Is the power on the 10th gen Civic SI enough?

VarmintCong

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taxi driver? Didn't know they existed anymore post Uber.
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RehabJP

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Have a 2020 Si and at times I am more than happy other times I find myself wanting more. I do not think I need more though. I mean the other day I was on the Freeway just cruising and I looked at the speedo and I was going over a buck in 6th gear and did not even realize it and it was almost effortless to get there. The gearing gives it a fair amount of acceleration. Well the gearing and it has really good power to weight the chassis is so light. That being said the Si has been at 205 Brake HP for the last few iterations without any upgrade to power output even when it was still VTEC pre Turbo days. They have changed the gearing, made 6th shorter, added a bit more torque but no bump to HP. The Si is a sport tuned Civic LX not that that is a bad thing.

I have inquired about getting a Type R and if the Dealership calls me back and they can get me the deal I want I may go for it only because I am looking to get into some Autocross and tracking my car as a weekend warrior. The CTR offers more raw power and has some more sport or "Race" ready kit standard like the Brembo front disks but really the difference is not huge. Dont get me wrong the CTR is in a Class of its own among Civics for sure but comparing apples to apples You get 139 stock top speed on the Si and 169 with he CTR. The big difference is the power at 205 V. 306 Brake HP so your getting more torque and acceleration but not as much more as most people would think.

Do I think the Si needs more HP in short.....Yes its time they bump hp the ponies a bit its been a long time coming and if you pay the extra for the Si (Sport Injected) that is what you want. Mo Powah Babey. Then again its nice to have a car that does 0-60 mph in under 7 seconds and can get 30 MPG in combined driving I am assuming they could tune the Si more aggressively out of the factory without sacrificing to much on the wear and tear at least enough and still not have to worry about it making it through factory warranty, maybe 230-250 hp, but that would cost on the economy for sure it would be drinking the gas and probably make the fuel dilution they have been fighting with the new turbos worse since most of the HP would come from ramping up the boost and dumping in a bunch more gas to get that power out of the same engine same thing the tuners are doing now aftermarket.
 
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VarmintCong

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Have a 2020 Si and at times I am more than happy other times I find myself wanting more. I do not think I need more though. I mean the other day I was on the Freeway just cruising and I looked at the speedo and I was going over a buck in 6th gear and did not even realize it and it was almost effortless to get there. The gearing gives it a fair amount of acceleration. Well the gearing and it has really good power to weight the chassis is so light. That being said the Si has been at 205 Brake HP for the last few iterations without any upgrade to power output even when it was still VTEC pre Turbo days. They have changed the gearing, made 6th shorter, added a bit more torque but no bump to HP. The Si is a sport tuned Civic LX not that that is a bad thing.

I have inquired about getting a Type R and if the Dealership calls me back and they can get me the deal I want I may go for it only because I am looking to get into some Autocross and tracking my car as a weekend warrior. The CTR offers more raw power and has some more sport or "Race" ready kit standard like the Brembo front disks but really the difference is not huge. Dont get me wrong the CTR is in a Class of its own among Civics for sure but comparing apples to apples You get 139 stock top speed on the Si and 169 with he CTR. The big difference is the power at 205 V. 306 Brake HP so your getting more torque and acceleration but not as much more as most people would think.

Do I think the Si needs more HP in short.....Yes its time they bump hp the ponies a bit its been a long time coming and if you pay the extra for the Si (Sport Injected) that is what you want. Mo Powah Babey. Then again its nice to have a car that does 0-60 mph in under 7 seconds and can get 30 MPG in combined driving I am assuming they could tune the Si more aggressively out of the factory without sacrificing to much on the wear and tear at least enough and still not have to worry about it making it through factory warranty, maybe 230-250 hp, but that would cost on the economy for sure it would be drinking the gas and probably make the fuel dilution they have been fighting with the new turbos worse since most of the HP would come from ramping up the boost and dumping in a bunch more gas to get that power out of the same engine same thing the tuners are doing now aftermarket.
Rather than tuning the 1.5T further, Honda should design a more efficient and cheaper 2.0T for use in the Si.
 

Gruber

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I actually chose the Si cause I needed a work commuter car, and the Sport hatch I had lacked an LSD for winter, LEDs for night-time driving (could hardly see anything with the halogen lights), lacked Carplay etc. So I actually bought it as a commuter car, rather than as a sports sedan. If the Sport or Touring hatch had an LSD and LEDs I'd have bought that instead.

Having said that, the GTI isn't more fun, just faster, and the better cars are all $5-10k more.
Hatch ST definitely has LEDs, I didn't know the Si's had them. So now you are only suffering a hatchless car for the LSD. :cool:
 

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Rather than tuning the 1.5T further, Honda should design a more efficient and cheaper 2.0T for use in the Si.
While that sounds good on paper, the reality is it won't happen for a number of reasons. First, look at the price point of the cars Honda sells with the 2.0T. Second, they probably won't invest in designing a de-tuned, more efficient engine for the Civic Si.

Remember, the Si was never meant to be the halo car the Type R is. It's always been the Sport Injected version of the economy Civic. Better looking, better handling and quicker than the other non-R models. But at a reasonable price point.

