Civic Type R at the track, goods and bads! Let's share our experience.

b2point0h

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Steering inputs are really smooth though I don't recommend shuffling the wheel that much. I'd highly recommend having an experienced buddy or coach sit with you because there's a lot of little things that add up to a lot of lost time here.
I was just about to comment about shuffling hands too. Line looks okay, but keeping hands at 3 and 9 and just let your arms cross over might help a bit with shuffling. Takes time to get used to but you'll notice worlds of difference in your driving if you only move your hand right hand to shift.
Appreciate the feedback from both of you!

Just wanted to note here that I hadn't been to Buttonwillow since 2015 in my old Subaru and have been consistently racing in Rallycross since then, so my on-track skills are a bit rusty, although I had done Streets and 3 AutoX days prior to this track day.

Also - The M3 in front was gutted, with roll cage, seat/harness/wheel, BBK and running 100tw tires, I was impressed to be keeping up!

I will try to not shuffle as much next time, but it certainly will attribute to more arm fatigue as R-Mode steering is heavy.



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ApexEight

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Has anyone tried tracking without the metal underbody plate to see if it would reduce temps? I know it's there for aero and protection, but I'm interested to see if it'd help cooling. Could just reinstall after the track day. My only concern is that it could create a bunch of turbulence and rip out the plastic panels or something.

I think removing it combined with removing the plastic engine cover, adding a side-mount oil cooler, eBay grille, and turbo blanket could be a good combo. Maybe add the center TrackSpec hood vent too, but cutting up a hood is scary. Or maybe a slightly less effective alternative could be removing the rubber strip along the cowl? Could also reinstall after the track day. I just feel like the radiator has no room behind it to move air and it's right by the turbo, so hood vents and/or removing the cowl could help.

Edit: Just had another idea. What about in conjunction with removing the rubber strip by the cowl, removing the aluminum rain duct underneath the hood? That way the stock hood scoop could help evacuate more air out the back with the cowl strip removed. Doesn't look like it can be reinstalled though. Looks like it's riveted in and would have to be drilled out. Or maybe it can clip back in? But even then Idk how secure it'd be without the rivets.
 
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TypeSiR

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Has anyone tried tracking without the metal underbody plate to see if it would reduce temps? I know it's there for aero and protection, but I'm interested to see if it'd help cooling. Could just reinstall after the track day. My only concern is that it could create a bunch of turbulence and rip out the plastic panels or something.

I think removing it combined with removing the plastic engine cover, adding a side-mount oil cooler, eBay grille, and turbo blanket could be a good combo. Maybe add the center TrackSpec hood vent too, but cutting up a hood is scary. Or maybe a slightly less effective alternative could be removing the rubber strip along the cowl? Could also reinstall after the track day. I just feel like the radiator has no room behind it to move air and it's right by the turbo, so hood vents and/or removing the cowl could help.

Edit: Just had another idea. What about in conjunction with removing the rubber strip by the cowl, removing the aluminum rain duct underneath the hood? That way the stock hood scoop could help evacuate more air out the back with the cowl strip removed. Doesn't look like it can be reinstalled though. Looks like it's riveted in and would have to be drilled out. Or maybe it can clip back in? But even then Idk how secure it'd be without the rivets.
I've removed the hood seal by the cowl but haven't really measured temp differences. Removing the engine undercover and plastic splash shield is also a good experiment (see pic below). I'll do some tests with these three items intact/removed and measure temp differences (if any) when the weather gets better since I've some time to kill. But will only conduct these tests during canyon runs as I don't track the car.

1586760403314.png
 

ApexEight

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I've removed the hood seal by the cowl but haven't really measured temp differences. Removing the engine undercover and plastic splash shield is also a good experiment (see pic below). I'll do some tests with these three items intact/removed and measure temp differences (if any) when the weather gets better since I've some time to kill. But will only conduct these tests during canyon runs as I don't track the car.

1586760403314.png
Is the splash shield a paint to remove and reinstall? I only mentioned the metal tray because of how quickly it comes off but I do think there would obviously be a greater benefit in removing it all.
 

CTR88

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So you daily and track the Powerstop pads and front rotors? Any updates on how you like them in both situations? Noise and dust levels? Are you a 10/10ths track day guy?
Currently the Powerstop pads and rotors are dailies. No real issues, did get a little delayed shuddering of the fronts this winter but seems to have improved. A little dusty but on the black rims not as big a deal. Pretty quiet pads for daily, rare minor squeal only at end of braking. I’d consider myself pretty close to 10/10s on the track and I think I could get two weekends (4 days) out of the pads.
 

