Full support vs BETA full support - Trying to understand the difference

[Prozento]

Hello pals

From the moment I bought the Ktuner unit there is one thing that always makes me confused. Maybe someone here will be able to make it simple for me.

When I first plugged in my Ktuner to the car I got 2 sets of tunes:
- Normal version of Ktuner package (St1, St2, Starter 21/18/16.5, factory calibration and 21 Dual Eco)
- Beta version of Ktuner package tunes (Same as first)

The only difference between them was - the NORMAL package had only initial support while the BETA version had all the options opened.

At this moment I thought Its simple - The full version of future "normal" package is still not ready and Ktuner published the BETA version just to collect all the data needed to provide full support later. BETA version could have some issues since this is the BETA version.

But this wasn't the case...
*The main reason for thinking like that was that I found small differences between the packages like different boost tables, AFR tables, different car behavior, and few issues like unbearable jerking on low gears (after his January fix).

After few times of emailing to Ktuner I understood from his answers that the BETA version is the full and max support I will ever get.

This is the moment when I got fully confused. If I will sum it up:

My full support version called "BETA" version (that has some issues) and on the Ktuner website I have the "*" meaning I don't have the full support. For fun(?) I have some initial support version (NORMAL) that works better but has almost no options to choose.

Make sense? Not for me. Maybe someone here will be able to put a light on this.

The logical questions that coming out from this are:
1. Why not to delete the initial "normal" package if the BETA is full support? Just not to confuse people.
2. Why there are differences between them?
3. If the BETA has some issues while the NORMAL package doesn't, why not to publish full version for the NORMAL package?
4. Why does the website keep telling me that I have no full support while Ktuner sais I do?


Thanks for reading and I will really appreciate any reply
Sincerely
Prozento

PS:
Another peace of information -
http://www.ktuner.com/KTunerHelp/version_history.htm

There are 3 types of support if you look on this page:.

Beta Full Support For 5AF-....
Full Support Added For .....
Initial Support Added For 5AG ....

and again, what is the difference between BETA and FULL support?

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[boe921]

you are lucky tt your ecu has beta version and you can find your ecu number with '' * '' this. because my ecu is not listed in ktuner site also has no full support for more than 2 years. try to be content and happy with what you have.

When you look carefully at the ecu list on the ktuner site, you will see that the * sign is only on the international ecu list. it won't take you much time to realize that all nort america ecu have full support.

In short, I think it should happy when there are users who cannot get full support until they sell their cars.

 

[Prozento]

you are lucky tt your ecu has beta version and you can find your ecu number with '' * '' this. because my ecu is not listed in ktuner site also has no full support for more than 2 years. try to be content and happy with what you have.

When you look carefully at the ecu list on the ktuner site, you will see that the * sign is only on the international ecu list. it won't take you much time to realize that all nort america ecu have full support.

In short, I think it should happy when there are users who cannot get full support until they sell their cars.

Thanks for the reply
I never told I am not happy with Ktuner. This is great product.
I am just trying to understand this specific case and the roots of the differences between 2 versions.

 

[CAPTS]

i am doing testing & giving KTuner feedbacks as an authorised dealer.
sadly honda have so many ecu versions so i'm testing them out & give feedbacks to Ktuner so they will know if the functions are working properly before they publish it as full support especially int'l versions me thinks.

 

[Prozento]

i am doing testing & giving KTuner feedbacks as an authorised dealer.
sadly honda have so many ecu versions so i'm testing them out & give feedbacks to Ktuner so they will know if the functions are working properly before they publish it as full support especially int'l versions me thinks.

Thanks for the reply

What I can't understand is why there is a difference between my BETA version and NONBETA version.
Beta - supposed to be some unfinished version of the full version. Thus, I thought that the NONBETA version is the one that already done and checked 100% (and this is why no all options opened for it) while the BETA has all the options but not all of them were already checked and tested for this specific ECU.

BUT...

This is not the case - Ktuner said that the BETA version is my full version and since there is a difference between BETA and NONBETA versions (Boost tables, AFR tables, car behavior, etc) my first theory felt. From some testing Ktuner said that the base code is different too.

And this made me even more confused since why one ECU gets 2 tunes from different code bases.


Further I go I get only more confused and in the end, it supposed to be simple.

My ECU is the 5AN-E32.


PS:
Another peace of information -
http://www.ktuner.com/KTunerHelp/version_history.htm

There are 3 types of support if you look on this page:.

Beta Full Support For 5AF-....
Full Support Added For .....
Initial Support Added For 5AG ....

and again, what is the difference between BETA and FULL support?

 

[Linszter]

Thanks for the reply

What I can't understand is why there is a difference between my BETA version and NONBETA version.
Beta - supposed to be some unfinished version of the full version. Thus, I thought that the NONBETA version is the one that already done and checked 100% (and this is why no all options opened for it) while the BETA has all the options but not all of them were already checked and tested for this specific ECU.

BUT...

