Drove a 10th gen non-Si for the first time...

[gtman]

Notice that they say that they don't notice much difference *on the street for everyday driving*. Honestly for everyday driving where my top speed is like 35 mph, I probably wouldn't notice much difference between a Type R and my Sport Touring.

I think you hit the nail on the head. At 5/10ths on the street, in traffic, the difference is slight. And let's face it, that's how we drive 90% of the time. Push things harder and that's what separates the two cars.

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[xbbnx]

Notice that they say that they don't notice much difference *on the street for everyday driving*. Honestly for everyday driving where my top speed is like 35 mph, I probably wouldn't notice much difference between a Type R and my Sport Touring.

Well I did drive the Touring on the streets when I got it as a loaner not on the track, and to me it was night and day. But to be fair I'm hardly ever going 35mph unless in traffic.

 

[phornea]

In case you missed it, here is one of the comments that inspired this thread

There's not much for me to add to this thread than has already been said, however, I've been reading along and the one theme I keep seeing that's driving me nuts is that the comparisons between the SI and non-SI (Touring) models are as if these cars are being driven to their limits on the city road. And you also seem to be formulating your opinions on that basis as well. But the comment/quote you are providing from jtrader, he does specifically mention everyday driving.

So, obviously the SI can be pushed to much higher limits and in that case feels like a superior performance car, like many have said; what do you expect, it's specifically built for that. But when folks mention that the two cars are very close for daily driving, I can see that point. Unless you're daily driving these cars to the limit. In which case, well, good for you, enjoy the SI. But most folks daily driving the two cars, won't notice much difference, even with occasional hard pulls to overtake other cars and some corners taken at speed.

When folks provide their feedback on how cars feel and perform, you have to pay attention to how their formulating their opinions. And I really feel like you've misunderstood those perspectives by assuming their expectations and desires of how a car should perform and feel should have fallen in line with yours.

Additionally, you have been comparing a Touring CVT vs a manual SI. I haven't driven a CVT myself, but I've seen it mentioned so often that not only does the CVT feel sluggish in response, but it also feels overall slower than it actually is.

 

[phornea]

Oops, gtaman and turbo lover beat me to it as I was writing my response. But ya, everyone is saying the same thing really.

 

[xbbnx]

There's not much for me to add to this thread than has already been said, however, I've been reading along and the one theme I keep seeing that's driving me nuts is that the comparisons between the SI and non-SI (Touring) models are as if these cars are being driven to their limits on the city road. And you also seem to be formulating your opinions on that basis as well. But the comment/quote you are providing from jtrader, he does specifically mention everyday driving.

So, obviously the SI can be pushed to much higher limits and in that case feels like a superior performance car, like many have said; what do you expect, it's specifically built for that. But when folks mention that the two cars are very close for daily driving, I can see that point. Unless you're daily driving these cars to the limit. In which case, well, good for you, enjoy the SI. But most folks daily driving the two cars, won't notice much difference, even with occasional hard pulls to overtake other cars and some corners taken at speed.

When folks provide their feedback on how cars feel and perform, you have to pay attention to how their formulating their opinions. And I really feel like you've misunderstood those perspectives by assuming their expectations and desires of how a car should perform and feel should have fallen in line with yours.

Additionally, you have been comparing a Touring CVT vs a manual SI. I haven't driven a CVT myself, but I've seen it mentioned so often that not only does the CVT feel sluggish in response, but it also feels overall slower than it actually is.

I drive my Si as a daily, and honestly I hardly do WOT pulls, I do drive faster than most people on the road though, merging quickly and overtaking slower cars but hardly I'm I ever pushing my Si "to the limits". Driving the Touring the same way I drive my Si, moderately quick but hardly to the limits, it felt noticeably slower, sluggish, and a little boring/less responsive. Now, you make a good point, could be the CVT, but at the end of the day I doubt a manual EXT would feel that much different from the CVT, with the exception of maybe less lag.

