Battery issues

TheWalkman

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Threads
6
Messages
63
Reaction score
35
Location
Va
Vehicle(s)
Too many
Country flag
I almost hate to go here but I, too, have had some strange electrical issues (see: https://www.civicx.com/threads/battery-issue.42054/#post-694914).

I keep an ODB connected to my car (running DASH on IOS )and frequently see my battery voltage drop as low as 12.1 V. This happens randomly - while driving around town or even in a longer road trip. Normal charging, I believe, is around 14.7 Volts.

Iā€™ve always written this voltage reporting off as a glitch with my ODB but am beginning to think itā€™s reporting the voltage accurately.

Iā€™m now beginning to wonder if the ā€˜16ā€™s have a problem with the charging/ electrical system thatā€™s causing many of us to have dead batteries somewhat randomly.
Sponsored

 

JT Si

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Threads
19
Messages
1,299
Reaction score
1,151
Location
Place
Vehicle(s)
Car
Country flag
To play devil's advocate, why would you want them to give you another of the same battery that so many have had issues with?

I have zero desire to keep a battery that is so weak and unreliable. The instant I have an issue with my OEM battery it will be replaced with a quality AGM battery so I don't have to worry about it.

I don't think it will take long. Temps dropped into the 30's at night and it's already turning over the engine real, real slow.
 

TheWalkman

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Threads
6
Messages
63
Reaction score
35
Location
Va
Vehicle(s)
Too many
Country flag
When my battery dies, Iā€™m planning on replacing the Group 51 battery with Group 35 like the Canadian Civics seem to ship with, Obviously, a bigger battery makes sense in the cold, Northern climates.

I noticed Honda places some foam in the sides of the US battery box to take up the extra space for the smaller 51R. I priced out the larger 35 for $2 more. See attached photos. Well worth it for the additional amp hours and reserve power.

When youā€™re selling hundreds of thousands of cars, saving $2 per car adds up but as an owner, shaving a couple of dollars disappoints me.

Honda Civic 10th gen Battery issues 8119F37A-3D96-48F5-894F-7674D8B8A82E


Honda Civic 10th gen Battery issues 080AE97C-DDA2-456D-8122-6E9B8EA91A61
 
Last edited:

JT Si

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Threads
19
Messages
1,299
Reaction score
1,151
Location
Place
Vehicle(s)
Car
Country flag
When my battery dies, Iā€™m planning on replacing the Group 51 battery with Group 35 like the Canadian Civics seem to ship with, Obviously, a bigger battery makes sense in the cold, Northern climates.

I noticed Honda places some foam in the sides of the US battery box to take up the extra space for the smaller 51R. I priced out the larger 35 for $2 more. See attached photos. Well worth it for the additional amp hours and reserve power.

When youā€™re selling hundreds of thousands of cars, saving $2 per car adds up but as an owner, shaving a couple of dollars disappoints me.

8119F37A-3D96-48F5-894F-7674D8B8A82E.jpeg


080AE97C-DDA2-456D-8122-6E9B8EA91A61.jpeg
It's going to require new battery holder parts. There are 6 parts in total that are different for Canadian civics that I believe require swapping. The tray, the tie down bar, one of the mounting hooks, the insulation sleeve, the negative battery cable (the cable may be optional but it is different) and something else I can't remember.

I cross referenced all the parts between the Canadian civic and the US civic and made a list of which parts I suspected would affect battery mounting. I was able to find all of them on HondaPartsNow.com to order and it was only going to be $40 with shipping to buy all 6.

When I have some time I'll find the list of parts and post it up.
 

ExVTEC

Senior Member
First Name
Elliot
Joined
Mar 5, 2019
Threads
42
Messages
806
Reaction score
605
Location
Ohio
Vehicle(s)
2019 CTR
Country flag
If my battery goes I'm shoving the biggest AGM I can fit in here.
I'm in ohio and I had a Veloster turbo a few years ago. After my battery died I dropped in the biggest AGM battery that fit. I almost doubled the CCA. I'd hit the start button and it would crank so easy. A noticable improvement and peace of mind.
 


shoegazer

assistant to the assistant manager
Joined
Sep 5, 2018
Threads
7
Messages
1,414
Reaction score
715
Location
Raleigh NC
Vehicle(s)
2018 Civic LX Coupe 2.0 (CVT)
Country flag
If my battery goes I'm shoving the biggest AGM I can fit in here.
I'm in ohio and I had a Veloster turbo a few years ago. After my battery died I dropped in the biggest AGM battery that fit. I almost doubled the CCA. I'd hit the start button and it would crank so easy. A noticable improvement and peace of mind.
I considered this as well until I read warnings about AGM batteries, in some cases, being a strain on certain electrical charging systems. And, of course, I cannot find the article at the moment. But it seems that, in some cases, bigger may not be better. I offer this only as a caution. And I encourage anyone considering this to research for themselves.
 

