How much is Too much power

gtman

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Some people just like working on cars for the hell of it. Personally, i wouldn't chase 400hp but i say go for it OP. As long as you're having fun doing it, that's all that matters. Its going to cost a lot and be a headache at times but who cares. If you enjoy doing it then do it :) And who gives a shit how much it costs.
I don't have an issue with anyone doing anything they want to their own car. I guess it's all a matter of who you are and where you are coming from. I guess I just tend to err on the side of caution to an extent because I've never had much money to spend. The reason I said spending tons of money trying to eek ultimate power out of these cars should be "left to the pros" was me imagining not just the expense of the build but the rebuild when it blows.
 

amirza786

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Some people just like working on cars for the hell of it. Personally, i wouldn't chase 400hp but i say go for it OP. As long as you're having fun doing it, that's all that matters. Its going to cost a lot and be a headache at times but who cares. If you enjoy doing it then do it :) And who gives a shit how much it costs. I believe there are people on this forum that paid 20k over msrp for a Honda and no one gives them shit about how much money they wasted.


This isnt targeted at you gtman, but i hate the "you could have got x car for the money you sank in y car". For the money he sinks into the more potent car making it his own he could have just got an even better car and so on and so forth. If everyone followed that rule, everyone would be driving stock middle of the road cars.
$20k over MSRP?? If in fact there is a person on this forum who did that, they should indeed rethink their life. I think you meant $2k ;)
 

amirza786

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Am i the only one that likes the process of modding more than the end result?. I just like taking stuff apart and putting it back together.
Haha I used to do that with my toys. Problem was, they never seemed to get put back together again...
 

Civic17siYAY

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Haha I used to do that with my toys. Problem was, they never seemed to get put back together again...
Haha half the fun is trying to figure out why you have a bin of "spare bolts" after putting it back together.

Also, i would be willing to bet that there are people on the forum that paid the absurd "market adjustment". Whether they are willing to admit it is a different story.

Ive been to multiple dealers in my area that refused to drop it at all which leads me to believe people are buying them at that price.
 


amirza786

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Haha half the fun is trying to figure out why you have a bin of "spare bolts" after putting it back together.

Also, i would be willing to bet that there are people on the forum that paid the absurd "market adjustment". Whether they are willing to admit it is a different story.

I've been to multiple dealers in my area that refused to drop it at all which leads me to believe people are buying them at that price.
Yeah, I've been there with the "spare bolts" LOL. I know what you mean about getting taken by dealers, it usually happens to people who are new to buying a car or are desperate to get into a new one. The secret...figure out what the invoice is, or at least the closest to invoice, wait till the new models are coming out (if are buying a 2020, wait till the 2021 models are coming out), and never negotiate in person, at least when you are making the final deal. I always test drive the car, then I tell the dealer I will negotiate only thru email. Be ready to wait, and walk away if needed. Takes patience and lots of self control. I learned this the hard way by being fleeced buying my first new car in 1994. Paid $1000 over invoice and 11 percent financing.

But the best option is actually picking up a 3 to 5 years old, that way someone else pays for the depreciation
 

Civic17siYAY

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Yeah, I've been there with the "spare bolts" LOL. I know what you mean about getting taken by dealers, it usually happens to people who are new to buying a car or are desperate to get into a new one. The secret...figure out what the invoice is, or at least the closest to invoice, wait till the new models are coming out (if are buying a 2020, wait till the 2021 models are coming out), and never negotiate in person, at least when you are making the final deal. I always test drive the car, then I tell the dealer I will negotiate only thru email. Be ready to wait, and walk away if needed. Takes patience and lots of self control. I learned this the hard way by being fleeced buying my first new car in 1994. Paid $1000 over invoice and 11 percent financing.

But the best option is actually picking up a 3 to 5 years old, that way someone else pays for the depreciation
The negotiations via email is key. I was doing that with a supra i was interested in and it made it so much easier.
 

