Any chance to change out all window actuators with Auto ones?

fsucutter

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Basically, I want all four of my windows to be auto up or auto down capable. Had it like that with my Jetta TDi (dumped it for this Hatch!).

It isn't as simple as ordering two more switches and swapping them out for the rear window buttons on the driver door is it?
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Basically, I want all four of my windows to be auto up or auto down capable. Had it like that with my Jetta TDi (dumped it for this Hatch!).

It isn't as simple as ordering two more switches and swapping them out for the rear window buttons on the driver door is it?
I doubt it. I'm sure it's controlled in the electronics module programming. I've seen aftermarket kits to turn windows into auto up/down.
 

calonzo

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I doubt it. I'm sure it's controlled in the electronics module programming. I've seen aftermarket kits to turn windows into auto up/down.
That's a great question. I would love to see the schematic for the windows to find out. I just got my car and haven't had a reason to purchase the repair manual yet.
 

kvnhmmd

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I doubt it. I'm sure it's controlled in the electronics module programming. I've seen aftermarket kits to turn windows into auto up/down.
This - there is a window ECU specifically to deal with power windows/moon roof. It even sets it's own codes whenever something goes wrong, such as when trying to roll the window down when it's frozen from ice.

In theory, it's possible to purchase an aftermarket switch that has a timer, but instead of the ECU determining how long it needs to roll the window up/down, it would be a preset time programmed into the circuit board of the switch. Say it takes 4 seconds to roll a window up from the lowest position. The timer in the switch would be set to maybe 4.5 seconds. Say the window was only down an inch. The timer in the switch would continue to apply power to the window motor for, let's say, 4 seconds too long instead of half a second. This would put unnecessary strain on the window motor and related parts.

Plus, I have no idea if anyone has developed this sort of switch for our vehicle.
 


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fsucutter

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This - there is a window ECU specifically to deal with power windows/moon roof. It even sets it's own codes whenever something goes wrong, such as when trying to roll the window down when it's frozen from ice.

In theory, it's possible to purchase an aftermarket switch that has a timer, but instead of the ECU determining how long it needs to roll the window up/down, it would be a preset time programmed into the circuit board of the switch. Say it takes 4 seconds to roll a window up from the lowest position. The timer in the switch would be set to maybe 4.5 seconds. Say the window was only down an inch. The timer in the switch would continue to apply power to the window motor for, let's say, 4 seconds too long instead of half a second. This would put unnecessary strain on the window motor and related parts.

Plus, I have no idea if anyone has developed this sort of switch for our vehicle.
If true...
(very sad face).
 

kvnhmmd

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If true...
(very sad face).
Right, this is my personal educated guess based on how Toyota's work.

Cars nowadays have multiple ECUs. Examples from a 2009 Rav4 include:

  • Engine and ECT
  • Cruise Control
  • ABS/VSC/TRAC
  • Tire Pressure Monitor
  • Air Conditioner
  • Door Motor
  • Sliding Roof
  • Smart Key
  • Occupancy Detection
.... And the list goes on.

Standard consumer scan tools would only be able to read codes (and possibly live data) from 'Engine and ECT' and sometimes ABS.

Tire shops obviously have tools to read only the 'Tire Pressure Monitor' ecu to program or check statuses on TPMS hardware in the tire.

Multi-thousand dollar scanners (such as from snap-on) can read most, if not all of the data and codes from the various ECUs.

Honda's window ECU will store trouble codes, and decide how long to apply power to the windows to fully roll them up/down as well as detection of obstructions such as a hand in the window frame for safety. This is why you sometimes have to "reset" the windows after disconnecting the battery, it's a step to retrain the window ECU.

If your car doesn't have auto up/down on some of the windows, the firmware for the ECU may not programmed for that either.

Maybe we'd be lucky, and all of the wiring and ECU firmware is present, then all that's needed is a replacement driver's window switch to replace the switches without the functionality.

I wouldn't rule out this last possibility, because I would assume they may reuse certain ECUs and wiring harnesses between different models of vehicles.

You could always take off your door panels and explore for yourself.
 
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fsucutter

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Right, this is my personal educated guess based on how Toyota's work.

Cars nowadays have multiple ECUs. Examples from a 2009 Rav4 include:

  • Engine and ECT
  • Cruise Control
  • ABS/VSC/TRAC
  • Tire Pressure Monitor
  • Air Conditioner
  • Door Motor
  • Sliding Roof
  • Smart Key
  • Occupancy Detection
.... And the list goes on.

Standard consumer scan tools would only be able to read codes (and possibly live data) from 'Engine and ECT' and sometimes ABS.

Tire shops obviously have tools to read only the 'Tire Pressure Monitor' ecu to program or check statuses on TPMS hardware in the tire.

Multi-thousand dollar scanners (such as from snap-on) can read most, if not all of the data and codes from the various ECUs.

Honda's window ECU will store trouble codes, and decide how long to apply power to the windows to fully roll them up/down as well as detection of obstructions such as a hand in the window frame for safety. This is why you sometimes have to "reset" the windows after disconnecting the battery, it's a step to retrain the window ECU.

If your car doesn't have auto up/down on some of the windows, the firmware for the ECU may not programmed for that either.

Maybe we'd be lucky, and all of the wiring and ECU firmware is present, then all that's needed is a replacement driver's window switch to replace the switches without the functionality.

I wouldn't rule out this last possibility, because I would assume they may reuse certain ECUs and wiring harnesses between different models of vehicles.

You could always take off your door panels and explore for yourself.
Exactly what I was hoping/thinking and wondering - take off the panel and swap one of the autos with the manual - do you think simply swapping & testing would cause any electrical damage, cuz I'm all for testing this out. Would love to simply order a 4 auto switches and swap 'em in the driver door and the rear doors!

Thanks for the post and answers...!
 

calonzo

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Exactly what I was hoping/thinking and wondering - take off the panel and swap one of the autos with the manual - do you think simply swapping & testing would cause any electrical damage, cuz I'm all for testing this out. Would love to simply order a 4 auto switches and swap 'em in the driver door and the rear doors!

Thanks for the post and answers...!
Most likely the set of switches comes in one piece with one wiring harness, not individually. You would have to separate them and rewire them, too.
 

kwaalude

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Are they no longer resistance based switches? I know older cars like my S2000's auto-down driver's window was based on resistance, but since this is the first new car I've bought since I got the S2k in 2001, I've been out of the loop on automotive technology.
Resistance seems like such a simple (not to mention proven and inexpensive) answer to auto up/down windows; I'm not sure I see how replacing it with the complexity of a microprocessor is beneficial.
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