SCOPESYS

Senior Member
First Name
Geoff
Joined
Aug 27, 2018
Threads
68
Messages
2,505
Reaction score
1,550
Location
MD
Vehicle(s)
2018 Honda Civic SI Coupe. . . . . . . .1987 Nissan Maxima Wagon. . . . . . . . . . .1987 Nissan Pulsar NX . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1987 Nissan Maxima Wagon (2nd Donor Wagon for parts)
Country flag
If you are going to get a flat battery, you probably are no matter what size battery you fit.
The 51R or going to the bigger 35 is not going to help much if you leave something running for too long (ie Radio, or Headlights) or have an electrical leak, and your battery goes so flat it cannot start the engine.

Assume it's going to happen, sooner or later (Just like loosing your computer data if your HD crashes, or you get a virus).

So then there are two options.
(a) Call for Help (Honda Assist or AAA) and hang around till they turn up,
or
(b) be prepared, and have a Lithium battery Charger, and be on your way in less that 60 seconds.

BTW: Its a given that the OEM Honda battery, that comes fitted in a new Civic is RUBBISH.
(It has probbaly been allowed to go flat a number of time before you buy the car, and therefore will never be any good)
 

TheWalkman

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Threads
6
Messages
63
Reaction score
35
Location
Va
Vehicle(s)
Too many
Country flag
I considered this as well until I read warnings about AGM batteries,.
As long as your replacing the equivalent group size (and CCA ratings are greater than or comparable), there shouldnā€™t be a problem, other than the dent the AGM puts into your wallet.

AGMS wonā€™t spill - no liquid electrolyte and are more tolerant of being deeply discharged but for most folks driving Civics, not sure why theyā€™d spend a lot of money to receive virtually no benefits,

Iā€™m curious to know what and where these warnings came from.
 

fjrman

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2017
Threads
13
Messages
335
Reaction score
151
Location
Tennessee
Vehicle(s)
2016 Civic 4 door LX with CVT
Country flag
AGM batteries are used on powersports products including motorcycles. They don't require anything special from the charging system.

My bike has one. The charging system supplies a regulated 14.0 volt output to the battery and other equipment.

You have to be careful about measured voltages. To see what's happening at the battery you need to be sampling the voltage at the battery terminals. If you sample elsewhere you're seeing a reduced value due to voltage drop in the circuitry between the battery and where you're sampling.

When the engine is running you shouldn't see a voltage below 13.2 at the battery terminals. Otherwise the battery is discharging and not charging.
 

JT Si

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Threads
19
Messages
1,299
Reaction score
1,151
Location
Place
Vehicle(s)
Car
Country flag
AGM batteries are used on powersports products including motorcycles. They don't require anything special from the charging system.

My bike has one. The charging system supplies a regulated 14.0 volt output to the battery and other equipment.

You have to be careful about measured voltages. To see what's happening at the battery you need to be sampling the voltage at the battery terminals. If you sample elsewhere you're seeing a reduced value due to voltage drop in the circuitry between the battery and where you're sampling.

When the engine is running you shouldn't see a voltage below 13.2 at the battery terminals. Otherwise the battery is discharging and not charging.
There are conditions where the car will stop charging with the alternator. It doesn't run continuously 100% of the time while the car is on.
 


shoegazer

assistant to the assistant manager
Joined
Sep 5, 2018
Threads
7
Messages
1,414
Reaction score
715
Location
Raleigh NC
Vehicle(s)
2018 Civic LX Coupe 2.0 (CVT)
Country flag
[QUOTE="TheWalkman, post: 696992, member: 3628"
Iā€™m curious to know what and where these warnings came from.[/QUOTE]

I've been trying to find it. It very may well have been a Scotty Kilmer video. And it probably derived from a discussion about Chrysler and their electrical systems. I do believe he has made a few videos re: AGM batteries recently. But I cannot produce it.
 

TheWalkman

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Threads
6
Messages
63
Reaction score
35
Location
Va
Vehicle(s)
Too many
Country flag
It's going to require new battery holder parts. There are 6 parts in total that are different for Canadian civics that I believe require swapping. The tray, the tie down bar, one of the mounting hooks, the insulation sleeve, the negative battery cable (the cable may be optional but it is different) and something else I can't remember.

I cross referenced all the parts between the Canadian civic and the US civic and made a list of which parts I suspected would affect battery mounting. I was able to find all of them on HondaPartsNow.com to order and it was only going to be $40 with shipping to buy all 6.

When I have some time I'll find the list of parts and post it up.
Iā€™d be very curious to see your list. I was assuming I could pull out the foam and drop in the larger 35R battery.
 

