Question abut stock intercooler and potential upgrades

[Marlo42]

Hi everyone,

I tried searching Google/here but I couldn't find any information unless I am just a potato.

I recently got a kTuner for my car (Phearable Stage 1.5, still in the mail) and I've been doing research on other upgrades for my 19 Si.

I know one thing that a lot of people have pointed out is the importance of an intercooler to help with heat soaking. Because I am not too familiar with the mechanism of the intercooler, I am wondering if one is still necessary if you live in a colder state. I live in Upstate NY and it's below 70 degree just about 90-95% of the time.

So I'm wondering if an intercooler is something that's still important because heat soak is mostly independent of ambient temperature or if it depends 100% on it.


tl;dr do I need an intercooler as a priority if I live in a cold state?

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[hobby-man]

I think you could still benefit. When you start bumping power, you start increasing heat. Even if the ambient air is on the cooler side, the stock IC was still only designed to dissipate a particular level of heat/power.

 

[Marlo42]

I think you could still benefit. When you start bumping power, you start increasing heat. Even if the ambient air is on the cooler side, the stock IC was still only designed to dissipate a particular level of heat/power.

So I guess my question, is it still a priority over say a DP or CAI? Or does it pushed down as like a 4th or 5th update?

 

[hobby-man]

So I guess my question, is it still a priority over say a DP or CAI? Or does it pushed down as like a 4th or 5th update?

My preference would probably be CAI and/or DP first, especially given we are headed into winter...

Without knowing anything about your budget, plans, and timeline I'd be looking at "supporting" power mods right now and aim to do an IC for the summer.

 

[squelchy451]

Upgraded IC in itself won't give you more power--it just allows you to make peak power more consistently after a point where heat soak would have overwhelmed the stock unit.

So if you want something that can really give your car an oomph, tune and DP. Most factory intakes are pretty efficient, nothing to gain with intake besides cool sounds. Intercooler if you want increased cooling capacity (kind of like how track package Mustang/Camaros come with additional cooling for transmission)

 

[Marlo42]

Upgraded IC in itself won't give you more power--it just allows you to make peak power more consistently after a point where heat soak would have overwhelmed the stock unit.

So if you want something that can really give your car an oomph, tune and DP. Most factory intakes are pretty efficient, nothing to gain with intake besides cool sounds. Intercooler if you want increased cooling capacity (kind of like how track package Mustang/Camaros come with additional cooling for transmission)

Thanks for the response.

Yeah, I am aware that the upgraded IC wouldn't give any extra power, but I was asking if the heat soaking would kill all the oomph from the tune and the DP (thus getting the IC would be better since what's the point of the DP/CAI if after one pull my car loses its power). Or if the cold weather of a northern state would offset the heat soak enough that I could make the IC my 4th-5th upgrade. And yeah, I definitely want the CAI for the sound haha.

I don't exactly beat on my car or race, so the responses I'm gathering suggest do IC later.

 

[squelchy451]

Thanks for the response.

Yeah, I am aware that the upgraded IC wouldn't give any extra power, but I was asking if the heat soaking would kill all the oomph from the tune and the DP (thus getting the IC would be better since what's the point of the DP/CAI if after one pull my car loses its power). Or if the cold weather of a northern state would offset the heat soak enough that I could make the IC my 4th-5th upgrade. And yeah, I definitely want the CAI for the sound haha.

I don't exactly beat on my car or race, so the responses I'm gathering suggest do IC later.

Maybe wait on the IC and see how the car holds up come June/July.

 

[Janssen098]

I did a cai with ktuner first. I also have a stage 2 competition clutch that will be here Tuesday since I will be adding a lot of things. I am waiting to get my Intercooler until I buy the 27 won turbo and just knock both of them out at the same time.

 

[Marlo42]

Thanks. I think I'll definitely go with IC as a later upgrade given my driving style and what you guys have said.

It is a bit interesting to me that no one has asked that question on here (not that I could find anyway).