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Has anyone tried tracking without the metal underbody plate to see if it would reduce temps? I know it's there for aero and protection, but I'm interested to see if it'd help cooling. Could just reinstall after the track day. My only concern is that it could create a bunch of turbulence and rip out the plastic panels or something.

I think removing it combined with removing the plastic engine cover, adding a side-mount oil cooler, eBay grille, and turbo blanket could be a good combo. Maybe add the center TrackSpec hood vent too, but cutting up a hood is scary. Or maybe a slightly less effective alternative could be removing the rubber strip along the cowl? Could also reinstall after the track day. I just feel like the radiator has no room behind it to move air and it's right by the turbo, so hood vents and/or removing the cowl could help.

Edit: Just had another idea. What about in conjunction with removing the rubber strip by the cowl, removing the aluminum rain duct underneath the hood? That way the stock hood scoop could help evacuate more air out the back with the cowl strip removed. Doesn't look like it can be reinstalled though. Looks like it's riveted in and would have to be drilled out. Or maybe it can clip back in? But even then Idk how secure it'd be without the rivets.
Ive tracked without the belly pan and it made no noticeable difference in temps. It hurts aero performance and MPG on the street
 

ApexEight

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Ive tracked without the belly pan and it made no noticeable difference in temps. It hurts aero performance and MPG on the street
Yeah, I've reconsidered my approach and have boiled things down to 4 mods, and nothing else, no removal of undertray, valve cover plastic, cowl rubber lining, rain duct, none of that.

1) eBay grille
For increased airflow to radiator.
2) 2020 radiator
For cooler water temps. Haven't gotten any track results yet (thanks, COVID), but there is a guy I found on FB that has one and has measured improvements on the street. There appears to be more fins in the 2020. See pic below.
3) Side-mount oil cooler
For cooler oil temps and greater oil capacity.
4) Legit hood vents
For increased airflow behind the radiator and to reduce engine bay temps. Race Louvers makes the most functional vents I've ever seen. Highly recommend their YouTube channel for a bit more info. I'm looking at this model, specifically: https://racelouvers.com/scca-t2-t3-stu-center-hood-louvers-pair-16w-x-11-5d/

These four mods directly impact water and oil temps and airflow into and out of the radiator and engine bay. While I'm not as concerned about heatsoak, these should help alleviate that as well.

A second stage could look like adding an aftermarket catted downpipe (don't want to go catless for practicality reasons) with some sort of heat insulation, and maybe a turbo blanket, but I'm not sure the blanket's effects are what I'd want.

Screenshot_20200425-232931.png
 

metal_driver

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ApexEight, thanks for the 2020 rad pics.
By they way, you may want to touch base with Jason at USR racing re the hood louver(s). They were working on one that inserts into our center scoop location but looks a lot like the type of louver you provided in the links.
Another simple mod that may help is wrapping your inlet pipe with gold foil..
I've also decided to give a turbo blanket a try. Just need a chance to get to track it..
 

Lust

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Yeah, I've reconsidered my approach and have boiled things down to 4 mods, and nothing else, no removal of undertray, valve cover plastic, cowl rubber lining, rain duct, none of that.

1) eBay grille
For increased airflow to radiator.
2) 2020 radiator
For cooler water temps. Haven't gotten any track results yet (thanks, COVID), but there is a guy I found on FB that has one and has measured improvements on the street. There appears to be more fins in the 2020. See pic below.
3) Side-mount oil cooler
For cooler oil temps and greater oil capacity.
4) Legit hood vents
For increased airflow behind the radiator and to reduce engine bay temps. Race Louvers makes the most functional vents I've ever seen. Highly recommend their YouTube channel for a bit more info. I'm looking at this model, specifically: https://racelouvers.com/scca-t2-t3-stu-center-hood-louvers-pair-16w-x-11-5d/

These four mods directly impact water and oil temps and airflow into and out of the radiator and engine bay. While I'm not as concerned about heatsoak, these should help alleviate that as well.

A second stage could look like adding an aftermarket catted downpipe (don't want to go catless for practicality reasons) with some sort of heat insulation, and maybe a turbo blanket, but I'm not sure the blanket's effects are what I'd want.

