Fender rubbing with bigger tires - need stiffer springs, roll fenders, or what?

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
I have a 2018 Civic Si and recently (finally) replaced the OEM rims/wheels with 255/40R18 Michelin Pilot tires on an 18x8.5 35offset rim. The result looks great! (Attached photo.) However, now I'm noticing fender rubbing when I hit bumps at speed. It's unsettling. I thought there was plenty of clearance still even though the original tires were 235/40R18.

I see that some people do fender rolling, but I don't like the idea of bending metal on the fender and not even knowing if it's going to be enough while also creating an entry point for rust with a chance of crack paint (no matter how careful you are with a heat gun). I'm surprised by the amount of travel of the wheel (it looks tight in the photo, but there are actually several inches there), so I'm wondering if I could just get firmer springs?

I know the wheels stick out ever so slightly (that's part of the look that I like), so that actually might be more the reason for the rubbing than the taller height, since the top of the fender normally would never have touched the wheel if the wheel stayed deeper in the wheel well.

IMG_3294.jpeg
Advertisement

 

AlphaDigital

Senior Member
First Name
Alex
Joined
May 21, 2020
Messages
927
Reaction score
1,093
Location
MN
Car(s)
civic
Country flag
IMO, youre running too much sidewall, these cars really need just a 255-35 or 265-35. In the 265 size, I know Michelin Pilot Sport 4s are already really beefy as it is, adding more sidewall to that with a lowered car is asking for rubbing.

Your options are fender rolling, bending the tab, changing your suspension, or wheel/offset to accommodate the bigger tire.

I know IL can have shitty roads, especially Cicero where dodging potholes was plain stupid. Having that extra sidewall is nice for those situations , but the trade off is unfortunately the rubbing.
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
Thanks @AlphaDigital.

Just as a clarification on my initial post -- my car is not lowered at all, this is the original suspension. Regardless, I get your point, there isn't enough room there for the additional sidewall.

When you mention changing the suspension, what exactly do you mean? Making it stiffer? Adding some more height? Both?
 

AlphaDigital

Senior Member
First Name
Alex
Joined
May 21, 2020
Messages
927
Reaction score
1,093
Location
MN
Car(s)
civic
Country flag
Thanks @AlphaDigital.

Just as a clarification on my initial post -- my car is not lowered at all, this is the original suspension. Regardless, I get your point, there isn't enough room there for the additional sidewall.

When you mention changing the suspension, what exactly do you mean? Making it stiffer? Adding some more height? Both?
Sorry, I thought you were lowered but you might need to play around with ride height, camber, and stiffness to try and make it work. Coilovers, camber kit, etc.
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
Sorry, I thought you were lowered but you might need to play around with ride height, camber, and stiffness to try and make it work. Coilovers, camber kit, etc.
Isn’t there any way to figure out what to change without buying a lot of parts I might not need? I have about two finger widths of space there and I see other cars with fractions of an inch there, so I assume they just made it much stiffer to reduce the vertical range of travel.
 

AlphaDigital

Senior Member
First Name
Alex
Joined
May 21, 2020
Messages
927
Reaction score
1,093
Location
MN
Car(s)
civic
Country flag
Isn’t there any way to figure out what to change without buying a lot of parts I might not need? I have about two finger widths of space there and I see other cars with fractions of an inch there, so I assume they just made it much stiffer to reduce the vertical range of travel.
Not really just trial and error. I would start with the simplest and cheapest thing if possible and move from there. Worst comes to worst you either rhave to deal with the rubbing or change tires unfortunately.
 

Vtec_Nah

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2017
Messages
251
Reaction score
151
Location
California
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si
Vehicle Showcase
2
Country flag
Isn’t there any way to figure out what to change without buying a lot of parts I might not need? I have about two finger widths of space there and I see other cars with fractions of an inch there, so I assume they just made it much stiffer to reduce the vertical range of travel.
Sounds like, Probably, camber kits.
Definitely adding some camber or even releasing the pins from the struts in the front will give you some camber if that's where they rub the most (front tires) but like alpha mentioned, 35 sidewalls is what everyone here does *including myself when I had mine* to avoid rubbing
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
…. even releasing the pins from the struts in the front will give you some camber if that's where they rub the most (front tires) ….
What does “releasing the pins” do, exactly?

Just not crazy about the possible look of tires at an angle. Maybe camber adjustments don’t necessarily mean looking like they are angled? (Perpendicular to the street when at rest, but traveling at an angle when hitting a bump.)
 

dark_knight097

Senior Member
First Name
Daniel
Joined
Sep 24, 2019
Messages
409
Reaction score
349
Location
Georgia
Car(s)
2017 Civic Si
Country flag
What does “releasing the pins” do, exactly?

Just not crazy about the possible look of tires at an angle. Maybe camber adjustments don’t necessarily mean looking like they are angled? (Perpendicular to the street when at rest, but traveling at an angle when hitting a bump.)
Removing the pins add a bit of negative camber. This is completely fine to do, iirc its stated somewhere in the manual they can be removed.