 

[si_well]

You don't NEED an upgraded intercooler if everything else is stock. However, the more parts you add translates to more power that you will make, which means more heat. Upgrading your intercooler will make an increasingly greater difference in maintaining consistently lower temps with the more parts you put on.

I run TSP stage 1 on Map 3 in sport mode almost exclusively and live in Northeast PA, which is similar weather to you. I don't have a problem with heat soaking unless it's like >80 degrees and I'm hammering it. My plan is to get a CAI w/ race MAF next and then sometime down the road get a catted DP/FP combo along with an intercooler to be installed at the same time to then be custom tuned to optimize my setup.

 

[KingOfBrussels]

Let's back up and explain what it is an intercooler does before all this talking about heat soak. Turbos heat air as they compress it. Engines like cool air for peak performance. The intercooler goes between the turbo and the throttle and acts like a radiator, cooling the hot air coming out of the turbo by radiating heat into the outside air.

Heat soak is when the intercooler's no longer able to effectively cool down the air coming from the turbo, because the intercooler is too hot to effectively radiate the heat from the charge air to the outside air.

Cold weather helps delay heat soak because the air outside the intercooler is that much cooler than the air inside the intercooler, so it's more effective at pulling the heat out through the intercooler.

As your intake air temps rise due to the IC heat soaking, you won't necessarily notice right away that the car is performing worse, because it's using the knock sensor and pulling timing to deal with the higher intake air temps as seamlessly as possible.

Anybody saying their stock IC is fine with a tune, I'm not inclined to believe that unless they've checked their intake air temperature sensor readings and can confirm the stock IC is not heat soaking. Otherwise they're relying on their butt dyno and the ECU can too easily fool most butt dynos into not noticing heat soak as it's happening.

Think about it this way: the Si has a bigger turbo than the base 1.5T Civics, but the same intercooler. Running an aftermarket tune with higher boost means more heat, all thru that same intercooler used on plain regular 1.5T Civics that make way less power than a tuned Si.

Upgrading the intercooler won't make big sexy power gains on the dyno, but it will gain some power, and the big thing it does is make sure your car performs consistently with the higher boost levels from a tune.

Intercooler is going to be my first bolt-on upgrade to go with a tune. The rest of y'all can do whatever you want but IMO this is the smartest thing to do to ensure consistent performance.

 

[KingOfBrussels]

Upgraded IC in itself won't give you more power--it just allows you to make peak power more consistently after a point where heat soak would have overwhelmed the stock unit.

So if you want something that can really give your car an oomph, tune and DP. Most factory intakes are pretty efficient, nothing to gain with intake besides cool sounds. Intercooler if you want increased cooling capacity (kind of like how track package Mustang/Camaros come with additional cooling for transmission)

No, this is wrong.

Upgrading the intercooler will make more power, all on its own, just not as much as a downpipe.

Additional cooling in the form of radiators, oil coolers, trans coolers etc help keep the various parts of the engine at their correct operating temps.

Additional intercooler capacity directly affects the engine's performance by cooling the intake air. Cooler air is more dense which means more fuel can be mixed with it to hit the desired air/fuel ratio, and more air + fuel = more power, and turbo cars basically need intercoolers because of how much turbos heat up the intake air as they compress it (which is another way to get more air + fuel into the engine for more power).

 

[Eryan36]

The only bolt-on I have is a Mishimoto intercooler. I haven't tuned yet. The main reason was lower intake temps. It gets hot and humid in the summer, to me the additional cooling capacity is good insurance as well as a good performance enhancement that will help even more once I up the boost.

 

[reesee175]

The only bolt-on I have is a Mishimoto intercooler. I haven't tuned yet. The main reason was lower intake temps. It gets hot and humid in the summer, to me the additional cooling capacity is good insurance as well as a good performance enhancement that will help even more once I up the boost.

Great choice. I have the same one and see anywhere from 5 to 15 degrees over even when pushing the car.

 

[hobby-man]

Great choice. I have the same one and see anywhere from 5 to 15 degrees over even when pushing the car.

I pretty typically see about 5-8C over ambient with my 27WON FMIC which aligns with what you see. Just giving a metric perspective for my Northern brothers haha.

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