Homemade Hondata "+7.5" tune for the CVT

gtman

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Ok experts. Here's what I did (I have the CARB Flashpro so tuning options are limited). I basically increased the boost at 2750 rpm and up by 7%. I upped the torque limit by by 25nm in the meat of the powerband (4000-6000 rpm)... Then I did a long datalog.

The highest boost I saw on the drive was 23.3 psi at WOT when I finally really opened it up. I was seeing more like 20- 21 psi with heavy throttle (not quite WOT). By comparison, my WOT peak number was 20.7 psi with the base +6 and with heavy throttle (not WOT) I was seeing more like 18-19psi. So this tune is a nice increase

I tried to upload the datalog here but the file was too large. You can download it here:
http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=71574462424668514591

By the seat of the pants it feels quicker but nothing drastic over the base +6. Do you think it's worth keeping these settings or am I better off with the base +6 from a durability standpoint? My knock control stayed at .54 most of the time. 93 octane.
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Although I didn't download the datalog, in general what you did is fine, although it is *possible* you'll see increased wear on your CVT unit. Keep in mind the 25nm increase is really what matters here, since that will limit the total power regardless of boost level. In my opinion, the default torque limits are a bit on the conservative side, but it also does depend on how you drive the car (if you drive for extended periods in hot weather with your foot on the throttle, it could cause CVT overheating). You knock control levels are certainly fine if they are hovering around .54.

If you want to be a bit on the safer side, you could increase the torque limits only higher in the RPM range, such as around 4000+ RPMs. This puts slightly less strain on the CVT unit.
 
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gtman

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You can see I raised the torque limit just a bit from 2500-3000 rpm. Raised it to 270 nm at 3500 rpm. Then upped it to 275 nm from 4000 to 6000 rpm. And tapered it off slightly above 6000 rpm. It seems to give me a bit more driveability at lower RPM driving it easy and a bit more boost higher up when I push it.

MPG's seem pretty much the same as with the base +6.

Honda Civic 10th gen Homemade Hondata "+7.5" tune for the CVT torque


On the TC Max Pressure table my highest boost is at 5500 rpm and is a bit over 22psi (22.17). By comparison, the base +6 maxes out a little under 20 psi (19.94) at 5500rpm.
 
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gtman

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Yep. The CARB version lets you edit the boost and torque tables.
 


LilToTo17

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Although I didn't download the datalog, in general what you did is fine, although it is *possible* you'll see increased wear on your CVT unit. Keep in mind the 25nm increase is really what matters here, since that will limit the total power regardless of boost level. In my opinion, the default torque limits are a bit on the conservative side, but it also does depend on how you drive the car (if you drive for extended periods in hot weather with your foot on the throttle, it could cause CVT overheating). You knock control levels are certainly fine if they are hovering around .54.

If you want to be a bit on the safer side, you could increase the torque limits only higher in the RPM range, such as around 4000+ RPMs. This puts slightly less strain on the CVT unit.
Temps are pretty high based on reviewing the datalog
 

charleswrivers

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I think that if you look at the dynos from a MT car, you're able to get a good idea what engine torque is through the set gearing. From there, you can see where engine torque diminishes. If there are concerns about CVT longevity, I'd start ramping boost past the torque taper looking at the +6 map... to fill it in a bit better. Below that, well... you're kind of on your own, as you're adding torque were the peak already existed and just making it more pronounced.

For what I see on the Vitblog, between some SI dynos which will be a *little* to the right and some non-Sis... I'd be setting higher targets past 4000.

My opinion for longevity would be to have your taper up start a bit later than the 2500 you have... and only try to bump boost up past 4000 where torque is tapering to try to hold it flat and increase peak power a smidge. It would likely not be as noticable of a bump as what you have however partial throttle and would only help you at WOT. This is just my opinion and the early recommendation from Hondata on +6 maps for CVTs. I don't know if that's still their recommendation or has been recended since I last read about it.

While I'm on Ktuner, not Hondata and it's a little different, I've done similar adjustments on my end but am more conservative to boost under 4000 RPM, limiting boost to 21# to minimize engine stress and prevent clutch slippage. I just adjust boost targets and not a torque table. I compared the 21 and 23 basemaps and decided I liked 21s 4000 and down and liked 23s 4000 and up and blended them. The difference isn't large, save ~25 ft-lbs of excessive torque spike in a relatively small window I didn't care for. I did want the torque to try and carry a bit further to bump peak power however.

