Prevent / minimize turbo inlet pipe heat soak

[NavSubVetCTR]

I am installing the PRL turbo inlet piping (titanium) and trying to decide if I need to wrap with gold reflective tape or titanium lava insulation. General rule of thumb seems to be gold to keep heat out, insulation to keep heat inside of exhaust side. But from a heat transfer perspective, insulating the inlet pipe reduces thermal input...a few discussions that don't pass the heat transfer or science check...but not much technical or data justified responses on the topic.

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[remc86007]

In for responses. I'd love to see if any of the companies making parts to improve this have any temp data on it. It doesn't seem like it would be that hard to test with two thermal probes in a temperature controlled garage.

 

[18RRtypeR]

I am installing the PRL turbo inlet piping (titanium) and trying to decide if I need to wrap with gold reflective tape or titanium lava insulation. General rule of thumb seems to be gold to keep heat out, insulation to keep heat inside of exhaust side. But from a heat transfer perspective, insulating the inlet pipe reduces thermal input...a few discussions that don't pass the heat transfer or science check...but not much technical or data justified responses on the topic.

You shouldn't heat wrap titanium

 

[OneSickFK8]

Wrapping a titanium inlet pipe is foolish. Good way to trap heat in...

 

[NavSubVetCTR]

You shouldn't heat wrap titanium

Why? Is there data that you reviewed or saw that caused you to form this opinion?

 

[18RRtypeR]

Why? Is there data that you reviewed or saw that caused you to form this opinion?

When titanium retains heat it can become brittle and crack.

 

[NavSubVetCTR]

Wrapping a titanium inlet pipe is foolish. Good way to trap heat in...

I don't understand the comment that it would "trap heat in"...this is the intake pipe, the air inside the turbo inlet pipe is the coolest it will be during the combustion life cycle...heat moves from hot to cold. I am interested to understand why you think it is foolish and appreciate your input. Thank you in advance.

 

[OneSickFK8]

Why? Is there data that you reviewed or saw that caused you to form this opinion?

you never want to wrap inlets. Because once they heat soak. Which they will. It holds the heat in. You want it to cool the heat soak as soon as possible. Especially into the atmosphere and not the charge air. No data needed. Just common sense. Wrap everything that is on the hot side to keep heat in.

When titanium retains heat it can become brittle and crack.

I forgot about this. This reminds of back in the day at the motorcycle race shop. Guys would buy full titanium exhausts and want to wrap the headers. The mechanics were always against it.

 

[NavSubVetCTR]

When titanium retains heat it can become brittle and crack.

Titanium has low thermal conductivity, which is one reason it is well suited for inlet piping...it allows less heat to be conducted, or transferred from the hot to the cold. It seems that any other supporting activity (further insulating or heat rejection) could only further prevent heat from being transferred into the charge.

 

[18RRtypeR]

Since you want to argue every point...this is directly from DEI... the people who make the best wraps..IMO... I'm sure you'll want data for that too.

 

[18RRtypeR]

Titanium has low thermal conductivity, which is one reason it is well suited for inlet piping...it allows less heat to be conducted, or transferred from the hot to the cold. It seems that any other supporting activity (further insulating or heat rejection) could only further prevent heat from being transferred into the charge.

Then wrap the fucking pipe and stop asking opinions.

 

[NavSubVetCTR]

Thanks for that input...I see what could be some of the confusion, that is in reference to a titanium exhaust...which makes sense because you would be keeping the heat inside the exhaust pipe...my question is attempting to keep the cool air inside the turbo inlet pipe from getting heated up by the engine compartment ambient temperature (exhaust, turbo, etc.). I started this thread after talking to Eric at Design Engineering in Avon Lake, Ohio...wanted to see if there was something I was missing, or if it was a waste of time because titanium was already such a good insulator. Thank you both for your input...I will check back with Design Engineering and maybe get them to weigh in here to get first hand data. Thanks again!

 

[charleswrivers]

Seeing your sig, I can appreciate you ‘nuking it out’

Comparing a titanium intake pipe to titanium exhaust has an inherent flaw. Like you said, the incoming air inside then pipe it cool... with the outside environment being hot. With the exhaust, the exhaust gasses inside are hot... the outside environment is cool and it’s heat sink... in that case... yeah, wrapping would be awful. When cool, it’d still go ambient but you’d allow it to get far hotter when wrapped. That’d cause more extreme thermal cycles. Titanium starts off more brittle and doesn’t take to being thermally cycled or work hardened. Remember out Russian friends with their awesome titanium hulled submarines which could dive very... very deep but you couldn’t do that many times w/o the hull failing.

You seem to be wanting to wrap, and there are folks who have wrapped non-titanium intake pipes, regardless of trim. Now I think the gold wrap helps some with radiant heat... and I’m not sure if titanium, by virtue of the material itself is more impervious to radiant heat by its nature, compared to stock materials.

You seem interested in whether it’d work so I say take some IATs, insulate and post your findings. If you do a search, you should see some posts from stock-pipe-wrappers. Can’t recall seeing one for a wrapped titanium intake pipe.

 

[18RRtypeR]

Its because you don't need to wrap titanium.

 

[NavSubVetCTR]

Seeing your sig, I can appreciate you ‘nuking it out’

Comparing a titanium intake pipe to titanium exhaust has an inherent flaw. Like you said, the incoming air inside then pipe it cool... with the outside environment being hot. With the exhaust, the exhaust gasses inside are hot... the outside environment is cool and it’s heat sink... in that case... yeah, wrapping would be awful. When cool, it’d still go ambient but you’d allow it to get far hotter when wrapped. That’d cause more extreme thermal cycles. Titanium starts off more brittle and doesn’t take to being thermally cycled or work hardened. Remember out Russian friends with their awesome titanium hulled submarines which could dive very... very deep but you couldn’t do that many times w/o the hull failing.

You seem to be wanting to wrap, and there are folks who have wrapped non-titanium intake pipes, regardless of trim. Now I think the gold wrap helps some with radiant heat... and I’m not sure if titanium, by virtue of the material itself is more impervious to radiant heat by its nature, compared to stock materials.

You seem interested in whether it’d work so I say take some IATs, insulate and post your findings. If you do a search, you should see some posts from stock-pipe-wrappers. Can’t recall seeing one for a wrapped titanium intake pipe.

I was hoping someone had already done it, and had data...Heat Transfer and Fluid Flow (HTFF) is or should be pretty easy conceptually. Wanted to see if it was a waste of time, if someone had already done it and got little return on their investment of time. Thanks for taking the time to reply.

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