high-speed stability, and exhibit less body roll. The Double Wishbone suspension design on the CTR is really good at keeping the front-end planted, so the difference won't be as drastic as non-CTR's using the McPherson Strut suspension, but still felt. When adding a thicker rear sway bar, an upgraded Front Sway Bar will be even more noticeable. Our CTR has the Whiteline 26mm RSB, and was super tail-happy with the stock FSB. The Whiteline 27mm helped neutralize the oversteer tendencies.

We made a post explaining more here:


Also, it was clarified that the person running the Anti Lift Kit had the older front compliance bushings that were updated in Spring 2020. We noticed some clicking with our kit installed, reached out to Whiteline about the concern, and learned that they have a new bushing which they sent overnight for us to install. No issues since on street and track, there's a whole thread here you can read through:
https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/whiteline-anti-lift-kit.40655/post-938788

The ALK and FSB combined have been awesome front suspension mods on our shop builds

Huh? Double wishbone suspension doesn't exist on the CTR. I'm assuming you're attempting to reference the dual axis design on the Type R.

If you need more information on it, then check this link:

https://global.honda/innovation/technology/automobile/Dual-axis-strut-suspension-picturebook.html

I'm sure it would be prudent to relay that info to potential customers, rather than describe something that's not actually present on the car.

I'm glad to hear that Whiteline has apparently addressed the concerns with the compliance mounts. I'm sure that will put people at ease, and I'll still highly recommend swapping the forward bushing when the compliance mounts are installed.

As for the sway bar, why would I want to vastly increase understeer? I'll hold steady and maintain that the front sway bar is unnecessary. I'm running this thing at the track, so I'll stick with "super tail happy." That's one of many reasons why someone might choose, say, a reverse staggered setup with the Stig wheels, with an adjustable rear sway bar.

 

[BrokeCTROwner]

I’m running the stig spec wheels on my r with a 5mm spacer and they do rub on full turn but other than that it’s fine. Can still uturn just fine

 

[BrokeCTROwner]

I’ve even checked how the damage is on the wheels/suspension and after 10k miles it’s very minimal

 

[ehCobra]

Huh? Double wishbone suspension doesn't exist on the CTR. I'm assuming you're attempting to reference the dual axis design on the Type R.

If you need more information on it, then check this link:

https://global.honda/innovation/technology/automobile/Dual-axis-strut-suspension-picturebook.html

I'm sure it would be prudent to relay that info to potential customers, rather than describe something that's not actually present on the car.

I'm glad to hear that Whiteline has apparently addressed the concerns with the compliance mounts. I'm sure that will put people at ease, and I'll still highly recommend swapping the forward bushing when the compliance mounts are installed.

As for the sway bar, why would I want to vastly increase understeer? I'll hold steady and maintain that the front sway bar is unnecessary. I'm running this thing at the track, so I'll stick with "super tail happy." That's one of many reasons why someone might choose, say, a reverse staggered setup with the Stig wheels, with an adjustable rear sway bar.

Damn, I wish I'd known about replacing the other front arm bushings when doing the anti-lift kit. I just had a whole mess of parts installed over the weekend, including the ALK. I also opted to not upgrade the front swaybar -- yet at least. Next I'd like to step up to the front lower camber adjusters from Hardrace and rear toe and camber arms, but I'm not sure if I should opt for the rubber bushing options versus the solids. Will the RV6 front spherical bushings be too harsh compared to stock? Also how about the two different RV6 spherical bushings for the rear -- for the knuckle and for the trailing arms? I just street drive this car, for what it's worth.

 

[BlueFalcon]

Damn, I wish I'd known about replacing the other front arm bushings when doing the anti-lift kit. I just had a whole mess of parts installed over the weekend, including the ALK. I also opted to not upgrade the front swaybar -- yet at least. Next I'd like to step up to the front lower camber adjusters from Hardrace and rear toe and camber arms, but I'm not sure if I should opt for the rubber bushing options versus the solids. Will the RV6 front spherical bushings be too harsh compared to stock? Also how about the two different RV6 spherical bushings for the rear -- for the knuckle and for the trailing arms? I just street drive this car, for what it's worth.

If you're lowered, your first priority should be to correct the alignment with parts like the rear toe and camber arms. After that, you could pull the guide pins at the front for a bit more negative camber, and go from there.

In my opinion, you've already committed to increased NVH by adding the "anti-lift kit." Those compliance bushings create a lot of noise and can be quite stiff. Any additional bushing upgrade will compliment the setup, but it's up to you if that's necessary for a street-only car.

I have the full RV6 kit at this point, and love it, but my car rides like a race car. I think it's awesome, but I've certainly had average non-car people take a ride and tell me they wouldn't be able to handle driving it everyday due to the noise and harshness of the car on the streets.

 

[ehCobra]

If you're lowered, your first priority should be to correct the alignment with parts like the rear toe and camber arms. After that, you could pull the guide pins at the front for a bit more negative camber, and go from there.

In my opinion, you've already committed to increased NVH by adding the "anti-lift kit." Those compliance bushings create a lot of noise and can be quite stiff. Any additional bushing upgrade will compliment the setup, but it's up to you if that's necessary for a street-only car.

I have the full RV6 kit at this point, and love it, but my car rides like a race car. I think it's awesome, but I've certainly had average non-car people take a ride and tell me they wouldn't be able to handle driving it everyday due to the noise and harshness of the car on the streets.

Thanks so much for the input. I am interested in doing the front+rear camber adjustments next, along with the rear toe links. What camber and toe values should I be looking to achieve? The car is just for street use, for what it's worth. I assume that rear toe is not adjustable with the stock links -- only the front.

 

[Learn2turn]

As for the (FRONT) sway bar, why would I want to vastly increase understeer? I'll hold steady and maintain that the front sway bar is unnecessary. I'm running this thing at the track, so I'll stick with "super tail happy." That's one of many reasons why someone might choose, say, a reverse staggered setup with the Stig wheels, with an adjustable rear sway bar.

I could not agree more w/ @BlueFalcon , I have even considered disconnecting the FSB when autoXing with the local Porsche club to gain more grip in those 90-180deg turns.

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