Screenshot_20200425-232931.png
Yea these were shared by my buddy who is a Honda tech. He said the the new radiator seemed to cool down much quicker than the previous MY radiators. This is due to the new radiator having more fins like your mentioned.
Opening up the grill and getting a proper vented hood is key. Oil cooler and radiator would be next on the list for sure and are a must if you track.
 

ApexEight

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ApexEight, thanks for the 2020 rad pics.
By they way, you may want to touch base with Jason at USR racing re the hood louver(s). They were working on one that inserts into our center scoop location but looks a lot like the type of louver you provided in the links.
Another simple mod that may help is wrapping your inlet pipe with gold foil..
I've also decided to give a turbo blanket a try. Just need a chance to get to track it..
No problem. And yeah, I've talked with USR (online, but they're actually like a 30 minutes drive from me), and the vents are being finalized. The hood vent is a really cool design, but I'm liking the greater aggressiveness of the Race Louvers. The front "flap" of the Race Louvers vent stands tall above the hood and creates a low pressure area behind it to let the subsequent vents pull more air out of the engine bay. Race Louvers has wind tunnel tested their vents and claim measurable downforce from that first flap. Also, the subsequent vents seem to "dip" further into the engine bay than any other design I've seen, which I think should help even more. Lastly, the position of the Race Louvers is preferable, in my opinion. It's right above the turbo and any water that gets in would just hit the inlet pipe and turbo heatshield, whereas the USR hood scoop one is right above the valve cover which has a lot of electronics on it. I'm sure the USR ones help though, and for those looking for an easier install, I'm sure just doing the hood scoop vent alone would be a lot easier.
Screenshot_20200426-223340.png

Screenshot_20200426-224923.png

Yea these were shared by my buddy who is a Honda tech. He said the the new radiator seemed to cool down much quicker than the previous MY radiators. This is due to the new radiator having more fins like your mentioned.
Opening up the grill and getting a proper vented hood is key. Oil cooler and radiator would be next on the list for sure and are a must if you track.
That's awesome, looking forward to his track results. Glad that it's pretty cheap too.
 

ApexEight

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And oh, I've considered wrapping the inlet pipe, and actually the entire intake box and tract, in gold reflective tape, but have decided to pass for now. I'm sure every little bit helps, but taking the inlet pipe off seems like a total pain. I may do the intake box and a wrapped PRL or Eventuri silicone intake elbow if I get one. As for the turbo blanket, I'm concerned that elevated temps of the hot side of the turbo will cause the CHRA to heat up further too, which would increase oil and water temps since the stock turbo is oil and water cooled, and also potentially shorten the life of the turbo bearings. By leaving it uncovered, I think the hood vent will do a better job of keeping it and surrounding areas cool. I may be wrong about that, but that's where my mind is at now. The blanket undoubtedly reduces heatsoak, and while it's nice to keep heat away from the radiator that the turbo is right next to, I currently think the hood vent is a more effective alternative. Combining the two could be even better, but then I'd worry about water getting in and soaking the blanket... Idk. Also, the install seems like a pain too. I just need to find a good installer for the hood vent. Despite having their own product, I think USR would be happy to help.
 

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yeh the race louvers has some science behind it. the problem with this style oe replacement center vent is its located in the high pressure zone by the cowl and would likely feed air back into the engine bay making it counterproductive. the race louver site has some good info on placement
1587989065010.png
 

ApexEight

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Anyone running the Spoon low temp theromsat or have experience running low temp thermostats on track?
 

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ApexEight, you make some good points and your right the turbo blanket is a pain to install let alone pulling the inlet pipe.
I'm going to keep an eye on the J's hood as a possible future option..
 

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Anyone running the Spoon low temp theromsat or have experience running low temp thermostats on track?
The low temp thermostat is unlikely to give a significant improvement. Once you reach the threshold temperature and your stock or Spoon thermostat is fully open, then it’s all up to the cooling system to dissipate the heat. Either thermostat will be equal in sending the coolant to the radiator. Even if the Spoon opens sooner, after 20 seconds of full throttle the stock one will be open too and after that they are equal.

Assuming you have plenty of radiator cooling capacity that can actually hold the temps down to where the Spoon makes a difference (and generally none of us do), the only reason I can think of to have a lower operating temperature is you can delay preignition and thus run slightly more spark advance, and maybe run leaner (which means it runs hotter) for more power.
 

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