FACE LIFT TYPE R SPOTTED? Check out the pic. What do you think?

smc_stefan

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Please explain what you think is the difference between reducing lift and producing down force...lol
The car produces lift. Down force from the wing reduces that lift. Any wing/spoiler that reduces lift us producing down force.
Normally, and I hope Honda is not playing marketing tricks, downforce is positive pressure on the car at a certain speed. If you speak of downforce you don't mean reduced lift.

Let's say a car has a lift of 50 lbs at 100 mph at the rear axle, you can add a Spoiler to reduce the lift to, let's say 20 lbs at 100 mph to make the car more stable at higher speeds. That would be reduced lift.

If speaking of downforce you have no lift at all, but you will need either a relatively steep spoiler which most likely will not be street legal (as the BMW M4 CSL Spoiler in its steep position) or a wing like Honda uses.
So the number of x lbs downforce at y mph should not display the number of lbs the lift is reduced but the actual number of positive pressure which is generated.

Like I said in the beginning, I sincerely hope Honda is not playing marketing tricks, stating the CTR wing produces those 66 lbs at 125 mph is real downforce and not the reduction of the lift.



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RedGiant217

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Like I said in the beginning, I sincerely hope Honda is not playing marketing tricks, stating the CTR wing produces those 66 lbs at 125 mph is real downforce and not the reduction of the lift.
I wasn't aware of that distinction but it does make sense.
I tend to think the 66lbs is just the force produced by the wing and not 66lbs more than whatever lift there is at 125mph. The difference can't be all that much anyway.
 

smc_stefan

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I wasn't aware of that distinction but it does make sense.
I tend to think the 66lbs is just the force produced by the wing and not 66lbs more than whatever lift there is at 125mph. The difference can't be all that much anyway.
Yeah, Hondas definition is a little bit tricky, they always say that the wing produces 66lbs at 125mph downforce, which should mean they have 66lbs real downforce on the rear axle but could also mean thats just the number the wing produces and not the total downforce at the rear axle, maybe they have 100lbs lift at 125 mph an the wing reduces it to 34 lbs lift, who knows?

The only thing we know is that the aerodynamics of the CTR are quite good and balanced, wich matters more to me than bare numbers.

Regarding the tested and pictured "small wing option" I think that the aerodynamics are good enough to live without the big wing, as the CTR has a pretty flat underbod which helps reducing lift plus some other tweaks. If the small wing will be an option or part of a trim package for 2020, it could also be possible that Honda limits the top Speed at around 160 mph if they think the car wouldn't be stable enough at high Speeds without the big wing.
 

TypeSiR

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"For those who question its form, there’s solace knowing it is, in fact, functional. At 200 kph (124 mph), the 306-horsepower, turbocharged 2.0-liter four-cylinder Civic Type R and its wing are producing 30 kg (66 pounds) of downforce, which plants the rear end, and increases cornering and straight-line stability, according to Rob Keough, senior product planner for the Type R."

Source: https://www.cars.com/articles/2017-honda-civic-type-r-whats-up-with-the-wing-1420697626310/

Numbers mentioned by Honda are what we have to go by. Everything else is just conjecture. The amount of lift is unknown so guessing it is just distracting. At the end, the wing is making 66 pounds of downforce at 124 mph regardless of the amount of lift. Without the wing, it'd have 66 pounds less downforce (at 124 mph) regardless of the amount of lift.
 

tinyman392

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Please explain what you think is the difference between reducing lift and producing down force...lol
The car produces lift. Down force from the wing reduces that lift. Any wing/spoiler that reduces lift us producing down force.
A spoiler doesn't produce downforce, it specifically is designed to reduce lift by spoiling the air that flows over the rear of the vehicle, it'll no longer be effective if the resulting lift becomes 0 (you can't reduce lift if there isn't any left). A wing, on the other hand, is shaped in such a way to push air upward (which in turn pushes the rear of the car downward) producing a downward force (downforce or negative lift). This, in theory, allows you to put more "weight" on the rear of the vehicle that is higher than the lift provided by said vehicle having better net effect than a spoiler. However, the wing comes with a higher cost of drag compared to the spoiler.

However, if the wing does not produce enough downforce to overcome the lift of the vehicle, then the effect on the vehicle would be no different than a spoiler that reduces the lift an equal amount (to the actual downforce created) if I'm not mistaken (the only cost would be drag created by the wing). Keep in mind that the faster you get a car moving, the more downforce is created and it's quadratically related; that is, if you double the speed, you quadruple the downforce (if you halve the speed, you quarter the downforce). Also keep in mind that braking also will affect the downforce of a wing as well (normally it should increase it).
 

tylermmorton

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These probably won't fit the Type R, will they? Notice the removal of the 3 ducts on the outside, but an addition of a removable plating.

 

Connorsrandom

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These probably won't fit the Type R, will they? Notice the removal of the 3 ducts on the outside, but an addition of a removable plating.

Well that front end is not the type R. If you look at the type r that they have wrapped it looks like it has the color match plates but still has the air ducts on the front bumper.
 

garoto

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Those separators seem to be Honda’s new MMC thing on Civics. Look at the previous gen.

C2EDE8B2-72C9-4BCF-A9E4-6CADCF98F5E7.jpeg
 

Jeaholland

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Okay but like where can I get a wing like that for my sport hatch?!
 

GraphiteAZ

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Please explain what you think is the difference between reducing lift and producing down force...lol
The car produces lift. Down force from the wing reduces that lift. Any wing/spoiler that reduces lift us producing down force.

I agree with you entirely here. However, I think the point that was trying to be said was that some wings produce downforce to create a net zero of lift, and some wings create downforce to have a negative amount of lift.

ugh I hope that makes sense.
 

Purple Drink

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WARNING!!! I found out that the new rear grills from the new 2020 hatchback do not fit the prior 2019 and older Type R bumper. I imagine you will need a new Type R rear bumper if you want to pimp the new grills.

If you are wondering how I know .... I bought a set.

Cheers
 

Naruske

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WARNING!!! I found out that the new rear grills from the new 2020 hatchback do not fit the prior 2019 and older Type R bumper. I imagine you will need a new Type R rear bumper if you want to pimp the new grills.

If you are wondering how I know .... I bought a set.

Cheers
It's destiny telling you that those grills are hideous and shouldnt be put on a type r. :rolleyes:
 

Purple Drink

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It's destiny telling you that those grills are hideous and shouldnt be put on a type r. :rolleyes:

muhahahaha.... I never said I wouldn't plastic weld two panels together to make one.

Destiny is just a few facelifts away.
 

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