Manual vs CVT just a humble opinion...

bluebluemike

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I test drove the ‘16 2.0 CVT on my regular work commute route along 2 lane back roads, and also back to the dealership on normal in town roads and it never worked for me. It was always in the wrong “gear” for me. I was coming off driving an ‘01 S Class with a (I think) 6 speed auto, and before that 5 speed ‘02 Dakota. After we got back to the dealer I wanted to try the 6MT LX. Didn’t even get out of the lot before I made my decision! It was a lease, and now I’m in a ‘19 Sport Sedan 6MT. Probably should have got the Si, but I was stoked to have push button start and touch screen upgrading from LX. Not really a turbo guy anyway.
Same as me! I always thought the CVT was in a weird gear and the constant acceleration staying at 1.5/2k rpm did not sound good... Got the 2.0 because I'm an NA guy
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Feddy_Ace

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As a guy who over the last 25+ years has driven mostly manuals, the CVT took a bit of getting used to. Once you understand the thing, you start to appreciate how it goes to the right part of the powerband depending on the situation. It's odd at first, but works fairly well with the turbo, stock. Sounds like crap though.

A tune totally changes the feel, the fun factor and to an extent the sound of the car, and the CVT responds well. Of course I miss rowing up and down the gearbox on a curvy back country road, but for fun commuting, a tune and the CVT/turbo combo works rather well.
You touched on something most people don’t discuss and that’s understanding the CVT. It behaves differently than typical automatic. I cringe every time I see a review or something and the guy just mashes down the pedal and bitches about the CVT. Once you learn how to throttle the car, the CVT is typically happy to respond and over time the ECU gets used to your input. My car is always the first one out from a stop light even with light throttle. It wants to go all the time and I struggle to find anything to complain about.
 

Feddy_Ace

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I can't speak to the 2.0, but the 1.5 Turbo with CVT is actually quite enjoyable to drive.
I think the CVT benefits from powerband of the 1.5 Turbo. Both are hitting peak efficiency around the same rpm range, so the drive train feels in unison with the car. I could see how the 2.0 would be a different experience since I’m sure you have to wring the fuck out of it to get the power and the CVT isn’t going to help make that feel great. If I had the 2.0L then I would definitely want the manual. For the base 1.5 I actually prefer the CVT.
 

gtman

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You touched on something most people don’t discuss and that’s understanding the CVT. It behaves differently than typical automatic. I cringe every time I see a review or something and the guy just mashes down the pedal and bitches about the CVT. Once you learn how to throttle the car, the CVT is typically happy to respond and over time the ECU gets used to your input. My car is always the first one out from a stop light even with light throttle. It wants to go all the time and I struggle to find anything to complain about.
So true. I guarantee the guy test driving a turbo Civic CVT the first time says " Weird transmission, sounds odd, feels odd". I mean, I was that guy. I didn't care for the CVT at first.

In time you learn the ins and outs and how to use the throttle. You can't just mash it off the line. Well you can, but it's not ideal. And yep, I'm always the first one scooting away from traffic at lights with just a light throttle.

I've gone from a CVT skeptic to someone who thinks Honda's done a really good job with this transmission.
 


bluebluemike

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I think the CVT benefits from powerband of the 1.5 Turbo. Both are hitting peak efficiency around the same rpm range, so the drive train feels in unison with the car. I could see how the 2.0 would be a different experience since I’m sure you have to wring the fuck out of it to get the power and the CVT isn’t going to help make that feel great. If I had the 2.0L then I would definitely want the manual. For the base 1.5 I actually prefer the CVT.
I agree with both you and gtman, I haven't test driven the turbo cars, but would assume they're nicer than the NA since they have a little more power and hold it there longer than a manual. I think especially with a tune the CVT would be pretty cool. The NA CVT just isn't peppy enough for any fun since they're already so underpowered, and the MT is the only way to get any fun out of the NA engines, especially if you don't have any mods.
 

Feddy_Ace

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Shaving off tenths of a second but losing a part of your soul.

If You have an option always choose a manual.
Never understood this sentiment. A manual doesn’t make a shitty car good nor does an automatic make a good car shitty. If the drivetrain works great, MT or AT, that’s all that matters. I don’t know why Americans act like a manual makes the car some unique experience. It’s a part of car culture I’ll never understand for the life of me.
 

gtman

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Never understood this sentiment. A manual doesn’t make a shitty car good nor does an automatic make a good car shitty. If the drivetrain works great, MT or AT, that’s all that matters. I don’t know why Americans act like a manual makes the car some unique experience. It’s a part of car culture I’ll never understand for the life of me.
Feddy, I know the sentiment of these manual guys. I drove manuals exclusively for over 25 years myself. The manual does require some skill and is certainly more rewarding. Still though, especially tuned, these CVT Civics can be pretty enjoyable.

Losing part of your soul? That's a bit dramatic.
 


bluebluemike

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Feddy, I know the sentiment of these manual guys. I drove manuals exclusively for over 25 years myself. The manual does require some skill and is certainly more rewarding. Still though, especially tuned, these CVT Civics can be pretty enjoyable.

Losing part of your soul? That's a bit dramatic.
I would say it's dramatic to say it's "losing part of your soul", but the experience with the manual vs the CVT is much more visceral and connected.
The CVT has it's purpose: efficiency, consistency, and smoothness. First and foremost the engineers designed the CVT to increase fuel economy, reduce the weird jolts and movements from conventional automatics, and create a more pleasant ride for the average consumer. This does NOT mean the CVT cannot be fun, but fun is an afterthought, and you can tell.
The MT has it's purpose: affordability and choice. The engineers designed the manual transmissions in our cars to be simple, cheap, and easy to fix/replace, with heavy attention to ergonomics and feel, which is why out of all the MT cars I've driven in similar price ranges - from Sentra to Genesis to 240SX's, the Civic MT is the best feeling transmission I've ever driven. Even my father who has owned exclusively MT for the past 30 years, from the AE86 to Mitsubishi Pajeros, and everything in between, tells me that this MT feels incredible. Maybe they meant to make it like that, maybe they didn't, but I know for a driver's car, Honda did very well with the 10th gen MT's. From base to flagship.
 

geeeek

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I had a 2015 r18 with cvt and while it was pretty responsive in S, it felt like the transmission wore down kind of fast. It was smooth and luxurious at first but as time went on it got sloppier with more jerks and hesitations. Still a fun car, but a 6mt (or did it come with 5mt?) would have been even more fun to beat on.
 

yansag1982

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I had a 2015 r18 with cvt and while it was pretty responsive in S, it felt like the transmission wore down kind of fast. It was smooth and luxurious at first but as time went on it got sloppier with more jerks and hesitations. Still a fun car, but a 6mt (or did it come with 5mt?) would have been even more fun to beat on.
The 9th gen was a 5 speed manual an it really wasn't great....especially for longer trips the engine would run above 3000rpm at highwY cruising speed...it was slow and sluggish too...not sure it the si was 5 or 6 speed.

That car to me always felt like it was missing a 6th gear...the 9th gen was and still is my least favorite civic to this day...it was like the 8th gen but shittier.
 

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I love automatic / cvt cars…. 8 out of 10 times you get less abused engine for cheaper price :p
 

BriteBlue

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I’ve owned more manual trans cars than automatics, however lately they’ve been automatics. Didn’t think I’d care for a CVT from everything I’ve read, but I’m OK with it.
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