JT Si

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Threads
19
Messages
1,299
Reaction score
1,151
Location
Place
Vehicle(s)
Car
Country flag
Iā€™d be very curious to see your list. I was assuming I could pull out the foam and drop in the larger 35R battery.
Unfortunately it isn't that easy.

The battery tray is not big enough.
The tie down bracket is not wide enough.
The tray has a support bracket that has to be swapped. One of the hooks that attaches the tie down bracket is not the correct length.
The foam insulation sleeve is larger to fit the group 35. And finally, the negative battery cable is different (although I speculate the cable does not need to be changed the part is only $6 and I planned to order it anyway).

The sad news is several of these part numbers that were available on HondaPartsNow.com are currently listed as discontinued and I cannot find alternative suppliers or superceding part numbers.

Here is the list of part numbers:

Tray: 31521-TBA-C01 - D/C
Support bracket: 60630-TBA-C00 - D/C
Tie down: 31512-TBA-C01
Tie down hook: 31513-TBA-C00
Foam sleeve: 31531-TBA-C01 - D/C
Negative cable: 32600-TEA-M00

I had not yet ordered every part and retrofitted a group 35 so I cannot verify this list is sufficient but based on my research I have a strong belief it would do the job. Now that some of these parts are no longer available I'm not sure if I will get a chance. I was waiting for my battery to get weak enough to justify replacement and it just hasn't quite happened yet.

They are available from Toronto Honda parts, but they are much more expensive and the shipping to the states is probably too much to make it worthwhile.

I'm working on trying to find another way to get these parts.
 

TheWalkman

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Threads
6
Messages
63
Reaction score
35
Location
Va
Vehicle(s)
Too many
Country flag
I decided to check my battery today and thought I would share.

Background


I bought the car in late April if 2016 so Iā€™m very close to 30 months of ownership. Approximately 42K miles in the odometer.

I drove the car approx 10 miles last night mixed city/ highway driving. Temps in high 60s.

This is my test prior to driving today, around noon. Temp was 70ā€™ + /- using an Ancel BA 101 tester.

Honda Civic 10th gen Battery issues 2BE4B1CF-54B7-44A2-8CD6-DB1ED0297CEB


Frankly, I was very surprised to see a charge of only 37%. That is very concerning to me.

After driving approximatey 10 miles, mostly highway with some starts and stops. Temp approx. 75ā€™

Honda Civic 10th gen Battery issues 4A50BAB6-F82B-4E94-ABBE-DEA02F98AF31


I do keep an ODB plugged into the diagnostic port. Though I don't have an exact figure, I doubt the current draw is much.

It certainly seems odd to me that my battery would lose that much charge overnight (the lows here were in the fifties.

Do the Civics have a high parasitic drain? Are the batteries just a very low quality item? Do the Civics have a charging issue?

HONDA are you listening???
 
Last edited:

JT Si

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Threads
19
Messages
1,299
Reaction score
1,151
Location
Place
Vehicle(s)
Car
Country flag
I decided to check my battery today and thought I would share.

Background


I bought the car in late April if 2016 so Iā€™m very close to 30 months of ownership. Approximately 42K miles in the odometer.

I drove the car approx 10 miles last night mixed city/ highway driving. Temps in high 60s.

This is my test prior to driving today, around noon. Temp was 70ā€™ + /- using an Ancel BA 101 tester.

2BE4B1CF-54B7-44A2-8CD6-DB1ED0297CEB.jpeg


Frankly, I was very surprised to see a charge of only 37%. That is very concerning to me.

After driving approximatey 10 miles, mostly highway with some starts and stops. Temp approx. 75ā€™

4A50BAB6-F82B-4E94-ABBE-DEA02F98AF31.jpeg


I do keep an ODB plugged into the diagnostic port. Though I don't have an exact figure, I doubt the current draw is much.

It certainly seems odd to me that my battery would lose that much charge overnight (the lows here were in the fifties.

Do the Civics have a high parasitic drain? Are the batteries just a very low quality item? Do the Civics have a charging issue?

HONDA are you listening???
The battery is low quality and it's too small for a car with this amount of electrical systems and other electronics. Hence why I'm so gung ho about figuring out how to get OEM parts to fit a group 35 battery. I don't care it's going to add 15-20 pounds if it's going to give me peace of mind I won't have one of the slow cranking days where it doesn't end up starting at all.

If I can't figure out a way to source bolt in parts to upgrade the battery I'm going to end up having to buy either the Optima yellowtop 51R, the Exide Edge 51R, or the Odyssey 1200 (which is smaller but same weight and capacity)

It's the same tiny battery size they've been putting in Civics since the 80's. I'm glad to see they have bothered upsizing the alternator since we have a 130-135 amp alternator now but they seriously made a bad judgement call keeping the 51R.
Sponsored

 
Last edited:


 


Top