 

[gtman]

"Driving the Touring the same way I drive my Si, moderately quick but hardly to the limits, it felt noticeably slower, sluggish, and a little boring/less responsive."

Honestly xbbnx, driven moderately quickly like you said you did, stock for stock there is no comparison. Performance oriented car with a better suspension and more power. CVT versus MT.

The Touring is a fine car with nice amenities but it's mission is a bit different than the Si. But for 90% of the people test driving it, it's a fine riding and handling car with good pep and great gas mileage.

 

[Nostake]

While I'm sure your modded EX-L is a blast and relatively fast, the fact that you had to point out every time you could that your car is tuned proves my point that stock, the 1.5T non Si is slow.

dude the stock SI is slow too

 

[Nostake]

Test Drive a HB sport with manual, its a way better experience than a Civic with a CVT. the SI handles better than a HB and its faster plus has better internals its tottally worth the money but it could have and should have been so much more, no way it should have shipped with the same engine. that said. i dont go to the track or drive like a jerk so the extra handling im not really missing, though i did add a strut tower, lower front brace and a SI rear sway bar to the mix, i feel it handles VERY sharp for what i want it to do. I also do not plan to add a bigger turbo or meth injection etc so the beefier internals are again wasted on me. and it boiled down to the HB sport being in my opinion WAY better looking than the SI. great car though and worth every penny, im glad you are happy with it

 

[Cornercarver]

Friends don't let friends buy non-SI Civics.

Or anything with a CVT.

Sorry you were forced to rent one. Hopefully you have
recovered from that disenchanting experience. You clearly are a driving enthusiast
with excellent taste, and deserve better. However, there will probably never be an SI, let alone a Type R
available as a rental.

 

[gtman]

Sorry you were forced to rent one. You clearly are a driving enthusiast with excellent taste, and deserve better.

You're gonna touch a few nerves with those comments. First off, I am an enthusiast and have modded my cars, run a couple car forums and driven mostly manuals over the last 30 years.

But, I currently drive a tuned CVT turbo Civic. And honestly it handles decently with a few mods I've done and consistently is under 6 seconds 0-60, which is solid.

I don't feel like it's the crap car you're describing.

 

[arsh88]

This whole thread is laughable. I love my CVT hatchback. it doesn't feel slow, and I wasn't aware that being able to get up to 80mph in an instant to pass cars meant it was a bad car. Given the amount of construction we've had, I've also enjoyed not having to try to drive a manual in bumper to bumper traffic during the month and a half everything got congested. If you like your Si, that's great, but i feel like these posts are just people trying to beg for attention. If you want an Si, get an Si, no one else is honestly going to notice or give a shit though.

 

[xbbnx]

However, there will probably never be an SI, let alone a Type R
available as a rental.

I asked for an Si and they pretty much laughed at me lol

 

[BriteBlue]

You're gonna touch a few nerves with those comments. First off, I am an enthusiast and have modded my cars, run a couple car forums and driven mostly manuals over the last 30 years.

But, I currently drive a tuned CVT turbo Civic. And honestly it handles decently with a few mods I've done and consistently is under 6 seconds 0-60, which is solid.

I don't feel like it's the crap car you're describing.

I have a non-tuned CVT turbo Civic & really like the car. I've had 8 or 9 manual trans cars, so I'm not against them. But I'm not against automatics either. I didn't think I'd like the CVT but it works just fine.

 

[gtman]

I have a non-tuned CVT turbo Civic & really like the car. I've had 8 or 9 manual trans cars, so I'm not against them. But I'm not against automatics either. I didn't think I'd like the CVT but it works just fine.

I understand the dislike of CVT's from manual drivers. It's an automatic and on top of that, CVT's are different and take some getting used to. At first I didn't care for it. But drive it beyond the test drive and you begin to appreciate what a great job Honda did. It mostly plays well with the turbo, too. And like you said, in heavy stop and go traffic, I don't miss the clutch one bit.

Last but not least, you're almost always at the right rpm for the given situation. Power when you need it, mpg's when you don't.

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