A Feedback for KTuner

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arnoldo

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Nothing was changed related to that, but I'm glad your environmental factors are favorable currently.
That's weird because my environmental factor is worst than when I tested last year. I did my test during raining season last year, when humidity was better than summer. Temperature in summer around 35 celcius during the day, which is the same as raining season, but humidity is far worst than raining season.

I flashed beta version because I had issue hitting boost target consistently with stable calibration and KTuner suggested beta calibration could give a more consistent result so I just gave it a shot. I was surprised finding partial throttle knock control raise now consistent between beta and the stable calibration when MAF is scaled, which is .54 max.

I didn't change my fuel and still buying fuel from the same station as last year. Fuel is definitely not a factor anyway because the same fuel would give different partial throttle knock control raise result just by switching between beta and stable calibration before the update.

So... no change with anything environmental related, the same calibration and MAF scale, no parts change, same oil brand and viscosity, & no gas station change. It's just weird if there is no change at all in firmware but the actual result is much different than before software update.
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kadireren

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That's weird because my environmental factor is worst than when I tested last year. I did my test during raining season last year, when humidity was better than summer. Temperature in summer around 35 celcius during the day, which is the same as raining season, but humidity is far worst than raining season.

I flashed beta version because I had issue hitting boost target consistently with stable calibration and KTuner suggested beta calibration could give a more consistent result so I just gave it a shot. I was surprised finding partial throttle knock control raise now consistent between beta and the stable calibration when MAF is scaled, which is .54 max.

I didn't change my fuel and still buying fuel from the same station as last year. Fuel is definitely not a factor anyway because the same fuel would give different partial throttle knock control raise result just by switching between beta and stable calibration before the update.

So... no change with anything environmental related, the same calibration and MAF scale, no parts change, same oil brand and viscosity, & no gas station change. It's just weird if there is no change at all in firmware but the actual result is much different than before software update.
don't worry.. In a few days you will see that nothing has changed. I have already given up. But one thing is certain that initial version is much more stable than beta version such as knock control and fuel trims.
By the way, a friend of mine bought a Hondata just because of this reason. He has been using it for a week and same problem exists with hondata, too.(with base maps) So maybe unless we use very high octane or some ethanol, we had to live with it.
 
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don't worry.. In a few days you will see that nothing has changed. I have already given up. But one thing is certain that initial version is much more stable than beta version such as knock control and fuel trims.
I don't know man... Highest partial knock control still .54 & it's been almost 2 weeks with no reflashes.

The initial release indeed more stable but the beta comes with some adjustments that is not available in stable/initial release.

I switched back to beta mainly because KTuner suggested me to use beta releaseas beta release had bigger chance for the turbo to hit boost target more consistently because I had issue hitting boost target consistently. I'm on custom turbo though. Never had this issue when I was using stock turbo & CR-V turbo.

I'll switch back to initial release & I'll try to do further fine tune. Maybe I can hit boost target as consistent as the beta calibration after the fine tune.
 

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I don't know man... Highest partial knock control still .54 & it's been almost 2 weeks with no reflashes.

The initial release indeed more stable but the beta comes with some adjustments that is not available in stable/initial release.

I switched back to beta mainly because KTuner suggested me to use beta releaseas beta release had bigger chance for the turbo to hit boost target more consistently because I had issue hitting boost target consistently. I'm on custom turbo though. Never had this issue when I was using stock turbo & CR-V turbo.

I'll switch back to initial release & I'll try to do further fine tune. Maybe I can hit boost target as consistent as the beta calibration after the fine tune.
Yes, beta has more options which I liked such as on the fly map switching and throttle sensitivity but i gave up all of them for the sake of stable knock control and stable fuel trims.
The insteresting thing is in my case beta has problems hitting boost targets consistently. For example ı slowly increase boost and decraease again in the main boost table but it chooses which boost it will hit according to its own mind not mine😀 it hits higher boost where i decrease and hits lower where i increase not following the boost table. I made a few changes in the final boost table to hit higher boosts like telling it to hit 24 psi when i want 22 psi.
Hondata is doing much better Job while setting the boost targets. İt hits exactly as I have set.
 
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Yes, beta has more options which I liked such as on the fly map switching and throttle sensitivity but i gave up all of them for the sake of stable knock control and stable fuel trims.
The insteresting thing is in my case beta has problems hitting boost targets consistently. For example ı slowly increase boost and decraease again in the main boost table but it chooses which boost it will hit according to its own mind not mine😀 it hits higher boost where i decrease and hits lower where i increase not following the boost table. I made a few changes in the final boost table to hit higher boosts like telling it to hit 24 psi when i want 22 psi.
Hondata is doing much better Job while setting the boost targets. İt hits exactly as I have set.
I don't even have on the fly map switching in my beta. :D

The difference between initial and beta version in my case are: access to Knock sensitivity adjustments, access to Boost By Gear, Ethanol/Flex Fuel tuning, Low Rev Limit setting access, & Basic 2-Step setting access. The Beta version missing ECO throttle responsiveness setting that the initial calibration supports.