The current Si is a great handler. Check. Gets very good gas mileage. Check. Looks sporty. Check. Has plenty of power. Well that's the sticking point.

At it's price point, taking everything into consideration, it one helluva package. But yes, it could use a bit more oomph.

If Honda would re-tune the 1.5T a bit and go from 205hp/192tq to say, 225hp/220tq, I think they'd have a winner winner, chicken dinner. And our tuning survey shows that that level of power is certainly safe.
 


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I mean... they did design a fuel efficient 2.0t. Itā€™s a K20C4 that is tuned for 87 octane and gets 32 highway, does 0-60 in a mid-5, does a 1/4 mile in 14-flat and has an observed mid-30s in fuel economy in a heavier Accord which a Civic should meet or exceed. Even though the fuel economy numbers are lower... since the numbers are based on a regular vice premium recommendation which would cost about 20% less per gallon... fuel cost should actually be about the same.

We just didnā€™t get it. I refuse to believe the actual price difference in a L15B7 powertrain vs a K20C4 powertrain is actually substantially different. Itā€™s all a markup for more profit on the higher trim. If you compare the cost of one replacement motor to another... which I did a couple years back when the Accord were coming out... and other bits, like their turbos (C4s get a smaller turbo compared to a C1) then youā€™re probably within a grand or two. The only reason a K20C4-powered Civic need cost $30k is because thatā€™s what Honda would insist on charging for it. It should still compete with at the GTI at its present price point... itā€™s not like the GTI immediately costs $30k with its ā€˜bigā€™ 2.0 and turbo that, if memory serves, has or had a TD04-sized CHRA from the factory.
 

gtman

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... itā€™s not like the GTI immediately costs $30k with its ā€˜bigā€™ 2.0 and turbo that, if memory serves, has or had a TD04-sized CHRA from the factory.
A bare bones base S model with no options lists at nearly 30K with freight. Can't speak to the huge discount other members have mentioned as I haven't seen them at local dealers in Baltimore.

The mid level SE (model I'm interested in) starts at nearly 33K w/freight.
 
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Is it possible to get 280hp at the wheels With stock turbo on si?

What would FP, DP, exhaust, intake + tune get you at the wheels?
 

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I came from a 250 WHP Mazdaspeed3 and felt the Si's power out of the box was adequate. It's not a torque monster like the Mazda. But it's quick enough to be fun. My only real gripe is that the little 1.5T can be buzzy at higher RPMs.

We have enough of a user base now to know that adding a little extra power isn't going to wreck this motor - providing is driven responsibly. I'm at 60K, been tuned 25K, and feel this car is just about perfect. It's not the fastest car on the block. But it has just enough oomph to easily outrun the midrange sedans and SUVs that make up 80% of the cars on the road.

If power is your #1 goal, step up to a base WRX. Or save up for a CTR/Golf R. Otherwise you'll probably find the Si to be a good balance of comfort, practicality and fun. All without breaking the bank.
Phearable Stage 1.5 Civic Si>Base WRX
 

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A bare bones base S model with no options lists at nearly 30K with freight. Can't speak to the huge discount other members have mentioned as I haven't seen them at local dealers in Baltimore.

The mid level SE (model I'm interested in) starts at nearly 33K w/freight.
Wow... prices have gotten wild on them from when I have them a look a few years ago. I looked a few years back and their MSRP was 26k... invoice 25k-ish for a base. I know you had to pay a smidge more for a Sport trim that had a LSD... otherwise the base had an open. When I was looking they were still well south of 30k. Probably a Mk older than the present one. Used examples depreciated harshly just a couple years in.
 


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Wow... prices have gotten wild on them from when I have them a look a few years ago. I looked a few years back and their MSRP was 26k... invoice 25k-ish for a base. I know you had to pay a smidge more for a Sport trim that had a LSD... otherwise the base had an open. When I was looking they were still well south of 30k. Probably a Mk older than the present one. Used examples depreciated harshly just a couple years in.
This is the GTI SE setup I'd want, with just a couple hundred $$ in options. That's why I say the Si is one helluva bargain.

Honda Civic 10th gen Is the power on the 10th gen Civic SI enough? Screenshot_20200811-123937~2
 

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Rather than tuning the 1.5T further, Honda should design a more efficient and cheaper 2.0T for use in the Si.
They need to get those Ponies up on the Si trim for sure whatever they do. If they want the Si to be the compromise for the CTR its been kinda stagnant and Si badge is not as "prestigious" (for lack of a better term) as it was when they first launched. I mean yea its a good value an you do get some bonuses over the LX with the sport trim and slight increase to power but it would be nice if the Si was a true middle between the Civic LX and the CTR.

That is just how I feel I know others think the Si is the "Drivers' version of the Civic with the 6 speed manual and other creature comforts that do not come standard on other Civic trims and that if you want a sports car you should be looking at the Type R or maybe even something other than a Honda but when you see VW Golf and Veloster and other cars in the same price range with similar features and more power you would think Honda would want to step up their game.
 


 


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