I'm pretty conservative though... and if you're able to monitor your CVT temps... you may be ok. Temps doesn't equal belt wear however... but can be indicative if thats going on inside. I can change the belt in my go kart in under 30 minutes for about $10... and I keep a spare on hand. I don't know how in the world you'd do a simple/cheap swap on an automotive unit.

So far as WOT is concerned, delaying you torque increase would still provide the same bump in power without actually increasing peak torque... only carrying it a bit further.
 
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gtman

gtman

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First of all I never floor my car from a standing start or launch it. That's a CVT KILLER. The reason I gave it a tiny boost 2500 to 3000 is for improved part throttle response for my suburban driving at medium speed. If you drove in Baltimore you'd understand why I need that. Lol

So far I'm loving this new tune. There's a bit more passing power on the highway too. I don't drive my car hard so I think this will work.
 

charleswrivers

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First of all I never floor my car from a standing start or launch it. That's a CVT KILLER. The reason I gave it a tiny boost 2500 to 3000 is for improved part throttle response for my suburban driving at medium speed. If you drove in Baltimore you'd understand why I need that. Lol

So far I'm loving this new tune. There's a bit more passing power on the highway too. I don't drive my car hard so I think this will work.
Sounds good... and I've driven through Baltimore a time or ten, though just passing through so I got ya.

If you're happy with it and you've got restraint with your foot where you think it's appropriate, then I'm sure it's fine.

My limiting boost they way I do is partly because I'm not the primary driver of the Civic and the old lady has a heavy foot.
 
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gtman

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I wound up lowering the psi and torque a bit below 3500rpm just to be on the safer side.
 


charleswrivers

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I wound up lowering the psi and torque a bit below 3500rpm just to be on the safer side.
Sounds prudent. On the flip side, you can always see if a little more boost up top gives you more at WOT. I don't have first hand CVT experience in a Civic... but at whatever your revs lock at at WOT... maybe see about adjusting boost in that range. I assume it's something around 6000-6500 RPM... which is waaay past peak torque. At a certain point, you'll hit diminishing returns with your turbo/intercooler combo... with pushing effective the same mass of air, hotter and less dense at a higher pressure. You oughta be able to see that on K.control and IATs. When you find that point, you're stuck there in the summer months. On the flip side, you should have room to add a pound or two in the winter, where the cooler air, both going into the engine directly and acting on your intercooler will give a smidge more room. I bumped up my ignition timing... though I'm not sure if you can do that on a CARB Hondata. It provided a small but noticable bump in power up top without pushing the turbo too hard. We're having some hot days down here in GA lately and all of these bumps in boost many of us are doing on stock turbo/intercoolers are likely going to feel a bit less than what they had a few months back.

My Z feels *very* different summer vs winter. It feels fast but nothing amazing in the summer. In the winter, it feels downright dangerously fast. I have a new set of intercoolers that I haven't installed in *months* I have to get off my lazy butt and install but... between work, trying to finish my degree... random hobbies and needed projects... they're still sitting in the box.
 
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gtman

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Great info Charles but I just went back to the base +6 tune. I was getting a bit more power with my custom tune but not really much more than the base +6. Plus the base tune just felt smoother. And I decided the potential added stress wasn't worth it. You can only adjust the basics on the CARB Flashpro and down the road I'm thinking of going Ktuner V2 anyway.:)
 

mugenx78

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@gtman and @procivic thanks for all the help with the Hondata Flash Pro. My 2016 EX-L finally has balls. I raced a stock 2017 SI and a 2017 VW TDI and edged them both out on different occasions. When I met them at the next light they both said “how?” And asked if my car was stock .
 

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You can only adjust the basics on the CARB Flashpro and down the road I'm thinking of going Ktuner V2 anyway.:)
KTuner V2? Welcome to the dark side!!! Lol

Jokes aside, would be interested to know the reason for the potential switch? Had mulled over the two at the beginning and went with KTuner based on its overall popularity (at least here in the forums) and Vit's recommendation since I was after a custom tune from him.
 

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I've been running your torque limit setting for about 2 weeks. Seems good so far. Only down side is I'm averaging 30mpg. Perhaps I need to try hondata mode.
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