Keyfob hacked....

tacthecat

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Always heard of it referred to as a "Relay" Attack, not Replay, but this has been happening and confirmed many times. In simple terms a thief, with the right electronics can "sniff" for, query, and capture your fob to car "unique" code anytime your fob is not in a faraday cage (bag etc). unsophisticated hackers need to be near you and the fob when you access the car but the more sophisticated ones can get the signal from anywhere within 50+ feet at anytime and then get your vehicle to respond. Not very common in the USA at the moment but Canada and Europe have been fighting this for years.

The only "good thing" from the article is it implies the '21- model year Civics have fixed this vulnerability.
 

tonton81

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Pass on hacking up the harness to put directed / viper gear in the car.
no need to hack OEM harness, T-harneses exist for plug&play remote start systems, check out idatastart. just hack the plug&play harness, the datasheet of the harness is included with pinouts.

everything is on the t-harness including power and the PTS button
 

Cornercarver

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Secondary defense systems might help. Things like an additional kill switch, or code reader needed to start the car, or steering wheel lock, etc. Just brainstorming. Open to ideas...
 


BriteBlue

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I’m not sure the fob is always transmitting a signal. I’ve seen comments that it does & that it doesn’t. Maybe it depends on the manufacturer. It would seem that would really wear down the battery quickly.

The way I understand it, thief #1 touches the door handle which sends out a signal. His device transmits the signal to thief #2 who in turn sends the signal inside the house or garage & hopes to activate the fob if within range.

Thief #2 picks up the fob’s coded signal using his device which in turn transmits it to thief #1 who is standing at the car. His device picks up the signal & sends it to the car to unlock the door & start the car. Once the car is started you don’t need a fob, just don’t turn off the engine.

If the fob is always sending a signal then thief #2 just needs to pick it up from the house & transmit it to thief #1 at the car.

Stealing Cars For 20 Bucks
https://hackaday.com/2017/04/27/stealing-cars-for-20-bucks/

Take a look at the video where the thieves use the relay attack method.



This demonstration shows the driver going into a café for a cup of coffee & his fob signal is relay attacked & car stolen in 30 seconds.
https://www.wired.com/2017/04/just-pair-11-radio-gadgets-can-steal-car/

Problem is that Honda does not let you disable the system.
 

tonton81

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I’m not sure the fob is always transmitting a signal. I’ve seen comments that it does & that it doesn’t. Maybe it depends on the manufacturer. It would seem that would really wear down the battery quickly.

The way I understand it, thief #1 touches the door handle which sends out a signal. His device transmits the signal to thief #2 who in turn sends the signal inside the house or garage & hopes to activate the fob if within range.

Thief #2 picks up the fob’s coded signal using his device which in turn transmits it to thief #1 who is standing at the car. His device picks up the signal & sends it to the car to unlock the door & start the car. Once the car is started you don’t need a fob, just don’t turn off the engine.

If the fob is always sending a signal then thief #2 just needs to pick it up from the house & transmit it to thief #1 at the car.

Stealing Cars For 20 Bucks
https://hackaday.com/2017/04/27/stealing-cars-for-20-bucks/

Take a look at the video where the thieves use the relay attack method.



This demonstration shows the driver going into a café for a cup of coffee & his fob signal is relay attacked & car stolen in 30 seconds.
https://www.wired.com/2017/04/just-pair-11-radio-gadgets-can-steal-car/

Problem is that Honda does not let you disable the system.
honda doesn't let you, but you can if you know how :)
 

civicdriver_

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If you wanna go old school, you could just take out a relay like a fuel injector relay when you leave your car. I doubt thieves will carry around a fuel injector relay in their pockets. Then when you get back to your car just pop the relay back in and you're good to go. It's not perfect since they can probably still get into your car but without the relay, they at least won't drive off with it.
 

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jtrader

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The article mentions Civic LX models being affected, but good luck stealing those without a key. Same for the pre-2020 Hatch Sport models. We're safe! :) (well...relatively speaking)
 


jabberwocker

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Secondary defense systems might help. Things like an additional kill switch, or code reader needed to start the car, or steering wheel lock, etc. Just brainstorming. Open to ideas...
Your secondary defense system is in your profile picture ;)
 

Doc_Mello

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BriteBlue

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How do Honda dealers & locksmiths program replacement Honda fobs?

There have been reported thefts on Dodges where the thief simply connects to the OBD2 port & programs a new fob & drives off. They use the same or similar hardware device that a shop uses. They break a window or sunroof, or use a glass cutter & remove the door glass & climb in never setting off the alarm.

Take a look how easy it is for a tow truck to pickup your vehicle.
 

GermanCivic

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Not very common in the USA at the moment but Canada and Europe have been fighting this for years.
Since you were talking about Europe, it seems as though as only the US models/trims are affected: LX, EX, EX-L, Touring, Si, Type R

We have S, comfort, elegance, executive, sport, sport plus, prestige and Type R. I wonder why they aren't affected.
 

tacthecat

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1) The hack is a theory (they call it proof-of-concept (PoC)) It "might" effect non-USA/NA vehicles including but not limited to Honda and Acura but the "hackers" only looked at this one data sub-set.
2) There's another related thread:
https://www.civicx.com/forum/thread...-is-very-concerning.74046/page-2#post-1127279 - see my post #20
3) The actuality in the USA is carjacking is the preferred method to acquire the vehicle/keys/and $$$. Otherwise most stolen vehicles are older models or taken from idiots who leave keys in the car, often running, and sometimes with kids in the backseat!
4) I'm unaware of any vehicles confirmed stolen in the USA using the relay or replay attack. There are several suspected steals but there are other explanations ("I know I locked it and took the keys"; autoshop clone of keyfob & key.)
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