Software updates - Free from dealership?

[mno86]

The toughest part about these updates is that they almost never communicate them to owners.

Even with TSBs, Honda has never contacted me once over the years unless it was a recall.

In fact, dealers pushed back on me so much that I had to find copies of their material online to prove I wasn't BS'ing. It's gotten much harder over the years, as I lost access to the Internal site that showed all the TSB and "little updates" for Honda.

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[dick w]

The toughest part about these updates is that they almost never communicate them to owners.

People have become too conditioned by the App Store model. These updates cost Honda real money paying the dealer to install them. They aren't going to be eager nor make it simple for owners to spend their money.

 

[mno86]

While I don't entirely disagree, if people are dropping $27K on a car that has buggy systems or needs software updates to remain useable, I do expect the App Store treatment.

But on principle, I get what you're saying and agree. I just have very little sympathy when it comes to car companies and updates after literally fighting Honda for YEARS on the tied gear issues with the 2006-2012 Si before they released a TSB that no one but enthusiasts knew about...including dealers.

 

[dick w]

While I don't entirely disagree, if people are dropping $27K on a car that has buggy systems or needs software updates to remain useable, I do expect the App Store treatment.

I'm not saying is the right thing or a good thing and I'm all over this forum with posts unhappy about the current way Honda (and many other auto manufacturers) treat software updates. But their business model is not the Facebook model. Facebook gives experiences away in order to attract your eyeballs and rent that attraction time to advertisers. The app stores let them issue improvements to those experiences for zero money past the cost of developing the code. Improvements that might result in more eyeball time to rent to advertisers as soon as today. Honda makes money selling cars. Once sold, anything more they do for that owner costs them real money. Maybe it makes it more likely that they sell that owner or that owner's friends another Honda somewhere far down the road. Maybe. But distributing updates cost them real money. For each and every update distributed. The TSB 16-028 update pays the dealer 0.2 hours. That's on the order of $20. Real money out of Honda's pocket into the dealer's.

 

[threefity]

I'm not saying is the right thing or a good thing and I'm all over this forum with posts unhappy about the current way Honda (and many other auto manufacturers) treat software updates. But their business model is not the Facebook model. Facebook gives experiences away in order to attract your eyeballs and rent that attraction time to advertisers. The app stores let them issue improvements to those experiences for zero money past the cost of developing the code. Improvements that might result in more eyeball time to rent to advertisers as soon as today. Honda makes money selling cars. Once sold, anything more they do for that owner costs them real money. Maybe it makes it more likely that they sell that owner or that owner's friends another Honda somewhere far down the road. Maybe. But distributing updates cost them real money. For each and every update distributed. The TSB 16-028 update pays the dealer 0.2 hours. That's on the order of $20. Real money out of Honda's pocket into the dealer's.

But to your argument, this would be better compared to software in which you paid for. If I pay for a software platform that is currently broken or buggy (surging issue for me) and with the vehicle being deeply wrapped into the software they place into the car I WOULD assume that these type of updates would be important to the consumer of their products. Especially if any issues with the software could potentially cause any damage to the car or benefit the consumers experience with their products.

 

[dick w]

But to your argument, this would be better compared to software in which you paid for. If I pay for a software platform that is currently broken or buggy (surging issue for me) and with the vehicle being deeply wrapped into the software they place into the car I WOULD assume that these type of updates would be important to the consumer of their products. Especially if any issues with the software could potentially cause any damage to the car or benefit the consumers experience with their products.

No doubt. Microsoft and Adobe, to name two of many, have tried to transition from a one time sale software product model to ongoing subscription/service models precisely because customers expect them to actually fix bugs for free in software they already paid for with no promise that they'll buy the next version because the current version they already paid for is "good enough".

 

[dick w]

And if Honda offered me a code update subscription service for $50/year or something like that, or added a Maintenance Minder code for "Check and update all firmware" that the dealers charged 0.5 hours for, I'd pay it. Should I have to pay to get fixes for their code mistakes? No. But it'd be better than them never getting fixed.

 

[threefity]

I'm not sure that is the exact reason in which those companies adopted the "cloud based" model. I would assume it was so that more people could actually afford the software they were providing while also making software updates easier and less painful. Not to mention that is the way in which software is moving. The buy this DVD of our software model is close to dead.

If any software is broken/buggy I would of course expect the manufacturer of that product to fix any issues without cost to the consumer. These are fixes to flaws in the code that they wrote originally. If they were producing another version that had "upgrades" or "new features" I could understand your argument. The point your making in regards to the company doing this for free without knowing if the consumer will return is irrelevant. These are bug fixes and should be fixed at the price of the manufacturer.

 

[dick w]

The point your making in regards to the company doing this for free without knowing if the consumer will return is irrelevant. These are bug fixes and should be fixed at the price of the manufacturer.

They didn't offer the software with a forever warranty. Typically the licenses disclaim any warranties at all.

 

[krav51]

is there a way to tell if you have the latest update?

 

[dick w]

A dealer with the HDS tool may be able to tell. An owner without the tool can't.

 

[dtccivic]

Another metaphor would be Tesla which offers OTA (over the air) updates. But then again, Tesla is a tech company that makes "iPads with wheels" - versus Honda which is a motor company that makes a Civic with a buggy Android tablet stuck in.

 

[Soma]

Another metaphor would be Tesla which offers OTA (over the air) updates. But then again, Tesla is a tech company that makes "iPads with wheels" - versus Honda which is a motor company that makes a Civic with a buggy Android tablet stuck in.

At least everything else on the civic is sound. I've read that current Teslas owners are experiencing issues with doors and a few other things. Honda is installing a new tablet in my car tomorrow. I pray this is the end of my infotainment issues.

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