Help me decide--2019 CTR or 2018 M2?

drledford93

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(Accidentally posted this in the wrong forum before...)

Help me decide between these two. Coming from a 2018 Focus RS (God rest her soul) that was tremendous fun. FWIW, this will be my DD and possibly see some track or autox time.

I test drove the CTR yesterday. Fast, tossable, great steering and transmission. It feels, in a straight line, like my RS (380 bhp) and former Mazdaspeed 3 (350 bhp). Much more stable in cornering than my MS3 (less US), not as loose as the RS. When driven aggressively, I was able to elicit quite a bit of wheelspin on corner exit once the boot came on just north of 3k rpm. Right or wrong, this put the idea in the back of my head that it will be a similar experience to my MS3, less the torque steer.

There are a couple of things that bother me and I need some input from you guys about. The first is no on-throttle oversteer. I understand this is a FWD car and it's inherent in the system. But, I'm really afraid I'll miss it. Are there other attributes to the CTR that will make up for this? The RS had a huge amount of it and the M2 does too, of course.

Next is the waiting and waiting to get the power down. Again this is typical of FWD cars. It's my main drawback to this car. When I raced, I learned to and loved to get on the throttle early and drive the car through a corner, turning the car as I needed with my right foot. Yes, this can be done with a FWD but not in the same way.

I see that the CTR has done pretty well in National-level SCCA autox events. That says a lot about it's ability to change direction and get a good amount of power down, being FWD.

So, I'm torn. Help me decide by giving me input from you, as owners. For you guys that have driven both RWD/AWD (that tends towards OS) and FWD, how do you rate the fun factor? Were you to do it over again, would you buy the CTR again? Something else?
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NapalmEnema

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I own a Type R and an M2 1/150 performance editions -

Get the Type R - it's just as fun if not more so in most situations - and has function -also maintenance cheaper and a lot of things you can do yourself.

I have both, and love both - apples and oranges - but if I had to get one or the other - I'd keep the Type R anyday.

Good luck with your choice!
 

Tev42

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The CTR is much more functional as a daily driver. I am planning on picking up an M2 comp in a few years as my fun car but I will still use the civic as a daily driver.
 
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drledford93

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Why would you not daily your M2? This will be our 2nd car, not a primary people/kid hauler. That's what the C43 is for...:D
 


Tev42

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Why would you not daily your M2? This will be our 2nd car, not a primary people/kid hauler. That's what the C43 is for...:D
Civic is cheaper to maintain, better fuel economy, carries more people/things. It does all of these things without compromising a fun driving experience, the perfect middle ground between practicality and performance. If this next purchase for you is not a primary car then that is a different situation. I am opting for the CTR daily and M2 as a secondary car, sounds like you are opting for the C43 daily and CTR/M2 secondary. I would not really evaluate the CTR and M2 against one another so it is difficult for me to argue one over the other in your situation.
 
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drledford93

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The c43 is the wife's car. I used to do a lot of racing years ago, so I love to drive and put my cars through their paces,getting the most I legally can on the street. I don't want something like my former MS3, which the CTR is. VASTLY refined version of. That's what I'm facing. Hopefully that clears things up.

IOW, this will be MY DD and I truly don't care about practicality and comfort. It does need 4 seats, which is why I've narrowed it to the M2 and CTR. I'm just a bit afraid of the monotony of FWD cars--understeer, understeer, understeer. Yick.
 
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Salespunk

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CTR is more fun day to day and more useable on the street. Also has a functional back seat as well.

I understand your concern about RWD vs FWD since I came from an M4 and also currently own a new M5. On public roads the CTR is just as quick/fast on back roads as either of them anywhere except long straights. It is way more fun than both.
 
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drledford93

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CTR is more fun day to day and more useable on the street. Also has a functional back seat as well.

I understand your concern about RWD vs FWD since I came from an M4 and also currently own a new M5. On public roads the CTR is just as quick/fast on back roads as either of them anywhere except long straights. It is way more fun than both.
Interesting take. I really appreciate your time. It's a little apples to oranges in the CTR/M4 comparison but what is the understeer like, head to head? What about having to wait to get into the throttle in the CTR vs M4 or other RWD cars?
 


Lust

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When I first bought the car it didn’t feel like it was FWD at all. Cost of consumables on the CTR will be much less than the M2 and provide just as fun of a driving experience IMO. CTR wins for me as it’s the perfect dual duty car. Tons of practically and great performance with growing after market
 

NapalmEnema

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Why would you not daily your M2? This will be our 2nd car, not a primary people/kid hauler. That's what the C43 is for...:D
I dailied it for two years before getting the Type - R - it's a wonderful car - like the German's perfect version of a Mustang
 

Salespunk

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Interesting take. I really appreciate your time. It's a little apples to oranges in the CTR/M4 comparison but what is the understeer like, head to head? What about having to wait to get into the throttle in the CTR vs M4 or other RWD cars?
The CTR is incredibly balanced, I can get mine to step the rear end out with lift throttle oversteer. Obviously power on oversteer is not an option, but power on understeer is only at the very tip of the limits. There is less understeer on power compared to my M4 as an example.

One thing that is more relevant is the amount of throttle you can use on the street. In the BMW's you cannot mat the throttle for more than a second or two at a time. There is simply too much power and the speeds get crazy very quickly. As an example in the M5 you are guaranteed to be well into 3 digit speeds even on very short straights. If things were to go wrong they would go VERY WRONG VERY QUICKLY. Compare that to the CTR where you may approach 3 digit speeds on those short straights, but you are not hitting 130+.
 
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drledford93

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Thank you so much for that comparison. That gives me a reference point I was missing. Do you think it is all down to the Max Perf Summer tires? Or, is it the overall handling, as evidenced by similar handling on all seasons/winter tires?
 

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(Accidentally posted this in the wrong forum before...)

Help me decide between these two. Coming from a 2018 Focus RS (God rest her soul) that was tremendous fun. FWIW, this will be my DD and possibly see some track or autox time.

I test drove the CTR yesterday. Fast, tossable, great steering and transmission. It feels, in a straight line, like my RS (380 bhp) and former Mazdaspeed 3 (350 bhp). Much more stable in cornering than my MS3 (less US), not as loose as the RS. When driven aggressively, I was able to elicit quite a bit of wheelspin on corner exit once the boot came on just north of 3k rpm. Right or wrong, this put the idea in the back of my head that it will be a similar experience to my MS3, less the torque steer.

There are a couple of things that bother me and I need some input from you guys about. The first is no on-throttle oversteer. I understand this is a FWD car and it's inherent in the system. But, I'm really afraid I'll miss it. Are there other attributes to the CTR that will make up for this? The RS had a huge amount of it and the M2 does too, of course.

Next is the waiting and waiting to get the power down. Again this is typical of FWD cars. It's my main drawback to this car. When I raced, I learned to and loved to get on the throttle early and drive the car through a corner, turning the car as I needed with my right foot. Yes, this can be done with a FWD but not in the same way.

I see that the CTR has done pretty well in National-level SCCA autox events. That says a lot about it's ability to change direction and get a good amount of power down, being FWD.

So, I'm torn. Help me decide by giving me input from you, as owners. For you guys that have driven both RWD/AWD (that tends towards OS) and FWD, how do you rate the fun factor? Were you to do it over again, would you buy the CTR again? Something else?
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