I think users experience with KTuner across different ECU type of this 10th gen varies. Users with full support obviously enjoy the benefit. I give up hope of my ECU getting full support.
 


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This is my last feedback to @KTuner

I've been helping a lot of people in real life and a few people in this forum who experience partial throttle knock control raise case. Every case has been solved by revert back to stock, locking the ECU, selling KTuner unit, purchased Hondata Flashpro, & flash using Hondata Flashpro.

I'm 1000% sure there is issue with KTuner firmware affecting some ECU code that caused partial throttle knock control raise even using KTuner own calibrations, both the stages map and the basemaps. This occur when users adjusting AFR calibration to a more ideal AFR most of the time but also affecting those users who flash KTuner basemap right away. All affected users are using stock turbo. Some of them use stock intake and a number of the users I helped used intake kits with stock MAF.

Users/customers who are experiencing this issue are using RON 98 gas. In my case, I tested with VP racing mix and the partial throttle knock control still occur.

All case solved by replacing KTuner with Hondata Flashpro. @kadireren recently posted a comparison in this forum and stated Hondata didn't help and Flashpro was worst than KTuner.

Apparently it took some time for Hondata to get back to @kadireren but instead of replying with excuses and denials, Hondata provide a software update to remedy @kadireren issue.

Now, @kadireren no longer experience concerning partial throttle knock control increase & his issues with Flashpro has been fixed by Hondata team.

Why am I still on KTuner? Because I cannot find Flashpro in my country and importation tax plus shipping is very high so I need to sell my KTuner unit. Unfortunately KTuner is not popular here and I still find no buyer since May 2022.

This is to conclude my case with @KTuner because I strongly believe KTuner will not do anything to remedy this issue and customer support is terrible when it comes to providing fixes to major firmware issue affecting ECU from Asian countries.
 

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I have already mentioned this problem a few times in this forum and send several emails about it to Ktuner. Here are some basic facts.
Problem: There is a random knock control increase at low load part throttle cruising. While going at a steady speed at low rpm and MOSTLY under negative vacuum (-2 - 0 psi.) or 0 vacuum. Knock control starts to increase from 0.49 to 0.70s and sometimes to 0.90s.
Facts: This is NOT original ECU knock control behaviour because;
1- when it is at factory stock firmware, there is not such a problem with the same gasoline in the tank under the same weather conditions.
2- the severity of the problem differs with the initial version and beta full version.Since they are different codebases, it proves that something affects this knock control elevation problem in the firmware.
3 - Maf scaling with all voltages affects this problem both initial and beta version.
4 - it is not an octane or environmental factors problem because it was tested several times with the same octane and same weather conditions.
5 - Insisting there is not a problem with the firmware does not mean there is not a problem indeed until someone notices there really is a problem.

I used ktuner for nearly two years and thanks to it, ı have learnt a lot. It was really a good device for tuning. Fantastic throttle response, easy to use and perfect mobile software to watch the parameters. I have switched to Hondata just because of this problem.
Lastly, because of my bad luck, the transition was not smooth. My ecu has been supported by hondata for two years but it appeared that nobody noticed there was a problem with the traction control and it was pulling some timing all the time whether traction control has been selected or not. Thanks to god, they didnot insist everything is normal and they fixed it via a software update within a week.
So it means that something can come up even after years although it has been used for a long time. Please listen to your customers.
 

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Once again to explain this same scenario, the standard option is your original ECU software codebase and does not have anything modified by KTuner related to how knock control is handled. The beta version uses a different ECU software codebase. That base ECU software may have been setup slightly different from the factory by Honda, but once again KTuner doesn't modify anything related to how knock control is handled. What you're describing is not something our software adds or affects.

We aren't planning to change anything related to how knock control is handled from the factory in either version of the factory codebases that we use for your two options. If you have two options and want to start with your factory codebase choose the non-beta option. If you want to start with a more developed codebase use the beta option. Tuners have not had an issue achieving repeatable results for thousands of their international customers on either codebase, so there will be no changes made.
 

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The "problems" mentioned here can all literally be remedied by actually *tuning* the cars to suit the given operating conditions, you know...

There is nothing wrong with KTuner for the platform in terms of "knock control"; it works as intended. If you don't like seeing a rise on the value, tune accordingly or have a professional tune accordingly. The behavior you mention is literally nothing concerning, also. There are tens of thousands of L15 engines on the planet with owners that use poor quality fuel and run around with the ECU constantly riding the upper reaches of the knock control range.
 
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The "problems" mentioned here can all literally be remedied by actually *tuning* the cars to suit the given operating conditions, you know...