This is not the case - Ktuner said that the BETA version is my full version and since there is a difference between BETA and NONBETA versions (Boost tables, AFR tables, car behavior, etc) my first theory felt. From some testing Ktuner said that the base code is different too.

And this made me even more confused since why one ECU gets 2 tunes from different code bases.


Further I go I get only more confused and in the end, it supposed to be simple.

My ECU is the 5AN-E32.


PS:
Another peace of information -
http://www.ktuner.com/KTunerHelp/version_history.htm

There are 3 types of support if you look on this page:.

Beta Full Support For 5AF-....
Full Support Added For .....
Initial Support Added For 5AG ....

and again, what is the difference between BETA and FULL support?

Full support has custom basecode what's needed to have all the features. On some 5AN-EXX ECU the Beta version has the "Full Support", but it's currently in Beta, because someone reported that the Start/Stop wasn't worked with that version. I tuned several 5AN-E2X with Beta and never had any Start/Stop issue. You can just try the Beta version. If the Start/Stop function works fine then you are good to go. If your Start/Stop not working you can decide to use it that way, or go back to the non-Beta version.

 

[Prozento]

Full support has custom basecode what's needed to have all the features. On some 5AN-EXX ECU the Beta version has the "Full Support", but it's currently in Beta, because someone reported that the Start/Stop wasn't worked with that version. I tuned several 5AN-E2X with Beta and never had any Start/Stop issue. You can just try the Beta version. If the Start/Stop function works fine then you are good to go. If your Start/Stop not working you can decide to use it that way, or go back to the non-Beta version.

Thanks for the reply
The start stop indeed doesnt work if I not disable the U129e error. On other hand this is not what bothers me.
On BETA version the car just feels very jerky in some situations, while always perfect in NONBETA. Ktuner once took my logs and made me fixed tune but even that it became much better, still in some situations it's unbearable. Thus, after giving it almost 2 month, today I am going back to initial NONBETA support version.

So from what you say, in the end Ktuner will publish Full Support for the NONBETA too? This is not what he told via emails (or maybe I didn't understand his answer)

PS: I was one of these guys that reported about start/stop error.

 

[Linszter]

Thanks for the reply
The start stop indeed doesnt work if I not disable the U129e error. On other hand this is not what bothers me.
On BETA version the car just feels very jerky in some situations, while always perfect in NONBETA. Ktuner once took my logs and made me fixed tune but even that it became much better, still in some situations it's unbearable. Thus, after giving it almost 2 month, today I am going back to initial NONBETA support version.

So from what you say, in the end Ktuner will publish Full Support for the NONBETA too? This is not what he told via emails (or maybe I didn't understand his answer)

PS: I was one of these guys that reported about start/stop error.

I don't know what will be with the Beta vs Non-Beta. What I know that I made several test on 5AN-E2X which is the same basecode and never had any issue.

 

[Prozento]

I don't know what will be with the Beta vs Non-Beta. What I know that I made several test on 5AN-E2X which is the same basecode and never had any issue.

I had a long conversation with Ktuner about my BETA and NONBETA version. In the end, we came to the conclusion that they made on different base code. This explains of crouse the difference in car behavior and other differences.
I guess the BETA version based on a basecode that not suits my ECU while the initial support version does. At least it looks so.
Unfortunately the main cons of the initial version is of course lack of options to choose, its almost empty .


PS: After going back to initial support version I found an interesting difference

Today when I flashed initial support version and checked the "Tools -> Ktuner unit info" I could see that under software version I have this number: 37805-5AN-E320
When I did the same check on the BETA version before it wrote 37805-5AN-E330.
Maybe different base codes were used for ...-E320 (initial) and ...-E330(BETA)? and this is the main problem?

 

[amyisquiet]

Yes, he uses different base codes, and has the same problem on 5AF-H1X BATE version. The maintenance mileage will become 19000km, and the closed loop will be maintained under full throttle load.
As for the very very jerky you said, you can compare the difference between the Bate version and the normal version of the DWB map

 

[Linszter]

I had a long conversation with Ktuner about my BETA and NONBETA version. In the end, we came to the conclusion that they made on different base code. This explains of crouse the difference in car behavior and other differences.
I guess the BETA version based on a basecode that not suits my ECU while the initial support version does. At least it looks so.
Unfortunately the main cons of the initial version is of course lack of options to choose, its almost empty .


PS: After going back to initial support version I found an interesting difference

Today when I flashed initial support version and checked the "Tools -> Ktuner unit info" I could see that under software version I have this number: 37805-5AN-E320
When I did the same check on the BETA version before it wrote 37805-5AN-E330.
Maybe different base codes were used for ...-E320 (initial) and ...-E330(BETA)? and this is the main problem?

I can't answer your questions. What I know that E2X is the same basecode as E3X and both Initial and Beta works fine on several cars. Once I can get an E3X I can test it.

 

[Prozento]

I can't answer your questions. What I know that E2X is the same basecode as E3X and both Initial and Beta works fine on several cars. Once I can get an E3X I can test it.

Is there any way I can help you with that?

 

[Linszter]

Is there any way I can help you with that?

I don't think so

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