If that still isnt enough, unity performance sells lower ball joints that add more negative camber. A good option if you arent looking to change the characteristics of your suspension too much.
https://unity-performance.com/colle...table-lower-ball-joints-all-civic-excl-type-r

The amount of camber needed to give clearance will not give you that exaggerated slant look. Especially at stock height

Edit: this is how much it looks slanted with tein flex z negative camber maxed out
20211003_150057.jpg
 
Last edited:

GoldClass

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2017
Messages
255
Reaction score
206
Location
Singapore
Car(s)
Civic Hatchback
Country flag
The real issue is the wheel offset. If running on 255/40R18 for a beefy tyre, you would want to look at offset +45. 255 is 10” but the wheel is only 8.5”. 18x8.5+35 is flush with fender, with 255 bigger tyre size (i.e. 10mm poke), obviously the tire will rub on fender when is hard compressed.

I read that you would not want to roll the fender, bend metal nor mess up with the oem suspension system. The only fix is to either run with 235/40R18 size tire or reduce the offset to +45.

edit: OP is 2018 Civic Si model.
 
Last edited:

koivuns

Senior Member
First Name
Steve
Joined
Jul 8, 2020
Messages
248
Reaction score
212
Location
Chicago
Car(s)
2020 Si CBP
Vehicle Showcase
1
Country flag
i'm running 245/40/18 x 8.5 +35 on eibach pro (1" drop) and i have no rubbing whatsoever
try the fender tab mod, i didn't have to as the '20 MY Si's got a revision that removed the fender tab, but any model before that you gotta fold it in.
do you know where the rubbing is occurring? that would help narrow it down
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
The real issue is the wheel offset. If running on 255/40R18 for a beefy tyre, you would want to look at offset +45. 255 is 10” but the wheel is only 8.5”. 18x8.5+35 is flush with fender, with 255 bigger tyre size (i.e. 10mm poke), obviously the tire will rub on fender when is hard compressed.

I read that you would not want to roll the fender, bend metal nor mess up with the oem suspension system. The only fix is to either run with 235/40R18 size tire or reduce the offset to +45.

edit: OP is 2018 Civic Si model.
Yes, it's a 2018 Civic Si. Just to make sure I understand, with a reduced offset (from 35 to 45) the tire would be further inside the wheel well, correct? Couldn't that lead to rubbing on full turns?

I'm starting to explore suspension mods and fender rolling, if I can get it done by a reputable shop for a reasonable price. I had the dealership check the suspension and they did so for free (including using the alignment set up) and told me everything is within spec. So the suspension or fenders need to change or the tires need to change.
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
i'm running 245/40/18 x 8.5 +35 on eibach pro (1" drop) and i have no rubbing whatsoever
try the fender tab mod, i didn't have to as the '20 MY Si's got a revision that removed the fender tab, but any model before that you gotta fold it in.
do you know where the rubbing is occurring? that would help narrow it down
I can see the rub marks near the edge of the tire tread (near the outside tire wall), and I can see that the fender lip is already deformed into a V at the top of the fender arch. It looks clean still, just the metal that would have been flat horizontal is tucked up into the inside of the fender on both front fenders. The rear rubs too in the same spot, but the metal on the fender lip is still horizontal. It's almost like if I let it do it's thing the tire will roll my fenders for me. :rolleyes:

I see you're in the Chicago area. Any shops you recommend in the area for this kind of work? I looked online and see places that people swear by ("won't let any other shop but this one touch my car!") and then the same shop gets massively negative comments from a slew of other people later on (the example in this case was Garage Kwai).
 
OP
OP

Asusa

Member
First Name
Andres
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Location
Illinois
Car(s)
2018 Civic Si Sedan
Country flag
Removing the pins add a bit of negative camber. This is completely fine to do, iirc its stated somewhere in the manual they can be removed.

If that still isnt enough, unity performance sells lower ball joints that add more negative camber. A good option if you arent looking to change the characteristics of your suspension too much.
https://unity-performance.com/colle...table-lower-ball-joints-all-civic-excl-type-r

The amount of camber needed to give clearance will not give you that exaggerated slant look. Especially at stock height

Edit: this is how much it looks slanted with tein flex z negative camber maxed out
20211003_150057.jpg
That looks pretty nice! I agree that the negative camber doesn't stand out there.
 

koivuns

Senior Member
First Name
Steve
Joined
Jul 8, 2020
Messages
248
Reaction score
212
Location
Chicago
Car(s)
2020 Si CBP
Vehicle Showcase
1
Country flag
I see you're in the Chicago area. Any shops you recommend in the area for this kind of work?
yeah offset is a lil tricky to fully explain but basically if you go 9.5 or 9” rims you gotta go +40/42 offset. maybe +38 w camber but that’s it. i have +35 8.5” and the fitment is A1. stock wheels are +50, so going from 35 to 45 wouldn’t increase rubbing, in fact it would reduce it.
if you want 255 wide tires, go x35 for the ratio. it’s a near stock circumference (so no speedo error) with a huge increase in grip and steering feel. however for 255 you’ll need 9 or 9.5” rims. ipso facto, 255 leads to less flush fitment (aside from setting camber with a lower + offset).
i don’t go to many shops tbh, tho i’m going to have to very soon for my alignment as well as for my clutch install.
my advice for shops is you get what you pay for. if the labor rate is 30/hr you’re going to get 30/hr quality work. if the rate is 250/hr, you’re getting ripped off.
i’m in the northwest suburbs so i don’t really shops by the city but the one i’m taking my car to is ultima race works.
hope this helps
 
Advertisement

 
Advertisement
Top