There is nothing wrong with KTuner for the platform in terms of "knock control"; it works as intended. If you don't like seeing a rise on the value, tune accordingly or have a professional tune accordingly. The behavior you mention is literally nothing concerning, also. There are tens of thousands of L15 engines on the planet with owners that use poor quality fuel and run around with the ECU constantly riding the upper reaches of the knock control range.
@D-RobIMW :
How come a car with stock engine, stock turbo, & K & N filter, PRL IC, PRL catless downpipe experience partial throttle knock control increase only with KTuner OTS but we don't experience this on Flashpro?

This arguement telling affected customers with general modification to use pro tuner service doesn't make sense for customers who are happy with ots calibration but concern with partial throttle knock control.

Everyone:
This issue affects ONLY specific ECU. to be fair with KTuner, all US and fully supported ECU seemed not to have this issue. Nobody knows which ECU is affected but if you were affected, sell your KTuner & switch to Flashpro.

Am I going to switch back to Flashpro? Hell yes! Once we get Flashpro re-stock in my country, I will make the switch.

@KTuner :
The partial throttle knock control increase issue is getting worst on one of our club member's car. The car was stock with only PRL cobra stock MAF, PRL IC, & PRL catless dp using 21 psi ots calibrartion. He flashed back to stock & partial throttle knock control increase issue has never come back for almost 2 months in various driving condition. He is now waiting his Flashpro to arrive because Flashpro is out of stock in pur country.

So, there is clearly problem with your platform affecting some ECU. In my case & cases I found in my country, this issue affects 37820-5AG-P83 ECU.
 


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I guess you guys aren't reading the responses that have been written here several times, or you're simply not understanding. Sorry that you don't. Best of luck with everything.
 

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Find the area in which there is knock stimulus present, and remove value from the ignition base table.

This is really, really basic tuning theory. If you're too lazy to do this, enjoy Hondata's junk.
 
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Find the area in which there is knock stimulus present, and remove value from the ignition base table.

This is really, really basic tuning theory. If you're too lazy to do this, enjoy Hondata's junk.
Done that and it didn't work.

We used dyno so we were in the right environment to replicate real driving situation. We reduced ignition in affected areas. We reduced timing by 0.5 everytime we detected knock but we stopped because the drivability was bad after the reduction went too low. We even tried combination of reducing timing, reducing stock boost, and use stock quick adjustment.

This is on Factory Base Calibration from KTuner and best quality 98 RON fuel in the country.

By the way, we wear knock headphone thing and it was real knock.

For us affected customers, Hondata is not junk. Flashpro is sold out in my country especially after many former KTuner customers found this issue and migrate to Hondata Flashpro. I did suggest affected customers here to either return back to stock and forget modifying the car, or got Hondata Flashpro.

Many users in this forum silently made that switch because they shared the same experience and now they are happy with Flashpro.

Your response and @KTuner response are expected though.

I'm here to share this experience so customers who have the same experience not to bother asking KTuner for solution but just leave the car back stock or get Hondata Flashpro if customers insist to modify the car.

For my case, I will return my car back to stock after I get 2nd hand stock downpipe in good condition. After that, I would be lucky if I could sell this KTuner V1.2 dongle.
 

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Done that and it didn't work.

We used dyno so we were in the right environment to replicate real driving situation. We reduced ignition in affected areas. We reduced timing by 0.5 everytime we detected knock but we stopped because the drivability was bad after the reduction went too low. We even tried combination of reducing timing, reducing stock boost, and use stock quick adjustment.

This is on Factory Base Calibration from KTuner and best quality 98 RON fuel in the country.

By the way, we wear knock headphone thing and it was real knock.

For us affected customers, Hondata is not junk. Flashpro is sold out in my country especially after many former KTuner customers found this issue and migrate to Hondata Flashpro. I did suggest affected customers here to either return back to stock and forget modifying the car, or got Hondata Flashpro.

Many users in this forum silently made that switch because they shared the same experience and now they are happy with Flashpro.

Your response and @KTuner response are expected though.

I'm here to share this experience so customers who have the same experience not to bother asking KTuner for solution but just leave the car back stock or get Hondata Flashpro if customers insist to modify the car.

For my case, I will return my car back to stock after I get 2nd hand stock downpipe in good condition. After that, I would be lucky if I could sell this KTuner V1.2 dongle.
My friend, don't waste your breath. No matter how hard you try, they are determined not to believe you. They think only they know shit. Our years of experience and having already tested what they advice doesn't mean anything to them. They didn't even feel the need to take a look at the datalogs we posted several times and think about it five minutes. They only tell us what we have already known and they consider themselves pro tuners.
 

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They only tell us what we have already known and they consider themselves pro tuners.
We know how the ECU works, and I have personally tuned thousands of these vehicles. I literally do this all day, every day.

If you don't want to believe me, fine. Good luck.
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