Pure Turbos PS2 Turbo Upgrade

LilToTo17

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Thanks @LilToTo17. I was looking for results on the same car but this will have to do. 250whp vs 295whp is significant. Peak torque stock is reached at around 3250rpm vs 4400rpm with the Pure unit. So..it's a small compromise of sorts. Thanks!
You will mo
You're right its a tad lazy compared to the W1. This is to be expected with a 9 blade vs 11 blade turbine. The difference in flow is probably comparable to the OEM non Si and OEM Si turbos. I'm an Oceanside local and have known about Pure for sometime ever since, they have high power cars running their hybrid turbos and just about any hybrid design retaining an OEM or OEM shape housing while increasing the turbine and compressor diameter, you would need to take off some material from the inside to make these larger wheels fit, W1 is no different. The only you would really get a thicker housing while having bigger wheels is just getting a bigger turbo itself like the ones PRL offers and skip the hybrid stuff.
Well the thing is one of the best tuner's for the 10th gen civic even said modifying a stock turbo decreases it's durability. W1 on the other hand is not made from a stock turbo and is 100% made from scratch is the difference.
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You will mo

Well the thing is one of the best tuner's for the 10th gen civic even said modifying a stock turbo decreases it's durability. W1 on the other hand is not made from a stock turbo and is 100% made from scratch is the difference.
100% made from scratch but still limited to the same thickness to retain the whole drop in ease, on the other hand your pure450 will be using an MHI core so yes... big difference, I'll take and MHI core any day.
 

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You're right its a tad lazy compared to the W1. This is to be expected with a 9 blade vs 11 blade turbine. The difference in flow is probably comparable to the OEM non Si and OEM Si turbos.
You would think this is the case. It's not, if we are talking about loss of lowend torque. This is why I purchased and had installed an Si turbo to replace my stock non-Si turbo. I loved everything about the stock turbo (I'm probably a 1%'er here. Haha) but got greedy and wanted increases throughout the whole powerband. With no compromises. The Si turbo delivered on that, despite the blade differences. See attached dyno plot!

For me, because I own a CVT, it's important that I don't lose any lowend over stock. Of course we don't want too much lowend that would break the CVT belt or cause it to slip. Also...the rods are a concern as well. Despite these, I do not want to lose any lowend. Anything to improve the lowend would be excellent. Be it by more power, less weight, tuning or something else. ;)

With the Si turbo, there are improvements everywhere.

Honda Civic 10th gen Pure Turbos PS2 Turbo Upgrade Si Turbo vs Non-Si Turbo
 
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LilToTo17

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100% made from scratch but still limited to the same thickness to retain the whole drop in ease, on the other hand your pure450 will be using an MHI core so yes... big difference, I'll take and MHI core any day.
Yeah maybe but I mean our own tuner said that he doesn't recommend modiying a stock turbo frame lol and that should mean something.
 

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You would think this is the case. It's not, if we are talking about loss of lowend torque. This is why I purchased and had installed an Si turbo to replace my stock non-Si turbo. I loved everything about the stock turbo (I'm probably a 1%'er here. Haha) but got greedy and wanted increases throughout the whole powerband. With no compromises. The Si turbo delivered on that, despite the blade differences. See attached dyno plot!

For me, because I own a CVT, it's important that I don't lose any lowend over stock. Of course we don't want too much lowend that would break the CVT belt or cause it to slip. Also...the rods are a concern as well. Despite these, I do not want to lose any lowend. Anything to improve the lowend would be excellent. Be it by more power, less weight, tuning or something else. ;)

With the Si turbo, there are improvements everywhere.

Si Turbo vs Non-Si Turbo.jpg
LOL those are some great numbers especially the low and mid range. I was actually planning on an Si turbo swap but my friend ended up using my Si turbo for his Pure450 core, so when he returned me his stock turbo it's the same sport turbo as mine so I ended up driving to pure turbos to get the same thing.


