oldman
Senior Member
Yep, it would seem only complete fan boys are allowed. One can never say Honda picked the ugliest body, Honda has taken more than two decades to release it, no, any negativity on the R has to be from died in the wool hater "chevy" guys.Why are you even here? Just to compare apples to oranges? Go get a hobby or maybe some friends, if that's not too hard for you to accomplish.
I liked Honda, I own a ITR, 9th gen and 10th gen. I can still HATE the underspec, long delayed and now super UGLY type R.
1997 type R 14.6 at 101 in the 1/4 and .91g skid (real world turning), near neutral
1997 LT1 Camaro 13.8 at 105 .88g skid, understeer to powr oversteer
1997 4.6 Mustang 14.3 at 102 .86g skid, massive understeer, and skittish oversteer
No the Type R was not a drag racer but it was quick enough and real world handing in actual real world tuns (vs transiet response for autoX) was the best in the business.
2018 Type R 13.7 at 105 1.xg skid, probably slight understeer,
2018 1le Camaro 12.2 at 116 1.xg skid, neutral, to control oversteer
2018 GT Mustang 12.5 at 114 .98 skid, slight understeer, to dunno.
1.5 seconds and 11 mph is a lifetime both on the 1/4 and the street. It is a spankdown ready to happen and Honda needs to have the most bold calling card of any winged vehicle made that I'm a bad boy. Like I've said better pretend you are on your IPhone at any light, or open road way, keep you eyes forward and wear shades.
Will the CTR dominate at the tracks dunno, not as much as the ITR driven by mortal drivers like myself did against Mustangs and Camaros. Clearly the world has changed and Honda did a jump forward vs a leap when it comes to what is actually out in the wild aka street.
Track we will see, I've already seen 1le and a few Shelby show up, soon there will be Golf R and Focus RS, will the CTR dominate? I don't know, but I don't think it will be the tracked focused ITR of yesteryear vs whatever else was for sale.
Now to the looks, I think the 10th gen sedan with tasteful mods is the best looking Civic ever and the second best looking Honda period (ITR the first). IMO, notice opinion the hatchback is the ugliest Civic ever and it is tie with the 2001 to 2004 Civic SI hatch. Opinion of course. I've stated such before. IMO the car is broke over ugly stick ugly.
Is it a flop? I think it is, this is the ONLY 2.0T that the tuner crowd can buy, unlike the B16 in the Del Slow, Integra B18c and Civic SI to the K20 and K24 in Civic SI to TSX, There was a huge following as the engines were readily available (both domestic and JDM). The 2.0T is in a few cars / vans world wide et al, I think (just me) it will come in the Accord coupe and possible the ILX. This means scant few, aka handfuls of K20 turbo engines. It also means long development times, expensive aftermarket. This is NOT what generates hot pocket rocket car fan support. First the SI has a 1.5T (my prediction was correct) and now this. The performance crowd has been on the fence and with this 1 / 2 punch I can see the fans headed to the door. Some are just going to build poser cars that look good in their opinion like the Seibon 4dr, and most are looking at VW, Ford, or Muscle cars which are more just plain performance 2 door cars as they do more than accelerate quickly.
A much more likely avenue of development is for the fan base is buy a 2.0 manual 4dr Civic and adding in a turbo supercharger (I think turbo because of the new exhaust forward configuration, vs the 9th gen that a supercharger was much easier). LSD and suspension. I'd even speculate that if the 2.0T comes out in the accord with CVT we will see an enchanced CVT being shoved into the Civic. Still this is going to be FAR FAR less than the Honda tuner crowd of old. The 1.5T in the SI has called the performance trend for the next decade. It is a great engine but it will be HARD put in a 3000 lbs car to match up with other FWD, AWD and especially RWD. That is the meta and Honda IMO has failed both in the meat and potatoes SI and now the flagship.
Not saying they aint' going to sell and that is what Honda is in, I'm saying the tuners are a moving cause 1.5T while it make a great car for me to buy my kid and toss on some addons, is not going to hold the fanboys.
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