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I don't have an issue with anyone doing anything they want to their own car. I guess it's all a matter of who you are and where you are coming from. I guess I just tend to err on the side of caution to an extent because I've never had much money to spend. The reason I said spending tons of money trying to eek ultimate power out of these cars should be "left to the pros" was me imagining not just the expense of the build but the rebuild when it blows.
I've already been put into the Anti-tuning, hater box by some members for voicing caution on going to far in the quest for power. It's funny because I was also put into the hater category by the Anti-tuning crowd for promoting safely tuning with Ktuner/Hondata. You can't win em all. I have plenty of room for you on the bench next to me!
 

gtman

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Well you know I'm one of the biggest proponents of tuning in terms of the performance/driveability improvements it makes with our cars. But, once you inch into too much power it becomes a bit more murky.

Tuning for moderate gains (TSP Stage 1) = amazing and relatively safe

Tuning for ultimate power = all bets are off
 
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Gruber

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To me the limit is when you would rather not drive the modded car to the airport, or for a job interview, because it can blow up literally at any moment....
When it really becomes not the matter of smart ignition timing, ethanol/methanol mixtures etc. but pure and primitive material failure limit issue, of which most tuners have no real grasp.
Still, I like reading about extreme mods. Testing "when it will break" is pure fun. Like this guy asking the valid question: "How strong are these bench vises?" It's fun to watch, otherwise he wouldn't have made a video.

 


amirza786

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To me the limit is when you would rather not drive the modded car to the airport, or for a job interview, because it can blow up literally at any moment....
When it really becomes not the matter of smart ignition timing, ethanol/methanol mixtures etc. but pure and primitive material failure limit issue, of which most tuners have no real grasp.
Still, I like reading about extreme mods. Testing "when it will break" is pure fun. Like this guy asking the valid question: "How strong are these bench vises?" It's fun to watch, otherwise he wouldn't have made a video.

To be honest with you, I love to see engines (among other things!) taken to their limits and the end results. Just not my engine! On this topic, there was a program called "Cash for Clunkers" where they were giving credit towards trading in an older car, and there were tons of YouTube videos where they would drain the oil and run it to see how long it would take to explode. There was an old Toyota truck that kept running...while it was on fire!
 

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There was a vid years ago of an old ef honda they drained the oil out of/added water/sand to the crankcase. Ran open header with bananas in the exhaust ports. All while bouncing the rev limiter for literally around 15 minutes. It would get hot and lock up while they still had it floored. Bucket of water was thrown on it and started back up right back to the rev limiter. Over and over.

Really was a testament to Honda for me when I was young.
 

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There was a vid years ago of an old ef honda they drained the oil out of/added water/sand to the crankcase. Ran open header with bananas in the exhaust ports. All while bouncing the rev limiter for literally around 15 minutes. It would get hot and lock up while they still had it floored. Bucket of water was thrown on it and started back up right back to the rev limiter. Over and over.

Really was a testament to Honda for me when I was young.
I remember seeing that video. It was incredible how much abuse that motor took.
 

amirza786

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There was a vid years ago of an old ef honda they drained the oil out of/added water/sand to the crankcase. Ran open header with bananas in the exhaust ports. All while bouncing the rev limiter for literally around 15 minutes. It would get hot and lock up while they still had it floored. Bucket of water was thrown on it and started back up right back to the rev limiter. Over and over.

Really was a testament to Honda for me when I was young.
I love the Youtubes. Hours and hours of mindless entertaining videos. From people putting cooking oil in engines to blowing stuff up in Microwaves
 

StevenGregory

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Because of the weight of the car and fwd, power delivery to early and too fast will result in excessive wheel spin and torque steer, that's why these tunes are designed to deliver power in a more linear fashion. Even the CTR is a bit slow off the line and becomes a beast between 3k all the way to 7k where it's a monster. That's kind of the reason why a tuned Civic (Si and non Si) do well from a roll, but have a hard time 0 to 60 better than 6.3
That and the fact that (at least on my car running 27 PSI per the gauge), there's no performance gained by revving 2nd gear past 60 MPH or shifting before 60 MPH. On the one hand, torque drops off; on the other, you've lost time with a shift.
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