Yeah maybe but I mean our own tuner said that he doesn't recommend modiying a stock turbo frame lol and that should mean something.
I love the guy, my pure450 car runs great cause of him but just cause he says so doesn't meant its automatically correct. IHI, MHI have been making turbos for a very long time and I'm sure they know how to make a durable turbo housing. So back to housing failures on hybrid turbos, how about those W1 failures that cracked in the turbine housing by the wastegate? That should mean something too right? But I'm not over here saying it's inferior or anything, you're just going to have to accept that there is more than one way to a goal and also accept that hybrid turbos will have the housing as a weak point, you can't fit larger wheels without making the housing thinner because it needs to stay the same size on the outside no matter who makes it.
 


LilToTo17

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LOL those are some great numbers especially the low and mid range. I was actually planning on an Si turbo swap but my friend ended up using my Si turbo for his Pure450 core, so when he returned me his stock turbo it's the same sport turbo as mine so I ended up driving to pure turbos to get the same thing.




I love the guy, my pure450 car runs great cause of him but just cause he says so doesn't meant its automatically correct. IHI, MHI have been making turbos for a very long time and I'm sure they know how to make a durable turbo housing. So back to housing failures on hybrid turbos, how about those W1 failures that cracked in the turbine housing by the wastegate? That should mean something too right? But I'm not over here saying it's inferior or anything, you're just going to have to accept that there is more than one way to a goal and also accept that hybrid turbos will have the housing as a weak point, you can't fit larger wheels without making the housing thinner because it needs to stay the same size on the outside no matter who makes it.
We all know why the W1 housing cracked lol horrible afr’s. All I know is the W1 has a TD04 CHRA not sure about pure. All in all the W1 from mine will be sold for the ball bearing W2 drop in with a TD05 CHRA
 

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LOL those are some great numbers especially the low and mid range. I was actually planning on an Si turbo swap but my friend ended up using my Si turbo for his Pure450 core, so when he returned me his stock turbo it's the same sport turbo as mine so I ended up driving to pure turbos to get the same thing.




I love the guy, my pure450 car runs great cause of him but just cause he says so doesn't meant its automatically correct. IHI, MHI have been making turbos for a very long time and I'm sure they know how to make a durable turbo housing. So back to housing failures on hybrid turbos, how about those W1 failures that cracked in the turbine housing by the wastegate? That should mean something too right? But I'm not over here saying it's inferior or anything, you're just going to have to accept that there is more than one way to a goal and also accept that hybrid turbos will have the housing as a weak point, you can't fit larger wheels without making the housing thinner because it needs to stay the same size on the outside no matter who makes it.
We all know why the W1 housing cracked lol horrible afr’s
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We all know why the W1 housing cracked lol horrible afr’s. All I know is the W1 has a TD04 CHRA not sure about pure. All in all the W1 from mine will be sold for the ball bearing W2 drop in with a TD05 CHRA
LOL yes, I seen those full E85 tunes LMAOOO. I believe the Pure is around a TD04 equivalent. If the W2 can match what the smaller PRL turbos can make I may just jump in the W2 with you.
 

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You would think this is the case. It's not, if we are talking about loss of lowend torque. This is why I purchased and had installed an Si turbo to replace my stock non-Si turbo. I loved everything about the stock turbo (I'm probably a 1%'er here. Haha) but got greedy and wanted increases throughout the whole powerband. With no compromises. The Si turbo delivered on that, despite the blade differences. See attached dyno plot!

For me, because I own a CVT, it's important that I don't lose any lowend over stock. Of course we don't want too much lowend that would break the CVT belt or cause it to slip. Also...the rods are a concern as well. Despite these, I do not want to lose any lowend. Anything to improve the lowend would be excellent. Be it by more power, less weight, tuning or something else. ;)

With the Si turbo, there are improvements everywhere.

Si Turbo vs Non-Si Turbo.jpg
I'm getting more interested in SI/CR-V turbo swap. I spend 90% of my driving time in horrible stop and go traffic so maintaining a stock low-end is important for me.

If I read the plot correctly, that was +32 WHP vs. 1.5T stock turbo at the same calibration/tune?

Hopefully, I can find one in good condition at junkyard, re-tune, and dyno.
 
