Carbon Fibre Brake Shims

[Baldilocks]

Anyone had any experience with carbon fibre/fiber brake shims? Seen these advertised on Tegiwa https://www.tegiwaimports.com/selec...e-pad-shims-honda-civic-type-r-fk8-17-21.html

I cooked my brakes recently at the nurburgring. I'm going to swap my (now warped) single piece discs out for the two piece discs and new pads. Just wondering whether spending the £120 extra for cf shims at the same time is worth the money, in terms of reducing front brake temps and adding longevity to my setup (OEM calipers, Endless Super Street S Sports pads, Dream (HEL) braided hoses, Motul RBF660 fluid plus the OEM two piece discs I will be adding).

Looks like these were developed by a company called Tribol Braking (https://www.tribolbraking.com/) in partnership with HEL, EBC and University of Exeter. Seems like they should be legit but not seeing any third party testing/reviews. The claims made would suggest there are gains to be had:

"exclusive resin which is non-combustible and thermally resistant to temperatures over 400°C (752°F)."

"initial testing carried out by a professional racing drivers in various road and track conditions showed a huge average temperature drop of 49°C (120.2°F) on the front calipers."

"super-lightweight 3.5 grams per shim, compared to weighty titanium which are a typical 17 grams per shim. That's a dramatic 79% weight saving"

Nearly 50C cooler on average and heat resistant resin are the ones that I think matter.. chasing weight savings on shims seems very pointless lol..

I'm also trying to understand how long these are likely to last on the car vs regular shims:

"You can also re-use the shims when changing pads, as long as they're in a good condition."

My very noddy thinking is that due to how heat disspation is more important closer to the source (per the same reason braided hoses are only useful in the section right near the caliper, rather than the full distance to the brake reservoir), having a pad shim material that keeps the caliper temps down should give better performance overall. But what do I know?

Sponsored

 

[ApexEight]

I have a set of those HEL shims waiting to go on. Price difference compared to titanium wasn't huge and apparently they cool better so I'm going to give them a shot. Heard shims may even cut down on noise.

 

[Baldilocks]

In the name of science, I ended up pulling the trigger and these came through today. Hopefully get them fitted over the weekend with new 2 piece discs

 

[SethNES]

In the name of science sounds like something Bill Nye would say. Hopefully all goes well!

 

[Baldilocks]

In the name of science sounds like something Bill Nye would say. Hopefully all goes well!

Thanks!

In all honesty, not quite sure how I plan on testing it.. the circumstances under which I warped my brakes originally happened before I even got to the track. It involved an emergency stop from 140mph on a derestricted German autobahn when a caravan pulled out on me..!

There may be nothing else for it.. I'll have to make the pilgrimage back to the nurburgring sooner rather than later!

 

[Dave B]

My concern would be if the shims were brittle vs the titanium ones.

 

[Baldilocks]

My concern would be if the shims were brittle vs the titanium ones.

This was/is my concern too. It'll be interesting to see how many sets of pads I end up getting through before these need to be put out of service..

 

[MadMage]

Some thoughts...

14 gram weight savings is... less than the difference if I have a full bladder or not.
400C is not that high. I believe the rotors glow red some where around 400-500C, I've had mine glow before. Titanium has a working temp of over 600C.
Carbon fiber usually has a better heat insulation than titanium
You'll needs pads that can handle the higher temps, since the heat will stay in the pads and rotors.

Let us know what you think and how they perform. Always interested in others experiences.

 

[Baldilocks]

Got everything fitted and the brakes are feeling much nicer; vibration all gone and decent pedal feel.

I'll need to try it out on track to get some real testing done, but at least they're on the car now. I'll try and report back after some time on the car, maybe after a hard track session and a pad change.

Pics of the braking setup all done. You can juuuust about see the cf shims lol:

 

[ApexEight]

Did you use any grease between the pad and shim? Or in the pin holes?

 

[Baldilocks]

Did you use any grease between the pad and shim? Or in the pin holes?

Grease on the top and bottom of the shims where they slid in the caliper and on the pins holding them in. Just to reduce friction and corrosion so the pads can slide nice and easy

 

[ApexEight]

Also got these in and appear to have survived their first track day. My Project Mu Club Racer pads are squealing like hell even with the shims, so don't expect any noise suppression from them.

 

[Baldilocks]

Also got these in and appear to have survived their first track day. My Project Mu Club Racer pads are squealing like hell even with the shims, so don't expect any noise suppression from them.

Which track were you at? How was pedal feel throughout the day?

I did briefly run the Endless Super Street S Sports pads without the shims, on the old warped single piece discs - no squealing before or after.

But you would kind of expect that, given they are for mostly street use.

Still itching to get it out on track and really stamp on them. 3 months later for spirited street use they work great.
I don't know whether it is placebo effect, but my foot told me the pedal felt stiffer, longer.

 

[ApexEight]

Which track were you at? How was pedal feel throughout the day?

I did briefly run the Endless Super Street S Sports pads without the shims, on the old warped single piece discs - no squealing before or after.

But you would kind of expect that, given they are for mostly street use.

Still itching to get it out on track and really stamp on them. 3 months later for spirited street use they work great.
I don't know whether it is placebo effect, but my foot told me the pedal felt stiffer, longer.

Atlanta Motorsports Park, smaller track. Hardest braking zone is T1 which was 105 to about 40. Pedal felt good all day with the Paragon rotors and Endless RF-650 brake fluid, but it wasn't that hot and I was just on Michelin PS4S.

I did everything except the brake fluid at once so the increase in pedal stiffness is hard to attribute to just one mod. The pads I replaced were about 65% worn. When I was bedding the new pads in, I was shocked at how firm they felt, but at the track everything (including suspension, tires, etc) feels "softer". I'm lightly considering the HEL brake (and clutch) lines to gain even more pedal stiffness. But for the price and HEL's data, and the weight savings, going with these over the titanium shim alternatives seems like a no brainer.

Sponsored