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I'm getting more interested in SI/CR-V turbo swap. I spend 90% of my driving time in horrible stop and go traffic so maintaining a stock low-end is important for me.

If I read the plot correctly, that was +32 WHP vs. 1.5T stock turbo at the same calibration/tune?

Hopefully, I can find one in good condition at junkyard, re-tune, and dyno.
It’s a great upgrade for sure. You just have to make it worth it by getting the si turbo for cheap or better yet, free.
 


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You just have to make it worth it by getting the si turbo for cheap or better yet, free.
This will be challenging though. Been checking well known junkyard in my city & remote areas near to my city & none have it in stock. Hoping someone sell used SI turbo for cheap in good condition in ebay & willing to ship internationally.
 

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This will be challenging though. Been checking well known junkyard in my city & remote areas near to my city & none have it in stock. Hoping someone sell used SI turbo for cheap in good condition in ebay & willing to ship internationally.
I'm making a few heh & a stock crv turbo arriving sometime early next week but I'll upgrade the compressor blade to a billet gtx 11+0. No machining required but of course it'll balanced. Should be able to build boost a tad quicker & rated to go up to 1.9 bar.
Most turbo failures normally happens due to over abuse or pushing it a little too far IMHO.
 

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I'm making a few heh & a stock crv turbo arriving sometime early next week but I'll upgrade the compressor blade to a billet gtx 11+0. No machining required but of course it'll balanced. Should be able to build boost a tad quicker & rated to go up to 1.9 bar.
Most turbo failures normally happens due to over abuse or pushing it a little too far IMHO.
@captminer For our application (The Civic and this specific turbo), could you share with us what is considered over abuse and pushing it a little too far? What happens to the turbo when we do this? Many people don't know what this is so it'll be educational.
 

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@captminer For our application (The Civic and this specific turbo), could you share with us what is considered over abuse and pushing it a little too far? What happens to the turbo when we do this? Many people don't know what this is so it'll be educational.
1st of all, everything have it's limits so by pushing it over it's capabilities disaster tends to happen such as the early W1 turbo failures & it has a limit of 27psi do correct me if i'm wrong & every turbo has it's specific efficiency curve but it does NOT mean it have to pushed up or over it's rated limit all the time especially with blended fuel or with the addition of WMI or abusing it with antilag or with lots of pops & bangs this will further damage many other items including the turbo itself.

Some even full throttle for over 2 hours or more on the freeway traveling at a min speed of 200km/h or more at max boost. it's not a good idea imo especially on a tuned car with increased boost or at least have some cooling upgrades. It's on a CVT too. Thank the ECU with it's protection caused the car to have all sorts of warnings with the x'mas light lighting up preventing gear change or any boost, it all went back to normal after cooling down. If the safety have been removed i'm sure something will blow up sooner or later.

There are also people who are obsessed with high dyno chart numbers (for social media) & tries to get more hp/tq by running too lean.

Even not being pushed to it's limits many still abuse by racing their car all the time without proper care or regular maintenance or have the appropriate upgrades to compensate for the added power.

Probability of a poor manufacturing process or assembly or parts failure. Best to go for a well known manufacturer or turbo shop will be best bet.

I had a turbo failed NOT due to the turbo itself but it was poor engine oil quality provided standard by Honda in my country 0-20W (you can request for 0-30W though i did but they mistakenly filled it up with 0-20W) is a little too thin for hot climate here on a tuned civic have caused the oil pump to fail which is quite rare & that lead to a turbo failure without or very little oil flowing through it. The turbo failed on a normal drive with only 2 or 3 gentle pulls on a single gear on a 20 mins drive.

I could be wrong but it's just my 2 cents worth & many other reasons/scenario too.
 
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There are also people who are obsessed with high dyno chart numbers (for social media) & tries to get more hp/tq by running too lean.
This is the big one. A lot of people don't realize that fuel itself is a cooling agent, when you don't have enough fuel your combustion gases will be hotter and that same gases are the ones flowing and running through your turbo which can cause the failure
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